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Old 10-02-2007, 03:00 AM   #1
Richard Paul Richard Paul is offline
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Oct 2007
Thumbs up Blu-ray player profiles explained in detail

Over the last few years I have read much on the issue of Blu-ray player profiles from various insiders and websites and based on what I have read have made this thread about them. There is one Blu-ray spec and in it there are four profiles including an audio only profile that does not require BD-J or video playback since it was made only for audio playback. Leaving out the audio only profile from this thread there were three player profiles made for video playback. After October 31st of 2007 all new Blu-ray players had to meet the requirements for at least Bonus View though older Blu-ray players could continue to be sold. Here are the requirements for the three Blu-ray player profiles:

Profile 1.0:

64 KB of built in persistent memory required
no additional persistent memory capability required
no Virtual Package support for persistent memory required
no outlining support for text based subtitles required
no PiP decoding required
no secondary audio decoding required

Bonus View:

64 KB of built in persistent memory required
256 MB of persistent memory capability required
Virtual Package support for persistent memory required
outlining support for text based subtitles required
PiP decoding required
secondary audio decoding required

BD-Live:

64 KB of built in persistent memory required
1 GB of persistent memory capability required
Virtual Package support for persistent memory required
outlining support for text based subtitles required
PiP decoding required
secondary audio decoding required
internet capability required


Frequently Asked Questions (last updated March 8, 2009)

1. What are the three Blu-ray player profiles called?
In the technical documents the profiles were called Profile 1.0, Profile 1.1, and Profile 2.0. Profile 1.0 was called Grace Period Profile and Initial Standard Profile by the BDA workgroups. Profile 1.1 was called Final Standard Profile by the BDA workgroups and will be marketed as Bonus View. Profile 2.0 was called BD-Live by the BDA workgroups and will be marketed as BD-Live.

2. Why are there three Blu-ray player profiles?
All three player profiles for Blu-ray were made back at the time the Blu-ray specs were originally made. At that time it was known that to cost effectively implement certain features such as PiP decoding would require the development of new decoding chips that would be capable of dual stream video decoding. The plan was to eventually replace the Profile 1.0 specs with the Bonus View specs by requiring all new players released after a certain date to meet the requirements for Bonus View. The BD-Live specs were to be optional for those consumers who wanted to connect their Blu-ray player to the internet.

3. Is BD-J a requirement for all Blu-ray players?
Yes, all three Blu-ray player profiles require BD-J support and will be capable of normal BD-J interactivity for menus and games. Note though that certain extras might require the player to be Bonus View or BD-Live compliant if they require a feature such as PiP decoding or internet capability.

4. Should I get a Bonus View or BD-Live player?
That depends. Though stand alone Profile 1.0 players will always be capable of playing the movie itself and normal BD-J interactivity they will not be capable of certain extras such as PiP decoding. If you are interested in those extras than it would be best to choose a stand alone Blu-ray player that supports them.

5. Could a Profile 1.0 player be updated to Bonus View or BD-Live?
None of the stand alone Blu-ray players that were released before October of 2007 have the necessary hardware for that. The PS3 which did have the necessary hardware was updated to BD-Live with Firmware 2.20 on March 24 of 2008.

6. What is BD-Live Ready?
A Blu-ray player that has all of the necessary hardware for BD-Live, will initially ship with Bonus View capability, and later on will receive a firmware update for BD-Live.

7. What is PiP decoding?
This allows for a PiP (secondary) video stream to be decoded. One of the applications of this is a cast and crew commentary of the movie.

8. What is secondary audio decoding?
This allows for the mixing of two different audio tracks. For instance this allows for the audio stream included with a PiP video stream to be mixed into the primary audio stream.

9. What is persistent memory?
Persistent memory allows for the long term storage of data on the player and depending on the capabilities of the specific player can be done using built in flash memory, a hard drive, network storage, and external flash memory. All Blu-ray players are required to have at least 64 KB of built in persistent memory. The Bonus View profile requires the player to be capable of supporting at least 256 MB of persistent memory. The BD-Live profile requires the player to be capable of supporting at least 1 GB of persistent memory. For both Bonus View and BD-Live this can be done with either built in memory or with user provided memory such as a memory card or a USB flash drive. Note that all of the Bonus View players released so far can support more than 1 GB of persistent memory so in practice the only difference between Bonus View and BD-Live players has been internet capability.

10. What is Virtual Package support?
The Virtual Package allows for new content (audio/video content, audio/subtitle tracks, BD-J games, etc...) to be added to those Blu-ray titles designed to check the persistent storage of a player to see if there is any content for that title. If there is it can be added to the title through the use of new menus allowing for the seamless addition of that content.

11. What is outlining support for text based subtitles?
In addition to graphic based subtitles Blu-ray also allows for the use of text based subtitles allowing for easier control of where they are placed on the screen. This can benefit 2.35 aspect ratio display setups. Text based subtitles though when directly displayed can be hard to read so outlining support, changing their color/shading based on the background, is usually done to make it easier to read them.

12. What decoding chips are known to be capable of decoding PiP?
The Sigma Designs SMP8634 Revision C, the Panasonic UniPhier, the Broadcom BCM7440, the Horizon Hz7220, and the NEC EMMA3 are five decoding chips that are known to be capable of decoding PiP.

13. Have any Bonus View players been officially announced yet?
Yes, the following is a list of officially announced Bonus View players for North America:

Denon DVD-1800BD
Denon DVD-2500BTC
Denon DVD-3800BDCI
ezGear BluCobra
Funai NB500
Insignia NS-BRDVD
JVC TH-SB100
JVC XV-PB1
LG BH200
Magnavox NB500MG9
Marantz BD8002
Memorex MVBD-2510
Onkyo DV-BD606
Panasonic DMP-BD30
Philips BDP-7200
Pioneer Elite BDP-05FD
Pioneer Elite BDP-51FD
Samsung BD-UP5000
Sharp BD-HP21U
Sharp BD-HP50U
Sherwood BDP-5003
Sylvania NB500SL9
Yamaha BD-S2900

14. Have any BD-Live players been officially announced yet?
Yes, the following is a list of officially announced BD-Live players for North America:

Cambridge Audio 640BD
LG BD300
LG BD370
LG BD390
Oppo BDP-S83
Panasonic DMP-B15
Panasonic DMP-BD35
Panasonic DMP-BD50
Panasonic DMP-BD55
Panasonic DMP-BD60
Panasonic DMP-BD70V
Panasonic DMP-BD80
Pioneer BDP-120
Pioneer BDP-320
Pioneer Elite BDP-09FD
Pioneer Elite BDP-23FD
Playstation 3
Samsung BD-P1500
Samsung BD-P1600
Samsung BD-P2550
Samsung BD-P3600
Samsung BD-P4600
Sharp BD-HP16U
Sharp BD-HP22U
Sherwood BDP-6003
Sony BDP-S350
Sony BDP-S360
Sony BDP-S550
Sony BDP-S560
Sony BDP-S5000ES
Vizio VBR100

Last edited by Richard Paul; 03-09-2009 at 01:30 AM.
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:02 AM   #2
WriteSimply WriteSimply is offline
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Hello Richard Paul.


fuad
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:13 AM   #3
Joe Cain Joe Cain is offline
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Nice, concise, helpful. Gets my vote for sticky-ness.

I continue to hope the PS3 will be forward-compatible with 1.1 and BD-Live.
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:16 AM   #4
Porfie Porfie is offline
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Hey Richard thanks for the great info!
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:17 AM   #5
Anthony P Anthony P is offline
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good post but you missed BD audio
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:30 AM   #6
crackinhedz crackinhedz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony P View Post
good post but you missed BD audio
no...he said:

"Leaving out the audio profile from this thread there are three player profiles made for video playback."


He felt no need to discuss the audio profile, and rightly so.
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Old 10-02-2007, 01:55 PM   #7
What'sHD What'sHD is offline
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thanks for the info, Richard.

Glad you are on this forum
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Old 10-02-2007, 03:16 AM   #8
bootman bootman is offline
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Nice write up.
You can add the Samsung BD-UP5000 Duo Player.
It has been pushed back to a December release which would mean it will have to be at least a 1.1 player.
It also uses the Broadcom 7440 SoC.
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Old 10-03-2007, 10:36 PM   #9
Richard Paul Richard Paul is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman View Post
Nice write up.
You can add the Samsung BD-UP5000 Duo Player.
It has been pushed back to a December release which would mean it will have to be at least a 1.1 player.
It also uses the Broadcom 7440 SoC.
Samsung has not yet officially announced whether the Samsung BD-UP5000 will be BD-Video 1.1 or BD-Live compliant so I would prefer to wait until they officially announce what it will be before adding it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony P View Post
good post but you missed BD audio
I briefly mentioned the audio only profile of Blu-ray in the initial paragraph and from the little I have heard it does not require BD-J or video playback. Considering that there is little information about it and considering that there are no players/discs announced for it yet I would prefer to keep the thread about the three Blu-ray video profiles to keep things as simple and clear as possible. I don't mind adding though a short descriptive sentence on the audio only profile in the initial paragraph.


Quote:
Originally Posted by McBain View Post
That is a good FAQ on Blu-ray and though certain parts of it are a bit out of date, such as the paragraph on Total Hi Def, it did list an offically announced BD-Video 1.1 player that I didn't know about (the Marantz BD8002).
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Old 10-04-2007, 03:42 PM   #10
JimboTHX1138 JimboTHX1138 is offline
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I see you have this as a sticky over at AVS. Good work.

I vote for it to be a sticky here too.
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Old 10-21-2007, 02:26 AM   #11
Richard Paul Richard Paul is offline
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Updated information to include information on outlining support for text based subtitles.
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Old 10-21-2007, 01:04 PM   #12
SolidBlu SolidBlu is offline
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thanks a lot Richard Paul, you're the man!
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Old 10-21-2007, 04:26 PM   #13
Seretur Seretur is offline
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Indeed -- thank you for this, Richard!
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Old 10-24-2007, 10:46 PM   #14
bootman bootman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post
Samsung has not yet officially announced whether the Samsung BD-UP5000 will be BD-Video 1.1 or BD-Live compliant so I would prefer to wait until they officially announce what it will be before adding it.
Its official.

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/home-ente...ing-314480.php
http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-980...g=2547-1_3-0-5
Are you sitting too far from your new 1080p HDTV?
Curious about player profiles? Click here.
My humble HT set up:
Display: HL61A750
Audio: Pioneer SC 1522K
Blu: DMP-BD100
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Old 10-24-2007, 11:41 PM   #15
Richard Paul Richard Paul is offline
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I have added the Samsung BD-UP5000 to the BD-Video 1.1 list and for anyone interested it will be available at retail around mid to late December and will receive a firmware update adding BD-Video 1.1 functionality at the end of January in 2008.
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Old 11-28-2007, 03:21 AM   #16
Richard Paul Richard Paul is offline
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Oct 2007
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Updated the terminology used for the Blu-ray player profiles and added a paragraph explaining the names that have been used for them.
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Old 11-28-2007, 04:22 PM   #17
kjack kjack is offline
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You should add the Panasonic chip to the SoC list in #10.

Does the NEC EMM3 chip support BD?
Keith Jack
Sigma Designs
BD decoder supplier
Blog: http://www.keithjack.net
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Old 01-13-2008, 02:56 PM   #18
AbsentAbe AbsentAbe is offline
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Thank you! Very informative!
Westinghouse 37" 1080p Monitor - Model: LVM-37w3
Samsung 1400 Blu-ray Disc Player - Firmware ver.1.9
Panasonic SA-BX500 Receiver
Front Loudspeaker - Sharp CP-7700, x2
Center Loudspeaker - Optimus Pro-CS511
Surround/Rear Loudspeaker - KLH AV1001B, x2
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Old 03-01-2008, 12:30 AM   #19
CDN Mike CDN Mike is offline
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Default Nice Post! Well laid out and clear! Thanks!

Your synopsis of the various BD profiles is well laid out and clear! "Thanks".

CDN Mike

Blu-Ray's owned: 7
Sharp Aquos LC42D62U
Sharp Aquos BDHP20U
Yamaha RXV2700 (7.1 Receiver)
PSB Alpha & Image Speakers
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Old 10-21-2008, 11:07 PM   #20
bone 15 bone 15 is offline
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Can anyone help me with the audio capabilities of the panasonic dmp-bd50k v.s. the dmp-bd 55k, and the onkyo dv-bd60 and wich is the most advanced unit available?
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