Star Wars: The Clone Wars - The Complete Season Two Blu-ray

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by backgroundactorman

Even on big budget animated films like kung fu panda the voice talent (including the A list actors that are casting more and more in the main roles )is just a wee fraction of the production budget.

I have alot of friends who work as voice over actors,And for the most part now days the A list stars dont bring in much more money on their paycheck than the actual legit voice over actors who can do many many many more character voices and actually ACT, not just read their lines off the page sounding no different than they do in any other live action movie they star in.

But even for those films that have the occasional actor who does bring in the multi million dollar pay check, it still such a small fraction of the budget, the majority really does go to the actual animation.

One of the reason I prefer Pixar to Dreamworks is Pixar gives low level voiceactors a chance to shine instead of wasting money on useless "Star Power"

Even if Pixar and Dreamworks spent only half the production budget on the animation that would still put it way ahead of what Lucasfilm spends on The Clone Wars. 2001 saw the release of Monsters Inc and Shrek both with main characters very hairy and animating every hair folice on each character. The Clone Wars however because of its low budget has absolutely zero hair folice animation. Anakins hair is static like a plastic hat. Anakin looks more like Ken from Toy Story 3 then he does his live action counterpart.

[MC930]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

2001 saw the release of Monsters Inc and Shrek both with main characters very hairy and animating every hair folice on each character. The Clone Wars however because of its low budget has absolutely zero hair folice animation. Anakins hair is static like a plastic hat. Anakin looks more like Ken from Toy Story 3 then he does his live action counterpart.

Supposedly, this is one of the improvements for season 3

[Troy73]

Originally Posted by backgroundactorman

Even on big budget animated films like kung fu panda the voice talent (including the A list actors that are casting more and more in the main roles )is just a wee fraction of the production budget.

Angelina Jolie alone made $8,000,000. for her role in Beowulf. Kung Fu Panda, who knows how much. The others in the film, Jack Black ,Lucy Liu, Jackie Chan and Dustin Hoffman, are not working for scale either.

Originally Posted by backgroundactorman

I have alot of friends who work as voice over actors,And for the most part now days the A list stars dont bring in much more money on their paycheck than the actual legit voice over actors who can do many many many more character voices and actually ACT, not just read their lines off the page sounding no different than they do in any other live action movie they star in.

The A-list stars bring in a hell of alot more. Now, Mark Hamill, while not really an A-list actor, made some hundreds of thousands doing his voice work as the Joker. That's high scale pay for voice actors. I know of no voice actor who only does voice acting to command multi-million dollar salaries.

Originally Posted by backgroundactorman

But even for those films that have the occasional actor who does bring in the multi million dollar pay check, it still such a small fraction of the budget, the majority really does go to the actual animation.

I agree and my initial post includes the talented animators as well. I never said the A-list voice overs took up half or even most of the budget. It is more than a fraction. More than likely 15-20% of the budget for the big multi-million dollar A-list theatrical releases. I would say, by comparison, Clone Wars is more impressive overall for what they do with such small budgets.

[dcowboy7]

Tonite.

[Clippins]

Originally Posted by dcowboy7

Tonite.

Wow, this just seemed so random as I was reading this thread. Like tourettes random, I couldn't help but laugh. I'm assuming this refers to season 3 starting "tonite".

[solarrdadd]

did anyone catch the premiere of season 3? it was great. the surround was really good this time and i loved the story(s) also during the first episode did everyone catch that love they gave to George Lucas when the clone said

[Show spoiler]"for the simulation run version THX, variable 1138!"

that was a nice touch! season 3 has started out with a bang and next week looks to continue.

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

did anyone catch the premiere of season 3? it was great. the surround was really good this time and i loved the story(s) also during the first episode did everyone catch that love they gave to George Lucas when the clone said

[Show spoiler]"for the simulation run version THX, variable 1138!"

that was a nice touch! season 3 has started out with a bang and next week looks to continue.

This weeks episode was pretty great. My only problem is possibly the fact that we have seen both lightsaber duels before. Why can't they let Shak Ti duel Ventress and some other Jedi duel Grevious? Its become a bit repetative. Other then that a fantastic episode. Action was intense, characters were well devoloped particularly in the first part, and facial animations are noticeably improved over previous seasons.

Next weeks episode is bringing back Jar Jar. WWWWHHHHYYYYYY?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

[TokyoLee]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

did anyone catch the premiere of season 3? it was great. the surround was really good this time and i loved the story(s) also during the first episode did everyone catch that love they gave to George Lucas when the clone said

[Show spoiler]"for the simulation run version THX, variable 1138!"

that was a nice touch! season 3 has started out with a bang and next week looks to continue.

I caught it the story looks really good this season and the premiere was AWESOME!!!!!

[Jimmy Smith]

I don't have Cartoon Network in HD so I have to watch these episodes in slightly above VHS quality. The difference between the standard broadcast and the Blu-Rays is like day versus night. Macroblocking was all too common. Too bad it will be a year at least before I can see these episodes in high def.

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by MC930

Supposedly, this is one of the improvements for season 3

Nope. While there were many animation improvements to note there hair was still not solid plasticy blocks. Folicle animation is just too processor intensive to be made on the budget of a cable television show. Especially one full of big action.

[WJWS Channel 13:Amity]

Originally Posted by Troy73

Angelina Jolie alone made $8,000,000. for her role in Beowulf. Kung Fu Panda, who knows how much. The others in the film, Jack Black ,Lucy Liu, Jackie Chan and Dustin Hoffman, are not working for scale either.


The A-list stars bring in a hell of alot more. Now, Mark Hamill, while not really an A-list actor, made some hundreds of thousands doing his voice work as the Joker. That's high scale pay for voice actors. I know of no voice actor who only does voice acting to command multi-million dollar salaries.
I agree and my initial post includes the talented animators as well. I never said the A-list voice overs took up half or even most of the budget. It is more than a fraction. More than likely 15-20% of the budget for the big multi-million dollar A-list theatrical releases. I would say, by comparison, Clone Wars is more impressive overall for what they do with such small budgets.

Beaowulf wasnt merely a voice over performance for her though, It was motion capture. Which is just as physically intensive for the actor as it would be for a live action movie. Its not just the actor sitting in front of a microphone. Just like Avatar, Just like Polar Express, Just like Monster House, Just like Christmas Caroll the actors in those roles go far beyond doing voice over work.


As for straight forward animated films, I stand by what i said that FOR the most part even A list talent who do animated features Dont get multimillion dollar paychecks for a single animated film. Yeah there might be a few OCASSIONALLY but for the most part they dont make anywhere near what they make for their live action films.

But having said that for some reason when i read your post i was getting the idea that you meant as much as half of the film budget for the big animated films was do to A list voice talent. your 15 to 20 percent is a bit better but i would actually say even less than that. The exceptions being those who start off from the begining of what turns out to be a big franchise. However for animated movies without a built in audience the studios for the most part are much more cautious about what they offer A list stars for doing voice over work.

[Troy73]

Originally Posted by backgroundactorman

Beaowulf wasnt merely a voice over performance for her though, It was motion capture. Which is just as physically intensive for the actor as it would be for a live action movie. Its not just the actor sitting in front of a microphone. Just like Avatar, Just like Polar Express, Just like Monster House, Just like Christmas Caroll the actors in those roles go far beyond doing voice over work.


As for straight forward animated films, I stand by what i said that FOR the most part even A list talent who do animated features Dont get multimillion dollar paychecks for a single animated film. Yeah there might be a few OCASSIONALLY but for the most part they dont make anywhere near what they make for their live action films.

But having said that for some reason when i read your post i was getting the idea that you meant as much as half of the film budget for the big animated films was do to A list voice talent. your 15 to 20 percent is a bit better but i would actually say even less than that. The exceptions being those who start off from the begining of what turns out to be a big franchise. However for animated movies without a built in audience the studios for the most part are much more cautious about what they offer A list stars for doing voice over work.

Fair enough. I actually agree with alot of what you've said. In reality Angelina Jolie and alot of A-list would be the exception to the whole that is voice over only actors. And I do know that salary scale in Hollywood changes based on whether or not an actors image or just voice is used. So those A-list actors making less than they normally would does make sense. Anyway, I'm going to have to miss Clone Wars because I've seen none of season 2 and am waiting for the bluray release. I guess I'll catch up online. I love the internet.

[solarrdadd]

i love the style of the animation, i hope they don't change a thing as far as the style. that's all it is, it's the style that they wanted to give it and it stands out nicely; can we not accept that this is the directors vision. The only thing i would like to see changed is the level of surround sound. given the nature of the story, where it takes place, the ship to ship fighting and communications, this should be a surround sound lovers dream. things should be flying around my HT setup and there should always be something going on in the back ground. even if they didn't enhance the surround I would still love it as it is. OF COURSE, if they added a lossless soundtrack to the blu-ray releases, I could Squeeze out a bit more love for it!

mind you all of this is my point of view.

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

i love the style of the animation, i hope they don't change a thing as far as the style. that's all it is, it's the style that they wanted to give it and it stands out nicely; can we not accept that this is the directors vision. The only thing i would like to see changed is the level of surround sound. given the nature of the story, where it takes place, the ship to ship fighting and communications, this should be a surround sound lovers dream. things should be flying around my HT setup and there should always be something going on in the back ground. even if they didn't enhance the surround I would still love it as it is. OF COURSE, if they added a lossless soundtrack to the blu-ray releases, I could Squeeze out a bit more love for it!

mind you all of this is my point of view.

I don't think every problem with the animation is just "the movies style"

Some aspects like the angular bodies and the large eyes on the human characters can simply be chocked up the the stylization. However things like there unmoving hair and unreflective surfaces are due to the fact that things like raytraced lighting and folice animation is simply too costly for a cable animation tv series. Modern video games already surpass most 90s television animation and video games will probably surpass The Clone Wars in the second half of this decade as well.

Not trying to bash the show just calling it for what it is. Isn't nessesary for The Clone Wars to match Weta or Pixar to be a good show. The Clone Wars animaters have squeezed out some amazing work for there dirt cheap budgets. Imagine if the animation on this show looked like this.

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

I don't think every problem with the animation is just "the movies style"

Some aspects like the angular bodies and the large eyes on the human characters can simply be chocked up the the stylization. However things like there unmoving hair and unreflective surfaces are due to the fact that things like raytraced lighting and folice animation is simply too costly for a cable animation tv series. Modern video games already surpass most 90s television animation and video games will probably surpass The Clone Wars in the second half of this decade as well.

Not trying to bash the show just calling it for what it is. Isn't nessesary for The Clone Wars to match Weta or Pixar to be a good show. The Clone Wars animaters have squeezed out some amazing work for there dirt cheap budgets. Imagine if the animation on this show looked like this.

for the most part i do agree, but they have a budget and a timeframe too. i do think it looks great and i love the stories. nice link on youtube by the way! But i suspect the clone wars directors were not going for the photo realism that's given in the links trailer and i dare suspect they don't have the budget of that linked animation on a tv series budget. but i'll say it again, that's some beautiful animation in the trailer on the link!

[Lionel Horsepackage]

Cartoon Network edited the "ARC Troopers" episode by a few seconds. When Asajj Ventress kills a trooper with her lightsaber, she kisses him as he dies. You can see the very short clip here:

http://www.theforce.net/latestnews/s...ers_133913.asp

Needless to say, that footage will undoubtedly be in the episode on Blu-Ray and DVD.

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

for the most part i do agree, but they have a budget and a timeframe too. i do think it looks great and i love the stories. nice link on youtube by the way! But i suspect the clone wars directors were not going for the photo realism that's given in the links trailer and i dare suspect they don't have the budget of that linked animation on a tv series budget. but i'll say it again, that's some beautiful animation in the trailer on the link!

Its a cutscene for the game Star Wars Old Republic. Which begs the question of why a video game cutscene can afford animation that great while a TV show is so far behind. That cutscene is every bit as great as Final Fantasy The Spirits Within. Maybe alittle better. This one might be even better

[solarrdadd]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

Its a cutscene for the game Star Wars Old Republic. Which begs the question of why a video game cutscene can afford animation that great while a TV show is so far behind. That cutscene is every bit as great as Final Fantasy The Spirits Within. Maybe alittle better. This one might be even better

yes, i know it's a cut scene. the reason why is because of the money they are hoping to make on selling the game so it's budgeted to make a good trailer to hype game sales. it's no different with a movie showing you a great, well made trailer...the idea is to get you to buy tickets to see the movie based on it.
clone wars with it's animation style, story and sound have for all three of it's seasons had the highest ratings in it's time slot for an animated series on the cartoon network so what they are doing must be working. season one was the highest rated show in the networks history and the viewing of the show has been consistant in it's viewer ratings and the amount of viewers who watched the show. they must be doing something right!

i don't want to let this get out of hand (you know how quickly that happens at this site) so it's pretty obvious that you want better quality animation or at least things about the animation need to be done more to your liking and i'll just say ok to that so that we can move on. i don't want this to linger too long cause it will just not be good and don't want that to happen to this thread.

with that said, i can't wait for next weeks episode, jar jar and all! i love this show so much, i even tolerate Representative Binks, from time to time!

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by solarrdadd

yes, i know it's a cut scene. the reason why is because of the money they are hoping to make on selling the game so it's budgeted to make a good trailer to hype game sales. it's no different with a movie showing you a great, well made trailer...the idea is to get you to buy tickets to see the movie based on it.
clone wars with it's animation style, story and sound have for all three of it's seasons had the highest ratings in it's time slot for an animated series on the cartoon network so what they are doing must be working. season one was the highest rated show in the networks history and the viewing of the show has been consistant in it's viewer ratings and the amount of viewers who watched the show. they must be doing something right!

i don't want to let this get out of hand (you know how quickly that happens at this site) so it's pretty obvious that you want better quality animation or at least things about the animation need to be done more to your liking and i'll just say ok to that so that we can move on. i don't want this to linger too long cause it will just not be good and don't want that to happen to this thread.

with that said, i can't wait for next weeks episode, jar jar and all! i love this show so much, i even tolerate Representative Binks, from time to time!

If I could choose Id like better animation yeah but at the same time (I like South Park afterall) and ultimately the writing and staging of the show matter more then the animation. I like the animation on the new Clone Wars series better but I still prefer Tartokosky's hand drawn show because in terms of the proper stylistic staging it was a superior show. Not to mention The Clone Wars is probably the finest looking animated series ever on television already. So I don't intend to complain just to put things in perspective. If The Clone Wars had animation equaling the best video game cutscenes like the ones in my links it would be impossible to make a profit from ratings alone. Even when DVD and Blu-Ray sales are factored in it would still be tough. So I understand why The Clone Wars is behind

[gavkiwi]

3 weeks today, release is getting close! , wow October is going to be an expensive month