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Old 12-15-2017, 06:27 PM   #3501
2-J 2-J is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit Tajomaru View Post
I would be happier with no release than a dub only release.
So you would deny others the chance to have something they'd love because you can't get what you want? Nice




And on the whole 'anime is a niche thing so SC should know their market' 'anime buyers prefer subs', I think Studio Ghibli releases are the closest that anime releases come to transcending that along with a few other select titles. They don't just sell Ghibli releases to 'anime fans'. And yeah in the UK overall, most definitely, Ghibli cinema releases tend to be in dub as well.
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Old 12-15-2017, 07:04 PM   #3502
Shingster Shingster is offline
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2-J, I can't decide whether you are a simpleton or you're deliberately being obtuse, or you simply don't understand the anime industry and its distribution here in the west. Who says anything about work going unreleased? Can you not grasp the basic fact that if Studio Canal doesn't distribute it someone else will and they will most likely do a better job? Or do you really think Ronja would simply pass us by were Studio Canal not around to rescue it and put it on DVD/Blu-ray for us? Are you even a fan of the medium? This isn't decades-old cult cinema we're talking about here, it's a high-budget, high-profile TV series co-produced by the best known animation house in the world outside of Disney, Pixar and Dreamworks.

Everything else you've been stating in this thread is just flat out wrong, which again goes back to my simpleton/ignorant question. As someone who has seen a number of anime works in the cinema over the past couple of years, it's always been screened in both Japanese and English in the case of the big, big releases like Studio Ghibli works, or simply Japanese only in the case of lesser-scale releases.

Once again I have to reiterate: This is 2017 and anime of all forms (Films, TV Shows, OVAs, Games, hundreds of titles every god damn year) is distributed in both the original language and with a relevant English dub as standard by EVERY other distributor that deals in the medium. Studio Canal are so ****ing stupid that they take these excellent masters from Studio Ghibli and then nuke them with DNR or fudge up the gamma - ALL AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE - before releasing them for UK punters. But hey, you remain grateful to them 2-J, they've obviously earned any consumer loyalty they can get!

I am opn to the possibility that there might be some form of snafu in getting the rights to the Japanese dialogue now that posters have reported ovther European territories appear to have the same issue, but if that is the case then Studio Canal should make a statement informing the fans of such a wrangle. If it's out of their hands then we would accept it, but remaining silent on the issue allows noone to come to any type of informed understanding.

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Originally Posted by aewb View Post
Also when did it become acceptable on this site to make comments like "the complete rape of the original work" or refer to Japanese people as "Japs"?
Well, the first part refers to me so I have to ask: What the hell is wrong with that sentence and how can anyone sane of mind possibly be offended by it? You do understand that the word "rape" can be used in a non-sexual context, don't you?

Last edited by Shingster; 12-15-2017 at 07:13 PM.
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Old 12-15-2017, 07:13 PM   #3503
2-J 2-J is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingster View Post
2-J, are you a simpleton or are you deliberately being obtuse, or do you just not understand the anime industry and its distribution here in the west? Who says anything about work going unreleased? Can you not grasp the basic fact that if Studio Canal doesn't distribute it someone else will and they will most likely do a better job? Or do you really think Ronja would simply pass us by were Studio Canal not around to rescue it and put it on DVD/Blu-ray for us?
Some anime I've been interested in has either gone unreleased in the UK entirely or has missed out on a blu ray release in the UK (as opposed to dvd) because it wasn't an economically viable proposition and a major part of that is licensing costs. Obviously, Ronja is attractive to license as it's Ghibli but on the other hand there are certain costs involved no matter who picks it up. Whoever picks it up has to make their money back. It seems reasonable to believe (and I am not the only one saying this) that there may be high licensing costs to include the Japanese audio. So it's not as simple as someone else would have picked it up and released it in the UK (or, if they had, whether they could have made the numbers work to include the Japanese audio).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingster View Post
As someone who has seen a number of anime works in the cinema over the past couple of years, it's always been screened in both Japanese and English in the case of the big, big releases like Studio Ghibli works, or simply Japanese only in the case of lesser-scale releases.
Yes, with Ghibli cinema releases you can hunt down a Japanese screening, no doubt, I am aware of that, but most screenings have been dubs. I'm not talking about other anime releases I was only making a point about Ghibli ones.
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Old 12-15-2017, 09:46 PM   #3504
Bandit Tajomaru Bandit Tajomaru is offline
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Why does the German Ronja Blu-ray have Japanese audio and subtitles available? I noticed the Germans are also selling Ronja for more money than what Studio Canal is trying to. Looks like Studio Canal just wanted to sell this set as a cheap babysitter for the soccer moms.
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Old 12-16-2017, 12:10 AM   #3505
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Also to paint Studio Canal as some sort of impoverished distributor who can't afford to invest in a Japanese audio track is beyond idiocy. As an outfit they are probably twice the size of all the other UK anime labels combined and yet MangaUK and Anime Limited have never once released a flm or TV show in English only.you also can't argue that this is some ultra-obscure, niche, cult, low-profile property, it's one of the biggest TV releases of the last five years, they brought in Gillian Anderson to do the dub ffs!

And no 2-J I am not mistaken on theatrical releases of Anime in this country. More often than not they are available in Japanese in some screening or the other. "Most of the screenings" of Ghibli releases across the country were most certainly not dubs and I was not talking solely about Ghibli releases. How many of us got to watch Your Name in Japanese not too long back? You don't believe me? read the theatrical slate of Anime Limited. How in the world could they afford to release so many films in Japanese and English I wonder?

I will state this again and hopefully not get scoffed at again like last time: In this day and age, to release ANY anime propterty without both Japanese and English audio options is a horrible outlier, not normal practice in any way, shape or form.

Last edited by Shingster; 12-16-2017 at 04:11 AM.
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Old 12-16-2017, 04:46 AM   #3506
2-J 2-J is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingster View Post
Also to paint Studio Canal as some sort of impoverished distributor who can't afford to invest in a Japanese audio track is beyond idiocy. As an outfit they are probably twice the size of all the other UK anime labels combined and yet MangaUK and Anime Limited have never once released a flm or TV show in English only.you also can't argue that this is some ultra-obscure, niche, cult, low-profile property, it's one of the biggest TV releases of the last five years, they brought in Gillian Anderson to do the dub ffs!
It's not about how big or rich they are. It's about whether they (or anyone else) can make the numbers work, i.e. can reasonably expect to turn a profit on the release. Taking into account the (probably) high licensing costs and the (relatively, compared to other countries) lower price the UK market can bear and lower numbers overall compared to a market like the USA.

I know of examples where the US (and German) markets have been able to bear multiple volumes for a series but the UK has only been able to support a single volume release or has missed out on a series either the blu ray edition or entirely. We have the example of Sweden for Ronja where it's local language only, suggesting high licensing costs. The case of Germany - which does have the Japanese language - appears to be the baseline and to buy Ronja there it not only costs a LOT more than you can get it for in the UK, you have to buy individual volumes (less attractive than getting the set in one).



Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingster View Post
And no 2-J I am not mistaken on theatrical releases of Anime in this country. More often than not they are available in Japanese in some screening or the other. "Most of the screenings" of Ghibli releases across the country were most certainly not dubs and I was not talking solely about Ghibli releases. How many of us got to watch Your Name in Japanese not too long back? You don't believe me? read the theatrical slate of Anime Limited. How in the world could they afford to release so many films in Japanese and English I wonder?
I am talking about Ghibli releases as I'm making the point they're a special case not like other anime, in terms of having a wider appeal beyond 'anime fans' who consider anime in English a 'rape' and would rather nobody get a release unless they can have their subs. And if you think the majority of Ghibli cinema screenings have been subbed in the UK you are very mistaken. Several of the films got mainstream releases almost wholly in dub.
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Old 12-16-2017, 05:31 AM   #3507
Shingster Shingster is offline
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Once again you are twisting the words to suit your argument:

1. Profits smofits, you look at OTHER anime releases, I feel like i'm bashing my head against a brick wall here so I'm just going to caps-lock it out: THIS IS 2017! THIS IS NOT THE FIRST EXPENSIVE ANIME PROPERTY TO EVER BE DISTRIBUTED IN THE UK. THIS IS NOT THE FIST STUDIO GHIBLI RELEASE STUDIO CANAL HAVE BOTCHED. If smaller labels can relase numerous properties just as costly, just as high profile in both English and Japanese and can continue to stay in business, then THE biggest label distributing anime in the UK has got NO excuse. None whatsoever.

2. No-one has ever said anime in english is a "rape", what a truly facile observation. People seriously need to re-read my comment and THINK (this is in fact the only issue that has me annoyed here, as if I would ever denigrate English dubs as a choice on an anime viewer's part! ). I'm saying distributing it in ENGLISH ONLY is a rape of the original work, because the original Japanese dialogue is not there. It is FORCING a foreign dub on people and not offering CHOICE, which is the point we complainers are trying to make. If they had released Ronja in Japanese only with no english track I would be slagging off the realease almost as much, BUT WHEN YOU DISTRIBUTE FOREIGN CINEMA IN THE UK YOU HAVE A DUTY TO PRESENT THE WORK IN ITS ORIGINAL FORM. Otherwise you completely compromise the entire point of the entire endeavour.

3. I'm not mistaken on any Ghibli film in the last 7yrs at the very least because I have physically been to the showings, and I do not live in a cosmopolitan part of the UK, I'm based in Birmingham where if you can count to twenty you can probably keep tabs of the number of foreign-language films screened in multiplexes each year, but in the last few years Anime has really emerged as vibrant part of that limited foreign-language scene via multiplex cinemas. Every ghibli title since Arriety has played on multiple cinemas near me in both Japanese and English.

Last edited by Shingster; 12-16-2017 at 05:48 AM.
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Old 12-16-2017, 12:33 PM   #3508
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Quote:
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I would add the proviso that the majority of Northern Irish cinemas don't show anime so those that do are catering for fans.
True and that's the nature of anime, it's a niche film genre in the Uk again that's why studio canal should have been doing the same with this release if possible.

Last edited by deschain; 12-16-2017 at 01:52 PM.
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Old 12-16-2017, 12:48 PM   #3509
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Quote:
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Treys and that's the nature of anime, it's a niche film genre in the Uk again that's why studio canal should have been doing the same with this release if possible.
Don't get me wrong, I completely agree. The original audio should always be included. Always.
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Old 12-17-2017, 08:03 AM   #3510
2-J 2-J is offline
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This will probably be my last post on this subject - probably boring most people by now I'm sure -

I do feel a lot of the outrage at this SC Ronja release is based on a gut reaction to seeing an English only release, in some cases fuelled by the zeal of a fan who would go so far as wishing there was no release at all, even one others could enjoy, rather than one with just English (I am sorry, that sentiment is just plain mean).

When you actually examine the facts, whatever you conclude from these (and I think it *is* reasonable to at least be very suspicious of SC based on the facts. I'm not saying this is a clear cut issue), the picture is surely more nuanced. On the one hand, some high value licenses have been successfully handled by UK anime distributors. On the other hand, sometimes UK companies can't find a way to make UK releases work profitably, or can't make them work on blu ray. So we've missed out on certain series completely or have missed out on them on blu ray. And, it must be taken into account that Ghibli releases have a far broader appeal than almost any other anime release out there.

The case of Sweden shows that SC isn't the only company that has opted for a single-language release of Ronja. The case of Germany shows that the Ghibli will let you have the Japanese language on blu ray if you are prepared to release it in separate volumes and charge 30 euros or whatever per volume. (Would the UK market support that? For something that's aimed at young children? For something that's been criticised for its CGI? Etc) (although I should add, even then, maybe they can sell more units in Germany as well, that needs to be taken into account. if a US release emerged somewhat cheaper than the German one but with Japanese language, this might be to do with them selling more copies overall. Case in point, look at how recently the Ghibli releases have been superior in the US, to the UK, in terms of release date and features despite not being substantially more expensive).

As for Studio Canal overall as I said I have a positive opinion of them, I have been able to obtain the complete Ghibli library on blu ray at a good price, conveniently, with mostly decent extras, packaging etc. Including Ocean Waves, they really went up in my eyes after that, we got that in the UK even though Australia passed on it, yes we got a worse release than the USA but that is no doubt down to money at the end of the day... commercial reality. Which some people find hard to accept or just insist on ignoring.
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Old 12-17-2017, 03:02 PM   #3511
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As I’ve said, I would have liked the Japanese audio with English subs on the UK release of Ronja, and was disappointed it didn’t include that... but I think some of the reactions here are a bit over the top, especially for something some people haven’t even watched in any form.

I think 2-J makes a number of good points. I think the situation is not necessarily as simple as ‘SC are lazy/lame/thoughtless’. The evidence as I see it points clearly to a commercial decision that the cost of releasing Ronja with Japanese audio and English subs outweighed what SC thought they could make enough money on. Sadly, Blu-ray is already somewhat niche. Anime is somewhat niche. Kids’ anime is somewhat niche. Even Ghibli fans are saying they weren’t watching this because of a pre-conceived reaction to CG modelled character animation. So it’s a product aimed at a niche of a niche of a niche of a niche. I was semi-surprised it got a physical release here at all, let alone on BD.

As such, and although I lament the lack of original audio, I can understand why SC may not have thought it would be viable to include it.

But we’re all just guessing until there’s some sort of official info on why this happened exactly. Which is why some of the outrage is a little over the top, IMHO.
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Old 12-17-2017, 03:31 PM   #3512
Bandit Tajomaru Bandit Tajomaru is offline
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Probably comes down to English subtitles doesn't exist for Ronja and that they are to lazy and cheap to subtitle it. I guess we can ask Madman if the Australian release that is coming out in March will also be dubbed only. It looks like it is just a mirror of the UK release. You do release a bad cheap release of Ronja sabotages any chance of a proper release of it in the future. Oh, well the subtitled version is available on illegal streaming sites if anybody really wants to see the unmolested version.

Last edited by Bandit Tajomaru; 12-17-2017 at 06:48 PM.
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Old 12-17-2017, 04:22 PM   #3513
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I think you guys need to calm down. The series sucks anyway and having Japanese audio isn’t going to make it any better.
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Old 12-17-2017, 04:57 PM   #3514
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outrage is just another opinion, it's a forum! Let people have their opinions.

Has anyone tried contacting studio canal to ask about the exclusion of Jap audio? We can guess til we're blue in the face but it'd be very interesting to know the truth from them.

An annoying thing is Studio canal have made lots of little errors over the years with the ghibli products which come off as lazy like the numbering thing, inconsistencies in the spines with the silver banner levels, some using characters on the spines others don't, the spirited away bluray cover is a bit of a mess with chihiro half outlined and half not just little things like this are just sloppy and so easily fixed. Recently the previous 3 Deluxe bluray editions I bought which you had to tear or disassemble the card just to get them open as the outer casing didn't fit, then there's the Nausicaa Uk bluray that's been embarrassingly DNR'd to death, I'm sure that's a sin on here which can't be forgiven lol. I also own a couple of the double play editions which have poor print quality on the slip case. Just feels like a bit of a shame when studio canals/Optimum's releases are generally great products compared to other countries. Seems like Gkids have taken the title of best release outside of Japan.

I know this is another financial issue but I thought it was a bit poor for them to release double play versions of the older films with the original old poor transfer on the DVD included where as in Japan they re-released them on DVD with new transfers which look amazing for DVD.
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Old 12-17-2017, 05:49 PM   #3515
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deschain View Post
outrage is just another opinion, it's a forum! Let people have their opinions.
Sure, but no-one is denying anyone an opinion. An opinion on an opinion is just as valid as an opinion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by deschain View Post
Has anyone tried contacting studio canal to ask about the exclusion of Jap audio? We can guess til we're blue in the face but it'd be very interesting to know the truth from them.
I e-mailed them last week, haven’t had a reply yet though.
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Old 12-17-2017, 06:10 PM   #3516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Porco Azzurro View Post
Sure, but no-one is denying anyone an opinion. An opinion on an opinion is just as valid as an opinion.
Yeah but when opinions start to be on opinions of another opinions opinion they're not really about the topic of discussion anymore :P hahaha

All jokes aside I'd say here is no one showing too much rage, anger or outrage on here as I can relate people's feelings of frustration on a crap product.
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Old 01-21-2018, 06:27 PM   #3517
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If anyone's interested here is the Madman.com.au's 25% off code; I intend to use it for the re-released Hayao Miyazaki box set but it's very silly of Madman Entertainment to take that off from the listing (went OOS on around Jan 3rd or 4th) on Madman.com.au and yet keeping it live on madman.co.nz which doesn't offer interntional shipping.

Here's the code.

1712B2GR

Mind you ,it will not work with pre-order items such as upcoming 30th Anniv. collectors editn of Laputa: Castle in the Sky but already released ones for ex- 25th Anni edit. of Kiki's Delivery Service .

P.S- Hope its not an account/user specifc code!
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Old 02-17-2018, 04:43 PM   #3518
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Scored this great deal on Hayao Miyazaki Collection AU box set @ eBay a few days back and it arrived now.. Couldn't have asked it for more
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Old 02-17-2018, 11:41 PM   #3519
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Scored this great deal on Hayao Miyazaki Collection AU box set @ eBay a few days back and it arrived now.. Couldn't have asked it for more
Thats a Fantastic Deal On the Madman Set
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Old 02-18-2018, 12:15 AM   #3520
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikezilla2 View Post
Thats a Fantastic Deal On the Madman Set
I wanted to buy the 2017 re-release on their shop but unsure why it was withdrawn from AU website but still available on NZ. With the code I posted above ,the 2017 re-release would have been at AU$ 248 (25% off +AU VAT excl) incl. of shipping but it was taken down soon after that 25% deal started . Anyways I have this set now and it was one of the best deals I've got in recent days.
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