Receiver shut down on Dark Knight Rises

[victortubeman]

Originally Posted by wormraper

on topic, i still stand by my original statement, with the MASSIVE dynamic range of TDKR's it's overloading the reciever. That panny had the same issue in many of the complaints. it some heavy duty DTS-HD MA tracks it'll trip the circuits and shut down. it's really as simple as that. could it be something else? probably but not likely, it could be a bad circuit that's tripping accidentally, but TDKR is definitely a stress test on ones receiver...

Agreed,AVR is tripping protection.

What amps are you(O.P) using to power the subs ?

[Neild]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

Agreed,AVR is tripping protection.

What amps are you(O.P) using to power the subs ?

Well maybe. But how come the protection code isn't coming up then?

[Neild]

Originally Posted by Neild

OK finally got the film, what are the time code(s) ranges you want me to check out? Not planning to watch the movie at this time since we'll probably watch all 3 in order over the coming weeks.

OK I found the part you mean around 51:00

However last night even with sound deadened room, -35 to -30 with people sleeping was way too loud. I'm not even sure I'll have the guts to try -25 or -20, it's already way too loud.

That passage has an oscillating sound from the aircraft, kind of a wild flutter that I can see being a stressor.

[victortubeman]

Originally Posted by Neild

Well maybe. But how come the protection code isn't coming up then?

He has checked his cables,he needs to check speaker levels are all equal and what levels he is listening at from ref 75db (-30db).

With a system , all speakers set to small and sub(s) used an AVR should have no trouble.If he uses the AVR for his subs too then that is the problem.

In my system with 600 plus bluray,s my amps for front right/left have output meters most have peaks of 5 watts only and 1 ,terminator salvation peaked at 10watts.This system(big one) all speakers small , 4 subs x over is 80hz. Levels are -10db from ref 75db.

Centre speaker may use more power,but not sure what it is and I have far more power than most .(my centre has 1500watts) if needed.

This week I,ll watch it on my other small system and 2 subs .

[Neild]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

He has checked his cables,he needs to check speaker levels are all equal and what levels he is listening at from ref 75db (-30db).

With a system , all speakers set to small and sub(s) used an AVR should have no trouble.If he uses the AVR for his subs too then that is the problem.

In my system with 600 plus bluray,s my amps for front right/left have output meters most have peaks of 5 watts only and 1 ,terminator salvation peaked at 10watts.This system(big one) all speakers small , 4 subs x over is 80hz. Levels are -10db from ref 75db.

Centre speaker may use more power,but not sure what it is and I have far more power than most .(my centre has 1500watts) if needed.

This week I,ll watch it on my other small system and 2 subs .

Hi Victor, that specific receiver has an error code that comes up in the event of a overload, and that code is not coming up. If it were, we could probably say case closed, but it's not.

I think he already said he's dialed in 75 db reference. Not sure what you mean about using the AVR for the subs, I don't think the receiver is powering the subwoofers if that's what you mean. The receiver would supply the cutoffs and send low levels to outboard individually powered subs.

I will say that the specific sound effect in the movie is pretty wild in how it fluctuates and strobes. Knowing how components of all kinds respond to sloping and accelerating demands, I can see this being a real stress test on any gear.

[victortubeman]

Originally Posted by Neild

Hi Victor, that specific receiver has an error code that comes up in the event of a overload, and that code is not coming up. If it were, we could probably say case closed, but it's not.

I think he already said he's dialed in 75 db reference. Not sure what you mean about using the AVR for the subs, I don't think the receiver is powering the subwoofers if that's what you mean. The receiver would supply the cutoffs and send low levels to outboard individually powered subs.

I will say that the specific sound effect in the movie is pretty wild in how it fluctuates and strobes. Knowing how components of all kinds respond to sloping and accelerating demands, I can see this being a real stress test on any gear.

Hi Neil,

With the subs,yes is the avr is running the subs (passive)?

This movie is filtered at 20hz,30hz and up to 80hz nothing special.90hz to 100hz there is some output which may cause some systems problems.

Most problems are incorrect setup(levels too high,low).Smaller subs which overload etc.With more info about his system,set up and how amps etc are pluged in we can find the problem.

Cheers.

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

Hi Neil,

With the subs,yes is the avr is running the subs (passive)?

This movie is filtered at 20hz,30hz and up to 80hz nothing special.90hz to 100hz there is some output which may cause some systems problems.

Most problems are incorrect setup(levels too high,low).Smaller subs which overload etc.With more info about his system,set up and how amps etc are pluged in we can find the problem.

Cheers.

The subs are Technics THX certified with two 8" subs with 10" passive radiators, each with it's own 120 watt amp.I have not calibrated the system manually but have used the auto set up mic feature.As said before I ended up turning the center down a few db's because on two other movies there were brief cut outs.This was noted in an online review of the center being a little high.I have a decibel meter but since I can't adjust the left and right to -75 to match the other speakers I used the auto feature.

[Neild]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

This movie is filtered at 20hz,30hz and up to 80hz nothing special.90hz to 100hz there is some output which may cause some systems problems.

Most problems are incorrect setup(levels too high,low).Smaller subs which overload etc.With more info about his system,set up and how amps etc are pluged in we can find the problem.

Are you looking at a scan of the audio track or something? What is in the 90-100 Hz that causes problems?

[victortubeman]

Originally Posted by lghaze42

The subs are Technics THX certified with two 8" subs with 10" passive radiators, each with it's own 120 watt amp.I have not calibrated the system manually but have used the auto set up mic feature.As said before I ended up turning the center down a few db's because on two other movies there were brief cut outs.This was noted in an online review of the center being a little high.I have a decibel meter but since I can't adjust the left and right to -75 to match the other speakers I used the auto feature.

Hi,
Ok that helps subs are active,system set with all speakers small.

The cross over(x over) is it 80hz?

Neil, from Avs forum , bass master thread post 6477.audio graph DKR.
Bass output at -5db to 0db above 80hz which is above x over and may stress systems amp. Most speakers lack output from 100hz to 250hz depending on type etc.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1333462/th...cy-charts/6450

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

Hi,
Ok that helps subs are active,system set with all speakers small.

The cross over(x over) is it 80hz?

Neil, from Avs forum , bass master thread post 6477.audio graph DKR.
Bass output at -5db to 0db above 80hz which is above x over and may stress systems amp. Most speakers lack output from 100hz to 250hz depending on type etc.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1333462/th...cy-charts/6450

yes on both.

[victortubeman]

Hi Ighaze42,

I,ve watched DKR on my small HT now ,denon Avr, 5 definitive technology mythos speakers and 2 genesis 900 subs.speakers all set small x over 80hz.

Watched at -8db from Ref , and the scenes mentioned had no problem with audio.So a normal system should handle this soundtrack under Ref levels.

Is anything plugged in with your Avr ?(power point) or on the same circuit etc.

[-DLS-]

I had this problem with a few loud scenes with my old Onkyo receiver. All the wires/connections were good so I brought it in an they found a hairline crack in the heat sink. They had it replaced and problem was solved. They must have inspected it real good or know where to look cuz it was hard to notice when they showed me. I had to look real close.

[Neild]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

Hi,
Ok that helps subs are active,system set with all speakers small.

The cross over(x over) is it 80hz?

Neil, from Avs forum , bass master thread post 6477.audio graph DKR.
Bass output at -5db to 0db above 80hz which is above x over and may stress systems amp. Most speakers lack output from 100hz to 250hz depending on type etc.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1333462/th...cy-charts/6450

Very interesting. From that I would take that there is more demanding amplification required down in the range just above the cutoff frequency, the hardest range to drive, and possibly stressing the receiver. It would then be interesting to change the crossover from 80 Hz to 100 Hz and see what happens.

From my understanding, that receiver does its cutoffs mathematically in digital so it could be an artifact of that exactness. It also has modes which can insert calculated high and low frequency harmonics, intended to 'restore' sounds in lossy codecs. I wonder if that's an issue too?

One thing I keep coming back to is the oscillating nature of the sound. It's been awhile but what I learned in the lab was that how quickly the loud noise ramps was critical to whether or not it would break the equipment :-)

We could wreck devices with a sharp turn to level X, but a slow turn could let us go to level X and well beyond. The lab prof said that's why you always always always turn your car stereo down before you shut off the car (to prevent the speakers from going 0 to 60 when you come back and start it)

[mrpink134]

My system handled it no problem at 0! It was a awesome!

Here's what I have

Fronts: Monitor Audio RX8
Center: Monitor Audio RX Center
Surrounds: Monitor Audio RXFX
Sub: Ed A2 - 300
Receiver: Yamaha RX V1900
Amp: Emotiva XPA-3

[Canada]

Originally Posted by mrpink134

My system handled it no problem at 0! It was a awesome!

Here's what I have

Fronts: Monitor Audio RX8
Center: Monitor Audio RX Center
Surrounds: Monitor Audio RXFX
Sub: Ed A2 - 300
Receiver: Yamaha RX V1900
Amp: Emotiva XPA-3

Yeah but you have an external amp that has 200 per channel for the Front L&R and the Center.

[mrpink134]

Originally Posted by Canada

Yeah but you have an external amp that has 200 per channel for the Front L&R and the Center.

ya I do and it was loud as hell and I had the whole house rocking

[victortubeman]

Hi Ighaze,

What audio settings that are additional to the hd audio are you using if any?Is there EQ used on your Pana Avr?
Try turning off non essential audio settings for decoding HD audio and then playing scenes from movie.

If the problem persists than try upping x over to 100hz(good idea Neil) and try scenes again.This may help if it doesn't then get Avr checked as class d amps may now be out of manufacturer,s specs.

It also maybe normal for this Avr and external amps maybe needed if amp tech finds nothing wrong.

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by victortubeman

Hi Ighaze,

What audio settings that are additional to the hd audio are you using if any?Is there EQ used on your Pana Avr?
Try turning off non essential audio settings for decoding HD audio and then playing scenes from movie.

If the problem persists than try upping x over to 100hz(good idea Neil) and try scenes again.This may help if it doesn't then get Avr checked as class d amps may now be out of manufacturer,s specs.

It also maybe normal for this Avr and external amps maybe needed if amp tech finds nothing wrong.

Everything is set flat...no EQ at all.I think -20 might be diffeent on some receivers.I can't imagine me ever taking my volume to 0.When playing the scene at -25 or so it is loud enough.I guess I just need to adjust volume depending on how loud the soundtrack.Some movies I can watch at -20 and some are so loud I need to back it down to -25 or so. BTW...My name is Lghaze42...or larry if you prefer....thanks

[lghaze42]

Originally Posted by mrpink134

My system handled it no problem at 0! It was a awesome!

Here's what I have

Fronts: Monitor Audio RX8
Center: Monitor Audio RX Center
Surrounds: Monitor Audio RXFX
Sub: Ed A2 - 300
Receiver: Yamaha RX V1900
Amp: Emotiva XPA-3

I can't imagine ever going that high...I would be deaf by now.

[victortubeman]

Originally Posted by lghaze42

Everything is set flat...no EQ at all.I think -20 might be diffeent on some receivers.I can't imagine me ever taking my volume to 0.When playing the scene at -25 or so it is loud enough.I guess I just need to adjust volume depending on how loud the soundtrack.Some movies I can watch at -20 and some are so loud I need to back it down to -25 or so. BTW...My name is Lghaze42...or larry if you prefer....thanks

Hi Larry,

On your system what is Ref level and what level do listen below Ref.

With test tones find what Ref 75db with -30db tones on your system. Note this number.On my Avr Ref is -28.Different systems Ref will be at different levels(numbers )