A Guide to Audyssey Auto Calibration & Other Technologies

[MikeCL]

Great information! I just did a calibration on my Denon today and was wondering why the surrounds sounded so much louder but now I see! It really does help with the sound doing a calibration.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by MikeCL

Great information! I just did a calibration on my Denon today and was wondering why the surrounds sounded so much louder but now I see! It really does help with the sound doing a calibration.

I believe I tried to explain this before. Check Item #5 toward the end of Post #1 under the title "WHAT YOU SHOULD DO AND WHAT YOU SHOULD NOT DO".

After running a MultEQ calibration and turning on Dynamic EQ, if you find the surround speakers to be much louder than the front and center speakers, that is done on purpose. The researchers at Audyssey have found out that human perception of loudness falls off faster behind us than it does in front. So, Dynamic EQ compensates for that using a human loudness spatial model that looks at the master volume setting and makes the appropriate adjustment to the level of the surrounds. This is designed for content where the overall surround impression should remain the same at all volume levels: i.e. surround movies and music.

[MikeCL]

I will have to say it was pretty good I watched a movie last night and while my setup is not final right now it sounds more like I was in the truck.

One dumb question and I think you told me before in another thread, my surrounds they don't face me but they shoot back to the front, I was wondering yesterday when doing the Audyssey sound calibration do those rear surrounds need to be facing the mic or does it not matter?

*edit from it search seems like I did it right in the way to point the surrounds

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by MikeCL

I will have to say it was pretty good I watched a movie last night and while my setup is not final right now it sounds more like I was in the truck.

One dumb question and I think you told me before in another thread, my surrounds they don't face me but they shoot back to the front, I was wondering yesterday when doing the Audyssey sound calibration do those rear surrounds need to be facing the mic or does it not matter?

*edit from it search seems like I did it right in the way to point the surrounds

No, the speakers do not have to be pointed toward the microphone. In fact, Audyssey microphone is pointed toward the ceiling.

[Silo5]

After reading this thread, I started wondering how much difference a boom mic would make over a camera tripod to hold the Audyssey mic. Curiosity got the better of me and I ordered one through Amazon, along with the adapter to hold the Audyssey mic. As much as I could find on the 'net, it appears that it will make a difference. I guess I'll find out soon enough.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by Silo5

After reading this thread, I started wondering how much difference a boom mic would make over a camera tripod to hold the Audyssey mic. Curiosity got the better of me and I ordered one through Amazon, along with the adapter to hold the Audyssey mic. As much as I could find on the 'net, it appears that it will make a difference. I guess I'll find out soon enough.

Don't believe everything you read on the net.

[Silo5]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

Don't believe everything you read on the net.

But it has to be true! Didn't that woman on the commercial meet a "real" French model on the net??

[browndk26]

Can you recommend a good test tone download to use instead of the internal tones? Should I play a 75 db tone for all the speakers and sub? Should a lower tone be played to test the sub?

If there is a sticky or another post about this just direct me there.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by browndk26

Can you recommend a good test tone download to use instead of the internal tones? Should I play a 75 db tone for all the speakers and sub? Should a lower tone be played to test the sub?

If there is a sticky or another post about this just direct me there.

Post #2 of the following thread has links to test tones.:

Understanding & Using Test Tones To Calibrate Your System

[browndk26]

Thank you sir.

[JOMV]

Hi guys!!!

I'm having doubts about setting my subs with Audyssey MultiEQ XT. I'll try my best to explain how I always do it so you can see my exact situation. I always run the test tones on my Denon AVR-2312ci receiver and use an SPl to get all speakers as close as possible to 75dB. I like a little extra bass, so I set my 2 subs to read 77dB each. The one thing that I don't understand, is my sub setting:

- Sub#1 hits 77dB with just 25% on the gain (which I consider to be low)

- Sub#2 hits 77dB with 40% (which I consider to be OK)

The thing that confuses me, is that the Sub Level on the receiver is at -12dB (which is the minimum). And after running the Audyssey auto setup it leaves it that way. So, I can't play with the receiver's sub level at all even when the gain on both subs are at 25% on #1 and 40% on #2.

I had Sub#1 on the middle of the front wall and Sub#2 on the middle of the back wall. But, as I decided to go with 3 identical towers up front, I couldn't leave Sub#1 where it was. So I had to move place it between the left tower and the center tower. And Sub#2 was moved to the right back corner.

Any ideas???

Thanks in advance!!!

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by JOMV

Hi guys!!!

I'm having doubts about setting my subs with Audyssey MultiEQ XT. I'll try my best to explain how I always do it so you can see my exact situation. I always run the test tones on my Denon AVR-2312ci receiver and use an SPl to get all speakers as close as possible to 75dB. I like a little extra bass, so I set my 2 subs to read 77dB each. The one thing that I don't understand, is my sub setting:

- Sub#1 hits 77dB with just 25% on the gain (which I consider to be low)

- Sub#2 hits 77dB with 40% (which I consider to be OK)

The thing that confuses me, is that the Sub Level on the receiver is at -12dB (which is the minimum). And after running the Audyssey auto setup it leaves it that way. So, I can't play with the receiver's sub level at all even when the gain on both subs are at 25% on #1 and 40% on #2.

I had Sub#1 on the middle of the front wall and Sub#2 on the middle of the back wall. But, as I decided to go with 3 identical towers up front, I couldn't leave Sub#1 where it was. So I had to move place it between the left tower and the center tower. And Sub#2 was moved to the right back corner.

Any ideas???

Thanks in advance!!!

I repeat the response I gave you in my private message.

1. First of all, position your subwoofers properly in the room.
2. Set their crossovers to their maximum levels.
3. Set the level of each subwoofer first using an SPL meter so that each subwoofer gives you approximately around 70dB in your main listening area.

When you have two or more subwoofers in the room, you should not set the level of each one so high. The combined level of both subwoofer should be around 75dB and not the level of each one individually.

You should set the level of each one around 70db or so. When the two subs are combined, the level will be much higher. After the initial setting of the subwoofers, you can run Audyssey.

[JOMV]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

I repeat the response I gave you in my private message.

1. First of all, position your subwoofers properly in the room.
2. Set their crossovers to their maximum levels.
3. Set the level of each subwoofer first using an SPL meter so that each subwoofer gives you approximately around 70dB in your main listening area.

When you have two or more subwoofers in the room, you should not set the level of each one so high. The combined level of both subwoofer should be around 75dB and not the level of each one individually.

You should set the level of each one around 70db or so. When the two subs are combined, the level will be much higher. After the initial setting of the subwoofers, you can run Audyssey.

BD, thanks for your fast response (as always).

* FIRST: Both subs are placed the best way they can be placed (or at least I think so). Since I switched to 3 identical front towers instead of the traditional 2 towers / 1 regular center, I had to move Sub#1 between the left and center towers. Sub#2 is at the right back corner.

* SECOND: The crossovers have been set to their max settings since day one.
* THIRD: (This is the part where I have issues with, specially with Sub#1)

Initially, I followed your instructions on the following thread which you created: (STEP #7 to be exact)
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=95817

7) On the back of the sub, turn the level (gain) to 50%-65%. You can adjust that a little later during calibration. However, it is a good idea not to exceed the 3/4 (75%) point.

That step is the only one that seems to be almost imposible to accomplish since, as I said, Sub#1 (front) is already hitting around 77dB with just 25% on the gain. To lower it to 70dB, I would have to lower the gain even more to about 15% - 20%. One of my question is: wouldn't that affect bass performance by loosing bass output & impact effects on movies for being the sub that low on gain?

Sub#2 (rear) is at 40%, so it has a little more room to play with when lowering the gain. Maybe it will end up at about 30% gain when it hits 70dB.

And my main concern is that all of this is happens with the receiver's subwoofer level on its lowest setting (-12dB). No matter what I tried, I haven't been able to play with the receiver's sub level. I don't know, maybe I'm getting a LOT of room gain. Not sure if that is a possible cause, but my room is what you would call a small room (10W X 11L X 9H). I don't know, I'm really lost on this one.

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by JOMV

BD, thanks for your fast response (as always).

* FIRST: Both subs are placed the best way they can be placed (or at least I think so). Since I switched to 3 identical front towers instead of the traditional 2 towers / 1 regular center, I had to move Sub#1 between the left and center towers. Sub#2 is at the right back corner.

* SECOND: The crossovers have been set to their max settings since day one.
* THIRD: (This is the part where I have issues with, specially with Sub#1)

Initially, I followed your instructions on the following thread which you created: (STEP #7 to be exact)
http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=95817

7) On the back of the sub, turn the level (gain) to 50%-65%. You can adjust that a little later during calibration. However, it is a good idea not to exceed the 3/4 (75%) point.

That step is the only one that seems to be almost imposible to accomplish since, as I said, Sub#1 (front) is already hitting around 77dB with just 25% on the gain. To lower it to 70dB, I would have to lower the gain even more to about 15% - 20%. One of my question is: wouldn't that affect bass performance by loosing bass output & impact effects on movies for being the sub that low on gain?

Sub#2 (rear) is at 40%, so it has a little more room to play with when lowering the gain. Maybe it will end up at about 30% gain when it hits 70dB.

And my main concern is that all of this is happens with the receiver's subwoofer level on its lowest setting (-12dB). No matter what I tried, I haven't been able to play with the receiver's sub level. I don't know, maybe I'm getting a LOT of room gain. Not sure if that is a possible cause, but my room is what you would call a small room (10W X 11L X 9H). I don't know, I'm really lost on this one.

The most important thing is that the combined subwoofers in your room give you approximately 75dB of output in the main listening area. The actual levels on the back of the subwoofers and the dB level in the receiver are insignificant.

If you are still getting too much subwoofer output in your listening area, you have several options:

1. Lower the levels on the back of the subwoofers so that each subwoofer gives you about 65dB in the listening area.
2. Change the location of the subwoofers.
3. Change the location of your main listening chair/sofa (even a few inches may sometimes make a lot of difference).
4. Use some quality bass traps in the room. Normal foams on the walls do a good job of controlling reflections of high frequency waves from the walls. However, they are very ineffective in affecting the lower frequency bass waves coming from the subwoofers.

[JOMV]

Originally Posted by Big Daddy

The most important thing is that the combined subwoofers in your room give you approximately 75dB of output in the main listening area. The actual levels on the back of the subwoofers and the dB level in the receiver are insignificant.

If you are still getting too much subwoofer output in your listening area, you have several options:

1. Lower the levels on the back of the subwoofers so that each subwoofer gives you about 65dB in the listening area.
2. Change the location of the subwoofers.
3. Change the location of your main listening chair/sofa (even a few inches may sometimes make a lot of difference).
4. Use some quality bass traps in the room. Normal foams on the walls do a good job of controlling reflections of high frequency waves from the walls. However, they are very ineffective in affecting the lower frequency bass waves coming from the subwoofers.

Many thanks!!!... I can't move them but I'll give it a try again lowering them even more.

[Mgida]

Hi BD,

thanks for all of your great work.

I have the following need for clarification:
My system is comprised of B&W speakers and Marantz AVR in a 350sq feet room (photos attached), more precisely:
- CM8 with a FR 69-22 khz
- CM1 55-22khz
- CMC 55-22khz
- ASW610
- and Marantz SR7007

When I do my calibration (properly with tripod) the speakers are all set to:
- Large, at a full band crossover (40hz).
Front levels at -3.5db, Surround and Center levels at 0.5db
- LFE at 120hz, -12db with the level knob being at 1/3
I reset them to Small and raise the crossover to 60hz instead of 80 hz as the 80hz mark sounds a bit boomier to me. I leave the levels as they are.

As the spec sheet of the speakers shows the above mentioned FR it turns out that according to your suggestion I should raise the crossover at least up to 80hz.
my question is: Am I geting an Audio hole or something else or I should keep the Crossovers as they are at the moment?
Marantz does have the possibility to individually adjust the Crossovers.
I performed the calibration several times and the results are usually the same.
I dont have any issues with the sound I am receiving - its great, I am just wondering if I could further enhance it or if I am missing something.

Thanks in Advance
MG

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by Mgida

Hi BD,

thanks for all of your great work.

I have the following need for clarification:
My system is comprised of B&W speakers and Marantz AVR in a 350sq feet room (photos attached), more precisely:
- CM8 with a FR 69-22 khz
- CM1 55-22khz
- CMC 55-22khz
- ASW610
- and Marantz SR7007

When I do my calibration (properly with tripod) the speakers are all set to:
- Large, at a full band crossover (40hz).
Front levels at -3.5db, Surround and Center levels at 0.5db
- LFE at 120hz, -12db with the level knob being at 1/3
I reset them to Small and raise the crossover to 60hz instead of 80 hz as the 80hz mark sounds a bit boomier to me. I leave the levels as they are.

As the spec sheet of the speakers shows the above mentioned FR it turns out that according to your suggestion I should raise the crossover at least up to 80hz.
my question is: Am I geting an Audio hole or something else or I should keep the Crossovers as they are at the moment?
Marantz does have the possibility to individually adjust the Crossovers.
I performed the calibration several times and the results are usually the same.
I dont have any issues with the sound I am receiving - its great, I am just wondering if I could further enhance it or if I am missing something.

Thanks in Advance
MG

It is perfectly ok to increase the crossovers above the levels Audyssey calibration sets them. There is no audio hole.

It is not a good idea to lower the crossovers below the levels Audyssey sets them. The reason is because Audyssey does not apply correction filters below the crossovers that it measures.

[Mgida]

Thanks for the quick reply.

So I guess I should leave hem at 60Hz then.

Cheers
MG

[RocShemp]

I noticed that even in the Light setting, Dynamic Volume tends to crank up my overall volume by a lot. To make sure I wasn't simply imagining things, and out of curiosity, I decided to play some test tones with Dynamic volume off and then on Light. I used the tones from the Dysney WOW disc and an SPL meter.

To my surprise, when I set my meter to 80, wether Dynamic Volume was on or off, I'd get the same exact volume reading of 85 dB. However, when I tried to see what my volume reading would be with the meter set to 60, instead of -20 (or near to it) I had to lower my volume all the way to -30 if I had Dynamic Volume on.

Afterwards, I assumed I should use -30 as my "go to" volume since anything over that sounded too loud anyway (despite my usually listening to movies between -15 and -10 without Dynamic Volume). But although some movies I expected to sound low (such as Star Wars: Episode I and Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen BIG SCREEN EDITION) sounded pretty good at that volume, others I expected to be loud (Battleship and Serenity, my two loudest BD's, and even Inception) sounded just right at -30. But then movies like District 13: Ultimatum and Transformers: Dark of the Moon sound extremely loud and force me to lower my volume to -40. Which is okay but seems a bit extreme to me.

Am I doing something wrong? Is there no way to "guess" in advance the proper volume setting when using Dynamic Volume? Or must I simply "play" with the volume on a movie to movie basis?

[Big Daddy]

Originally Posted by RocShemp

I noticed that even in the Light setting, Dynamic Volume tends to crank up my overall volume by a lot. To make sure I wasn't simply imagining things, and out of curiosity, I decided to play some test tones with Dynamic volume off and then on Light. I used the tones from the Dysney WOW disc and an SPL meter.

To my surprise, when I set my meter to 80, wether Dynamic Volume was on or off, I'd get the same exact volume reading of 85 dB. However, when I tried to see what my volume reading would be with the meter set to 60, instead of -20 (or near to it) I had to lower my volume all the way to -30 if I had Dynamic Volume on.

Afterwards, I assumed I should use -30 as my "go to" volume since anything over that sounded too loud anyway (despite my usually listening to movies between -15 and -10 without Dynamic Volume). But although some movies I expected to sound low (such as Star Wars: Episode I and Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen BIG SCREEN EDITION) sounded pretty good at that volume, others I expected to be loud (Battleship and Serenity, my two loudest BD's, and even Inception) sounded just right at -30. But then movies like District 13: Ultimatum and Transformers: Dark of the Moon sound extremely loud and force me to lower my volume to -40. Which is okay but seems a bit extreme to me.

Am I doing something wrong? Is there no way to "guess" in advance the proper volume setting when using Dynamic Volume? Or must I simply "play" with the volume on a movie to movie basis?

There is really no set and correct level for the volume. It depends on you, the program material, and how the disc or the TV program was recorded. Dynamic Volume essentially limits the dynamic range. Studies have shown that people continuously turn the volume up and down when they are watching a program, particularly a special effects movie.

You should set the volume level so that you are comfortable with the dialog and the Dynamic Volume will adjust the rest.

This is how Audyssey defines Dynamic Volume:

Dynamic Volume solves the problem of constant variations in the volume level of the content. From dialog, to explosions, to dialog, to commercial you have to constantly adjust the remote. Dynamic Volume allows you to set the volume for the dialog level you prefer and then monitors the content and makes automatic adjustments to the volume so you never have things get too loud (or too soft) around the dialog level you have selected.

This is the response Chris Kyriakakis of Audyssey gave to a question about Dynamic Volume:

Unlike the other Audyssey technologies that are used to provide you with a reference experience, Dynamic Volume is a purely personal choice. The technology is designed to let you set the dialog level to where you prefer it and then not have to worry about the loud parts getting too loud and the soft parts getting too soft.

So, that's my recommendation: simply decide what level you want the dialog and then leave it there. I recommend starting with the middle (Evening) setting for Dynamic Volume. For late night watching (with others sleeping) you can switch to Midnight so that the range between softest and loudest is reduced even more and nobody is disturbed.