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Old 06-09-2014, 05:49 PM   #2741
Tech-UK Tech-UK is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eny- View Post
So many misconceptions. No movie needs to have high bit-rate for the entire duration. It always depends on the source!

On a movie like Lawrence of Arabia (eg) with a 2.20 AR the black bars don't need to consume any bit-rate since it's solid black the entire presentation. The same with static pictures. A dialog driven movie doesn't need a high bit-rate transfer.

And the mastered in 4K is a Sony gimmick. Like Superbit. As many already said these are just regular blu-rays with a 4k transfer.
Its not a gimmick, I welcome maxed out bitrates, why not. And the fact that they feature xvYCC, is something that yes, may not be night and day difference, but anything that can make more use of 8-bit is also welcome.
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Old 06-09-2014, 05:55 PM   #2742
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Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post
I tried out the Mastered In 4K The Amazing Spiderman man Blu ray on my W900A and I was blown away by the PQ and my tv aint 4K. I think it was much much better then the standard Blu ray release and its making me think of buying more Mastered in 4K Blu ray releases.
I just got the 900A a couple of weeks ago and have been very impressed with its 1080p passive 3D. So I'm torn between the 3D Spider-man or the mastered in 4K version. I'll probably go with the 3D and check out some other mastered in 4k titles (Ghostbusters seems like an obvious choice since that one is mastered from a better source to begin with).
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Old 06-09-2014, 05:56 PM   #2743
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Originally Posted by Tech-UK View Post
Its not a gimmick, I welcome maxed out bitrates, why not. And the fact that they feature xvYCC, is something that yes, may not be night and day difference, but anything that can make more use of 8-bit is also welcome.
Maxed out bitrates are fine unless you need the space for something else. Certainly easy work for the encoders, but properly encoded variable bit rate will deliver just as good
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:04 PM   #2744
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech-UK View Post
Its not a gimmick, I welcome maxed out bitrates, why not. And the fact that they feature xvYCC, is something that yes, may not be night and day difference, but anything that can make more use of 8-bit is also welcome.
It IS a gimmick. Maxed out bit-rate accomplish the same as a good encode. As for xvYCC few TVs support that and yes the improvement is marginal at best
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:09 PM   #2745
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This is why we need a proper UHD media format. Higher bit depth, meaningful wider gamut, greater dynamic range...

With lossless 24 bit object based surround that can handle 20 or more separate speaker outputs.
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:38 PM   #2746
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus View Post
This is why we need a proper UHD media format. Higher bit depth, meaningful wider gamut, greater dynamic range...

With lossless 24 bit object based surround that can handle 20 or more separate speaker outputs.
The/Your average consumer is lucky to have a 2.1 soundbar imo. 5.1 rarer, and 7.1 very very rare. Most down-mixed 2 channel rips/torrents from 5.1 sound very similar actually, unless it the 5.1/7.1 is done extremely well by sound engineers would the average person even notice the difference at normal volume.

I wish 4k came on every Blu-Ray released today with downscaling to 1080p from blu ray players or something like that. Then when 4k projectors became affordable, I would be set with my collection from day 1, but it's all a money pit game for the consumer imho. You have to pay to play.

It makes me wonder "if" they ever did do a digital sale system would we get "these" higher specs sooner, or is that all a game too.
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Old 06-09-2014, 06:59 PM   #2747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eny- View Post
It IS a gimmick. Maxed out bit-rate accomplish the same as a good encode. As for xvYCC few TVs support that and yes the improvement is marginal at best
There are quiet a few displays and PJ's that support x.v.Colour, along with players and receivers.

They are not regular Blu-ray's as x.v.Colour isn't in the Blu-ray spec. Superbit was just a bump in bitrate, whereas these 'Mastered in 4K' titles include additional data, xvYCC and Triluminous metadata.
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Old 06-09-2014, 07:26 PM   #2748
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech-UK View Post
Its not a gimmick, I welcome maxed out bitrates, why not.
Color wise, I agree with you, but maxed out bitrates have nothing to do with good compression. Actually, it's easier to just maxed out the bitrates without checking if the compression is fine than to have a good compressionist adjusting frame by frame what's needed and what's not.

bruceames. sums it up perfectly.

When I perfectly agree that if it's available, why not use it ?, I went past the point where I was looking to the bitrate thinking "it's low, it's not gonna be good" and "it's high, nice !".

But I'm afraid that with the Mi4K brand, Sony is only pushing further the over-analysis of paper-tech rather than the end results, and getting rid of the extras is only conforting me in this view.

Of course, you'll always have exemples of badly compressed discs (thinking Once Upon A Time in America EE or The Lady From Shanghai) but plenty of other discs have compression issues with higher specs, the same as other discs don't with equivalent (or even lower) specs.

But again, everyone is entitled to do what they want. If they feel they can benefit from this, all the best for them. But I do believe this is a shenanigan only perpetuating biased views, and this is something I'm quite sad about.
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Old 06-10-2014, 10:43 AM   #2749
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I never stated pushing up bitrate provides better compression, if the compression is good then increasing the bitrate won't do any harm apart from suck up space.

I agree with you that the encoding stage/revision of the encoder is more important, they have evolved over the past few years becoming ever more efficient.

Die Hard 4.0 is a good example, the German Recut release, even though it has a lower bitrate, produces a more detailed image, probably due to a newer revision of the encoder:

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...ss=1#vergleich
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Old 06-10-2014, 10:55 AM   #2750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tech-UK View Post
They are not regular Blu-ray's as x.v.Colour isn't in the Blu-ray spec. Superbit was just a bump in bitrate, whereas these 'Mastered in 4K' titles include additional data, xvYCC and Triluminous metadata.
I seem to recall that Superbit dvds had non-standard layer changes which took them out of the dvd spec.
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Old 06-10-2014, 12:26 PM   #2751
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What do people think of the MI4K release of Spider-Man 3? To me it doesn't necessarily have more or less detail (its honestly about the same), but it does have altered colours. I think the orignal release looks slightly deeper and more vibrant in terms of colour.

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...d_multiID=1735
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Old 06-10-2014, 01:25 PM   #2752
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD Goofnut View Post
The difference appears to be marginal at best in terms of detail: http://caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergleich...less=1#auswahl

Maybe you're noticing the expanded color assuming you have a compatible display.
My W900A supports the expanded color tech being that its a Quantum Dot Triluminous display. But its not only the colors that look beautiful but the detail is excellent as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bruceames. View Post
I just got the 900A a couple of weeks ago and have been very impressed with its 1080p passive 3D. So I'm torn between the 3D Spider-man or the mastered in 4K version. I'll probably go with the 3D and check out some other mastered in 4k titles (Ghostbusters seems like an obvious choice since that one is mastered from a better source to begin with).

First the W900A is not Passive 3D but Active 3D. That being said the Spider Man 3D Blu ray was very good but the Re-Mastered in 4K version was beautiful in colors and detail. Since it was my friends Blu ray I have to go out and buy one for myself but that's ok because I plan on picking up more 4K mastered Blu rays as well. Some may say its a waste but I personally don't think so.
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Old 06-10-2014, 05:20 PM   #2753
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Unlike the other two, Universal actually have some excellent releases from 4K restorations, such as:

Jaws
E.T.
Schindler's List
Vertigo
High Plains Drifter
Out Of Africa (re-release)

And they are doing new 4K restorations as we speak. They've also messed up some of their 4K releases such as To Kill A Mockingbird.

On the other hand, I'm not sure if there are 4K restorations of 100% (world-wide rights) Paramount films, other than The Godfather films.

The problem with Universal which gives them a bad rep is that the vast majority of their releases are based on their old masters, and those are some of the worst in the industry.

Anyway, it's not the amount of Ks, it's how you treat them and how good the source material is. A recent example in Purple Noon from caps-a-holic couldn't explain this better:

http://www.caps-a-holic.com/hd_vergl...D=1720#auswahl

The Criterion is a 2K scan, while the Studio Canal is 4K.
The did a very good job on most of the classic monster movies too.

The Sting is a 4K scan too, but they couldn't help but over-process it still.
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Old 06-10-2014, 05:26 PM   #2754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve1971 View Post

First the W900A is not Passive 3D but Active 3D. That being said the Spider Man 3D Blu ray was very good but the Re-Mastered in 4K version was beautiful in colors and detail. Since it was my friends Blu ray I have to go out and buy one for myself but that's ok because I plan on picking up more 4K mastered Blu rays as well. Some may say its a waste but I personally don't think so.
Sorry I had that confused with the X900A. Just got my 65" set two weeks ago and it has absolutely drop dead gorgeous passive 3D in 1080p.

In my flurry of buying 3D titles I realized I already bought Spider-Man 3D, so I won't be getting that one in the mastered in 4k version.
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Old 07-27-2014, 09:58 PM   #2755
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I watched Spider-man I & II (Mi4k) and they look very film-like projected. I don't have the originals to compare, but these look natural with nice grain structure and pleasantly vibrant colors. These are also by far the two best Spidey movies to date IMO.
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Old 07-28-2014, 12:06 AM   #2756
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HeavyHitter View Post
I watched Spider-man I & II (Mi4k) and they look very film-like projected. I don't have the originals to compare, but these look natural with nice grain structure and pleasantly vibrant colors. These are also by far the two best Spidey movies to date IMO.
Wish they would drop or double feature these. They're the ones that I'm interested in.
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