DIY Speaker Building, Repairing, & Upgrading

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

I am leaning toward cherry as they match the wood floor better. Look at the last two pictures in my post #176. Which driver do you think is more attractive? I like the Fostex white drivers better.

The Fostex stand out more visually . I do think that will even be more so when you stain them . I like the idea of the Blending with the floor . That will make them stand out even more .

[kareface]

I was doing a little reading, what are your thoughts on a setup like this?

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...udspeaker.html

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by kareface

I was doing a little reading, what are your thoughts on a setup like this?

http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...udspeaker.html

I hate passive crossovers as much as the person in the link. It appears that technology of passive crossovers go back to the early 1900's.

I love the looks and performance of line array speakers. The good news is that Audio Nirvana now makes 12" and 15" full-range drivers.

[kareface]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

I hate passive crossovers as much as the person in the link. It appears that technology of passive crossovers go back to the early 1900's.

I love the looks and performance of line array speakers. The good news is that Audio Nirvana now makes 12" and 15" full-range drivers.

Good to know.

[stcurell]

I'm looking into the Parts Express Tritrix kit, is there a thread on these?

Anybody build this kit or have an opinion on it?

I was thinking of using a pair for my computer 2.1 setup.

LINK:
$215 shipped transmission line MTM kit

Any other suggestions for an easy beginner MTM kit? I don't really want to do the woodwork since I don't have a table or miter saw, just a hand held circular and a jig saw. Also I don't have a router.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by stcurell

I'm looking into the Parts Express Tritrix kit, is there a thread on these?

Anybody build this kit or have an opinion on it?

I was thinking of using a pair for my computer 2.1 setup.

LINK:
$215 shipped transmission line MTM kit

Any other suggestions for an easy beginner MTM kit? I don't really want to do the woodwork since I don't have a table or miter saw, just a hand held circular and a jig saw. Also I don't have a router.

To the best of my knowledge, I don't believe any of our members have built the TriTrix kit. If you look at the bottom of the page you linked, you will find two videos by Parts Express that demonstrate how to build the cabinets and the crossovers.

If you want ready-made painted cabinets, then pick one the options below:

http://www.parts-express.com/wizards...TOKEN=16363121

http://www.occamaudio.com/shop.html

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=35

http://www.parts-express.com/wizards...omo=&srchAttr=

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=178

[jaeelarr]

So I have yet another "upgrade" question.

I have Wharfedale 9.2's and was wondering what woud happen if I switched out the mid/bass driver with one of their other drivers (true woofer). Would it sound like poop? Improved bass response with/without a compromise?

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by jaeelarr

So I have yet another "upgrade" question.

I have Wharfedale 9.2's and was wondering what woud happen if I switched out the mid/bass driver with one of their other drivers (true woofer). Would it sound like poop? Improved bass response with/without a compromise?

Make sure you change the drivers of both right and left speakers. Also pick drivers that have approximately the same crossover frequency tolerance as the old ones because you are not replacing the passive crossovers. Over the years, many people have replaced their damaged drivers or drivers of their vintage speakers with different drivers. There is no guarantee that the new drivers will sound better, but I am absolutely certain that they will sound better than poop.

[jaeelarr]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

Make sure you change the drivers of both right and left speakers. Also pick drivers that have approximately the same crossover frequency tolerance as the old ones because you are not replacing the passive crossovers. Over the years, many people have replaced their damaged drivers or drivers of their vintage speakers with different drivers. There is no guarantee that the new drivers will sound better, but I am absolutely certain that they will sound better than poop.

LOL....fair enough.

I should probably just leave them be. I have a feeling I will lose some of the mids by putting in the other woofers.

[Beerserker]

I would leave them be, for sure. Not that I have intimate knowledge of Wharfedale's drivers or crossover designs, but swapping the mid-bass driver for a standard woofer in a two way is almost guaranteed to sound assy. Just a guess, but it's almost certain that you will have a dip in output in the midrange, or a lot of distortion there as the woofer response breaks up. You could potentially tweak the crossover to compensate some to bring the tweet in a bit earlier, if it's FR allows. The woofer would also need to extend high enough, (cleanly) to integrate with the tweet, and you would still have to cut it off earlier then the mid-bass most likely, meaning more crossover tweaks. It would require know-how and experience that only a good designer has.

Usually when someone swaps drivers out on retail speakers, they are just copying what a good designer has already pioneered. Anything else is just a shot in the dark, with little chance of improvement. But if you are adventurous, and have money to burn then you could give it a shot.

I'd just pair the speakers with a sub, and call it good. There are plenty of cheap designs you could build from scratch if you have the itch to. It is very rewarding.

I would love to hear your folded LF horn loudspeakers, as I have not heard 8" back-folded LF horn loudspeakers (only larger PA-type boxes in the 70-80s). They look like the Madisound Fostex BK-16 Kits I am about to order. I plan to use higher-power pro. (co-axial) drivers. Anyone post FR curves on these? thanks, Dave Audio Engr.

[kareface]

I posted this info in another thread, but I'm going to repeat it here for those that might miss the post in the near future:

"The Puget Sound! DIY Speaker Contest" is once again being sponsored by the Pacific Northwest Audio Society (PNWAS) and will be held on Saturday, August 28th. In the coming days and weeks, I'll be posting information as to location, rules and how to enter. The event is free for attendees, although there is an entry fee for contestants to help defray costs of the facility rental.

If you're interested in DIY speaker building, or just Audio, this is a great way to meet and connect with others that are of a like mind. Come for an hour, or spend all day, it's interesting and a whole lot of fun. While spectators aren't allowed in the evaluation/judging room, we usually have an similar, or nearly exact, system set up in a separate area, in order that the public can listen to the various entries.

If you're new to speaker building, this is a chance to talk to the contestants about speaker design and Audio in general. I believe that you'll be astonished by the quality of sound that these home-built speakers are capable of.

If you have been working on a speaker design that you'd like to enter, this contest may serve as an incentive to finish it up. In the past, all entries have received a printout of the frequency response of their speaker as well as being able to talk to real experts and audio professionals."The Puget Sound! DIY Speaker Contest" is once again being sponsored by the Pacific Northwest Audio Society (PNWAS) and will be held on Saturday, August 28th. In the coming days and weeks, I'll be posting information as to location, rules and how to enter. The event is free for attendees, although there is an entry fee for contestants to help defray costs of the facility rental.

If you're interested in DIY speaker building, or just Audio, this is a great way to meet and connect with others that are of a like mind. Come for an hour, or spend all day, it's interesting and a whole lot of fun. While spectators aren't allowed in the evaluation/judging room, we usually have an similar, or nearly exact, system set up in a separate area, in order that the public can listen to the various entries.

If you're new to speaker building, this is a chance to talk to the contestants about speaker design and Audio in general. I believe that you'll be astonished by the quality of sound that these home-built speakers are capable of.

If you have been working on a speaker design that you'd like to enter, this contest may serve as an incentive to finish it up. In the past, all entries have received a printout of the frequency response of their speaker as well as being able to talk to real experts and audio professionals.

I'll be in attendance, it would be cool to see some others off of the forums as well.

[ltcharles]

sorry for posting here but for some reason i cant start a new thread.

Ok so I read and learned a great deal.

I was wondeing if anyone knows what diy kit contains 4 speakers for a center channel?

I love the Zaph Audio kits but i only see one kit for center but I would like to build something like the RC-64 from Klipch.

Also is a diy solution better quality than buying name brand like polk, JBL, and so on?

Please let me know what I can do. My budget for a center is 400 bucks.

Again i want a big center so I fill my 60in tv stand.

Plus the wife wants something like the RC-64 but she wants to build it herself LOL.


Oh and in case i didnt introduce myself before I am Charles and the wife is Melissa.

thanks for you help.

[Big Daddy]

A couple of months ago, I sent my Fostex full-range drivers for my DIY speakers (see Post #116 and Post #176) to Decware for an upgrade. Steve Deckart at Decware sells upgraded Fostex drivers and upgrades the Fostex 206E drivers for $100 a pair. They came back after a couple of weeks and they sound smoother and more enjoyable. These are the pictures with the stock versus upgraded drivers.

The Original Driver





The Upgraded Driver

The main upgrades that he performed and the benefits are summarized below. You can also check the links at the end for more detailed information.

Active phase guide
Besides damping the frame and some minor cone treatments, the biggest modification to the original Fostex driver was the phase guide that was installed in place of the dust cap.

Our new High Definition Tower speakers are using a modified Fostex full range driver, model FE206E. A respectable sounding driver in it's stock form, a giant killer with the proper modifications. It comes stock with a whizzer cone and vented dustcap. On more expensive speakers that reproduce mid and high frequencies it's common to find what is typically called a "phase plug" located in place of the dust cap. The bullet shape of the plug is designed to reduce the inherent phase cancellations that occur between the dust cap and speaker cone. By reducing the phasing issues at these higher frequencies it is possible to improve and flatten frequency response. From a more subjective perspective it helps add depth and clarity to the sound stage with less beaming.

Active suspension system
The original FE206EM used an inverted roll cloth surround that is attached to the under side of the speaker cone. The cloth is treated, but not air tight making it impossible to create a truly sealed diaphragm between the inside and outside of the speaker cabinet. The cloth has the advantage of being low mass, strong, and quick. It offers no damping like butyl rubber but then butyl rubber is high mass, less strong, and slow.

We have added a specially matched positive roll polyether foam surround to the top of the cone, while leaving the existing inverted cloth surround in-tact. This creates a more linear resistance on the cone in both directions.

The suspension system also offers tighter bass control and enhances low frequency power handling by a notable amount.

Cone treatments
We use a polyacrylic diluted with water and apply it to the cone under a high rotation. As the cone gets wet the fibers expand and the top layer of fibers are re-animated and brushed in the direction of the rotation. When the moisture evaporates from the cone, the polyacrylic encapsulated fibers are locked into position. The reason we do this is to remove the stress locked into the paper cone when it is pressed. The untreated cone is glass smooth to the touch while the treated cone has lost the gloss and developed a subtle texture. The improvement you hear in the sound of the paper itself when rubbed also shows up in the timbre of instruments and voices. A final benefit this cone mod brings is a stronger cone and one that is less effected by changing humidity.

Other tweaks
The basket has felt lined spokes behind the cone, and each spoke is also dampened on the outside with viceoelastic foam pads. There is also a small 1/2 inch square pad added to the back side of the cone opposite the lead wires to offset the mass of the lead wires and damp ringing from the neck joint.

Listening tests
When you listen to a 1kHZ reference sine wave on the FE206EM it sounds like any other decent driver would, but when you listen to a 1kHz sine on the DFR-8, it actually has tone, sounding more like an instrument than an oscillator. This was a rare observation made during testing. In the listening room, the driver is far smoother with noticeably better top end. The focus is better, and the sound projects better as opposed to sounding like some of the sound is coming out of the speaker cabinet itself. The ability of the cabinet to disappear has greatly improved.

For additional information, check the following links.

Fostex Driver Upgrade:
http://www.decware.com/paper79.htm

Phase Guide:
http://www.decware.com/paper46.htm

[crazyBLUE]

So the upgrade sounds like it was more than worth doing . It is an impressive read as to what they did in the upgrading & how they went about it . Thanks for the post Big Daddy , Will be useful in the future

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by crazyBLUE

So the upgrade sounds like it was more than worth doing . It is an impressive read as to what they did in the upgrading & how they went about it . Thanks for the post Big Daddy , Will be useful in the future

I am a bit crazy like you. If there is a chance for an upgrade, I will do it. I believe the drivers sound smoother now and a little warmer. Steve Deckert has detailed information and frequency graphs in his links.

[crazyBLUE]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

I am a bit crazy like you. If there is a chance for an upgrade, I will do it. I believe the drivers sound smoother now and a little warmer. Steve Deckert has detailed information and frequency graphs in his links.

I will check them out . You are not crazy ~ I am crazy ~~~~ OK we are both crazy

[Istoc]

I have decided to slowly procure the parts and lay a design to atleast attempt my own speakers. Nothing too fancy. Thus far I have a FT17H Horn Tweeter(To be mounted above my mid and low range woofers in the enclosure) with a R80B Attenuator for dB adjustments and a Clarity Cap 1.5mfd SA Range Capacitor. To you who know what your doing with the custom build I am going to be building them to be a full range speaker for music and HT use. I plan to design the baffle spaces and enclosure by myself but I might need help with the crossovers etc so I don't forget something and fry a component.

Thus far in life(21yrs old) I have only owned Prefab Speakers, and not necessarily the highest end, Thus far my Boston Horizon 450 speakers are easily my favorite listening speakers for music and also do fairly well in HT applications. But I want something I can officially call mine ya know? I have experience with car audio up to this point installs. Using Baffles to create a deeper freq range. I've also put together sub systems, I have one I'm not running right now that is a Pyle Mono Block D 400W RMS, Rockford Fosgate 1FD Capacitor and Custom enclosure for a Alpine Type-R 10".

In other words....Long winded I know....Looking for advice and input. I was thinking a Super Tweeter(FT17H) Soft Tweeter Mid cone and Bass cone.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by Istoc

I have decided to slowly procure the parts and lay a design to atleast attempt my own speakers. Nothing too fancy. Thus far I have a FT17H Horn Tweeter(To be mounted above my mid and low range woofers in the enclosure) with a R80B Attenuator for dB adjustments and a Clarity Cap 1.5mfd SA Range Capacitor. To you who know what your doing with the custom build I am going to be building them to be a full range speaker for music and HT use. I plan to design the baffle spaces and enclosure by myself but I might need help with the crossovers etc so I don't forget something and fry a component.

Thus far in life(21yrs old) I have only owned Prefab Speakers, and not necessarily the highest end, Thus far my Boston Horizon 450 speakers are easily my favorite listening speakers for music and also do fairly well in HT applications. But I want something I can officially call mine ya know? I have experience with car audio up to this point installs. Using Baffles to create a deeper freq range. I've also put together sub systems, I have one I'm not running right now that is a Pyle Mono Block D 400W RMS, Rockford Fosgate 1FD Capacitor and Custom enclosure for a Alpine Type-R 10".

In other words....Long winded I know....Looking for advice and input. I was thinking a Super Tweeter(FT17H) Soft Tweeter Mid cone and Bass cone.

If you are going to use the Fostex super tweeter, I suggest that you use it with a Fostex full-range driver. A full-range driver does not need any crossovers and for the super tweeter, all you need is a capacitor to block out the lower frequencies. The Fostex full-rage drivers can go down to 50Hz-70Hz. Optionally, you can use a spearate subwoofer for the ultra low frequencies. That is what I do and the results are excellent. As far as the cabinet is concerned, you can use a standard bass reflex cabinet, folded horn, or open baffle. Open baffle is the simplest of the three. The Fostex full-range driver is pretty flexible and can work with all three cabinets.

[Istoc]

Hmm. I was kind of thinking of building cabinets to hold a speaker for each range. High range(Super Tweeter or Soft Dome, This one depends on the harshness of Super Tweeters. I tend to like warmer detailed softer sounds vs. harsh super clear sound.) Mid range Vocals and most instrumentals(Was thinking a Speakscan 4" Driver at 8 Ohm) and a Low range for freqs down to about 47-55hz(I have a sub to fill in the rumble I just want clarity as low as most modern music goes, This would probably be filled by a Full Range Speaker)

Something in me leans towards the having a speaker per sound range for clarity sakes.Again speaking preference not knowledge. Also can you explain the idea behind a Passive Radiator Cone? My bostons have these 6 1/2" and full range 5 1/4" active cones?


Also what is the possibility of running a 4ohm Midrange and still creating an 8ohm speaker....Odd I know...