Leni Riefenstahl's "Triumph of the Will"

[Oniros]

I'll make sure my local library gets this. Aside from the Nazi connection, I've always found Leni Riefenstahl to be a fascinating person from a documentary I saw a long time ago.

[philzilla]

Originally Posted by Oniros

I'll make sure my local library gets this. Aside from the Nazi connection, I've always found Leni Riefenstahl to be a fascinating person from a documentary I saw a long time ago.

The Wonderful Horrible Life of Leni Riefenstahl?

If not, that's a great movie you should check out.

[nils]

Who received this issue, please show screenshots for quality assessment

[I KEEL YOU]

Originally Posted by Andrew Woo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2_8ZE2Hl6E

[bigshot]

Is there any word about a disk replacement program on this? The subtitles are all messed up. The English subtitles aren't removable, even if you select "none" in the subtitle menu. And the spoken dialogue in the short doesn't have subtitles at all. Even though the subtitle menu offers several language choices, I suspect the English subtitles show up anyway. This film is all about visuals. I just want to turn off the text on the screen and just look at the pictures, but that isn't possible. I really don't need to know what Hitler is saying and who is standing next to him at all.

[Ray Jackson]

Sieg Heil!

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by bigshot

Is there any word about a disk replacement program on this? The subtitles are all messed up. The English subtitles aren't removable, even if you select "none" in the subtitle menu. And the spoken dialogue in the short doesn't have subtitles at all. Even though the subtitle menu offers several language choices, I suspect the English subtitles show up anyway. This film is all about visuals. I just want to turn off the text on the screen and just look at the pictures, but that isn't possible. I really don't need to know what Hitler is saying and who is standing next to him at all.

The English subtitles you refer to appear to be for context, burned-in to the source (they are in the short film as well), and were likely done by The Film Preserve, who have also watermarked both films with their logo, which appears occasionally in the bottom right corner of the screen. There are optional English subtitles for the spoken dialogue (e.g. speeches) in Triumph of the Will, and they are a larger font, matching what Synapse usually provides.

[bigshot]

I've contacted Synapse through their website to see if it's a mistake. This disk cost $35. It should be right, not marked up like a dollar store PD DVD. I didn't notice bugs in the corner. What point in the running time is that? If there are bugs, it goes right back.

[Ruined]

You do realize there are cases where rights cannot be obtained for the film with removable subtitles, right? Burned in subs are an extra layer of region protection for the rights holders.

[schan1269]

I could have sworn RAH mentioned all this in the A Few Words About.

[Vidya]

Yeah, you're right. Reading it now... he does mention that the identification titles cannot be removed.

[nils]

this issue have English hardsubs? For all speaches???

[Vidya]

I ran a few more spot checks on my copy just to be sure. Subtitles for the spoken dialog (speeches) can be turned off. However, the frequent "indentifications" cannot be removed. These are much more than IDs for the various figures that appear in the film; the indentifications explain much of the action that is happening on-screen.

Additionally, if you view the movie with subs other than English, you still get the forced IDs at the bottom of the screen in English in addition to translations of the IDs at the top of the screen in the selected language.

I wonder if the updated DVD version also has the forced IDs.

[The Valeyard]

I don't recall Synapse's previous DVD releases having these issues. It has been awhile since I've watched it, tho.

[Vidya]

Their older DVD releases should not have the issue because they don't contain the newer restoration.

[Vidya]

Forgot to mention that there are also English-language production credits displayed during the overture. Seems like another curious choice.

[bigshot]

Originally Posted by Ruined

You do realize there are cases where rights cannot be obtained for the film with removable subtitles, right? Burned in subs are an extra layer of region protection for the rights holders.

This is a public domain film. It doesn't have rights. If I spend three times the price of a typical blu-ray for an "ultimate edition", I expect it to be the original film. Not the original film with someone writing comments over the top of it.

Originally Posted by nils

this issue have English hardsubs? For all speaches???

Worse than that. There are descriptive subtitles all through the film, even when no one is speaking. And people are saying now that there are logo bugs in the corner of the screen. I am trying to find out if there is a work around. I've written Synapse. If they won't help fix it, I am going to return the disk to Amazon for a refund, write a critical review there, and never order another Synapse release unless I can be sure it isn't defaced. I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that this is just a mistake. I hope to hear back from them early this week.

[Vidya]

The logo bugs are indeed present; the first of which appears at the start of Chapter 4, "Night Rally". That's about where I stopped in order to investigate, looking for any way to remove all of the needless extras.

I'm not at all confident that any of these things are going to be addressed with a reissue, however, considering Robert Harris (the gentleman who supervised the restoration) has stated that the IDs are not removable per design. Tis a shame.

[McCrutchy]

Confirmation:

This disc is region-free.

As has been discussed, both Triumph of the Will and the short film Day of Freedom were restored for 2015 by The Film Preserve, who have added their watermark to both films. It also appears that they have added English-language contextualizing subtitles to both films, which are a mixture of short explanations and identifications. These subtitles are burned in to the sources, and appear as white. Synapse appear to have provided the additional, optional subtitles for Triumph of the Will in English, Castilian Spanish, Parisian French and Japanese. All of these subtitles appear as a slightly bolder and thicker white font, and they translate the German dialogue heard throughout the film (the foreign language tracks include additional translation for the burned-in English subtitles).

The English: Dolby Digital 2.0 track is the audio commentary with Dr. Anthony R. Santoro.

There are no other extras on the disc.

BDInfo scan:

                                                                                                                Total   Video                                             
Title                                                           Codec   Length  Movie Size      Disc Size       Bitrate Bitrate Main Audio Track                          Secondary Audio Track
-----                                                           ------  ------- --------------  --------------  ------- ------- ------------------                        ---------------------
00001.MPLS                                                      AVC     1:50:55 28,387,470,720  32,996,221,094  34.12   30.00   DTS-HD Master 2.0 2075Kbps (48kHz/24-bit)

DISC INFO:

Disc Title:     TRIUMPH OF THE WILL
Disc Size:      32,996,221,094 bytes
Protection:     AACS
BD-Java:        No
BDInfo:         0.5.8

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name:                   00001.MPLS
Length:                 1:50:55.774 (h:m:s.ms)
Size:                   28,387,470,720 bytes
Total Bitrate:          34.12 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec                   Bitrate             Description     
-----                   -------             -----------     
MPEG-4 AVC Video        30001 kbps          1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
DTS-HD Master Audio             German          2075 kbps       2.0 / 48 kHz / 2075 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 2.0 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby Digital Audio             English         192 kbps        2.0 / 48 kHz / 192 kbps

SUBTITLES:

Codec                           Language        Bitrate         Description     
-----                           --------        -------         -----------     
Presentation Graphics           English         14.750 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Spanish         24.087 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           French          24.075 kbps                     
Presentation Graphics           Japanese        18.421 kbps                     

FILES:

Name            Time In         Length          Size            Total Bitrate   
----            -------         ------          ----            -------------   
00002.M2TS      0:00:00.000     1:50:55.774     28,387,470,720  34,120          

CHAPTERS:

Number          Time In         Length          Avg Video Rate  Max 1-Sec Rate  Max 1-Sec Time  Max 5-Sec Rate  Max 5-Sec Time  Max 10Sec Rate  Max 10Sec Time  Avg Frame Size  Max Frame Size  Max Frame Time  
------          -------         ------          --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  --------------  
1               0:00:00.000     0:02:21.683     29,494 kbps     38,911 kbps     00:00:08.550    37,367 kbps     00:00:05.505    36,219 kbps     00:00:05.630    153,724 bytes   407,834 bytes   00:02:11.089    
2               0:02:21.683     0:04:13.586     28,015 kbps     33,666 kbps     00:04:56.212    32,591 kbps     00:04:52.292    31,361 kbps     00:03:57.028    146,055 bytes   316,595 bytes   00:02:21.933    
3               0:06:35.269     0:04:38.486     29,449 kbps     38,961 kbps     00:11:12.713    32,824 kbps     00:11:08.751    31,506 kbps     00:09:15.972    153,535 bytes   324,553 bytes   00:10:19.910    
4               0:11:13.756     0:02:57.552     30,571 kbps     38,422 kbps     00:11:14.632    36,815 kbps     00:11:37.613    36,219 kbps     00:11:33.567    159,385 bytes   379,108 bytes   00:11:56.465    
5               0:14:11.308     0:06:10.703     30,226 kbps     36,372 kbps     00:17:47.191    35,215 kbps     00:17:43.228    34,350 kbps     00:17:38.307    157,582 bytes   441,632 bytes   00:14:47.177    
6               0:20:22.012     0:02:08.169     30,849 kbps     37,661 kbps     00:21:44.761    35,166 kbps     00:21:40.799    33,796 kbps     00:21:35.752    160,831 bytes   341,060 bytes   00:21:45.429    
7               0:22:30.182     0:02:14.509     29,926 kbps     35,550 kbps     00:24:43.690    33,909 kbps     00:23:58.145    33,198 kbps     00:23:53.140    156,018 bytes   293,727 bytes   00:24:31.469    
8               0:24:44.691     0:09:40.663     28,276 kbps     34,883 kbps     00:26:13.780    32,476 kbps     00:26:09.693    30,683 kbps     00:26:04.771    147,419 bytes   369,976 bytes   00:34:25.313    
9               0:34:25.354     0:07:05.007     30,337 kbps     40,744 kbps     00:41:29.361    34,321 kbps     00:35:58.990    34,058 kbps     00:35:53.943    158,164 bytes   401,244 bytes   00:35:18.241    
10              0:41:30.362     0:03:41.679     29,369 kbps     33,556 kbps     00:45:11.041    31,584 kbps     00:44:43.597    31,454 kbps     00:44:38.592    153,119 bytes   321,768 bytes   00:42:16.534    
11              0:45:12.042     0:10:14.447     29,841 kbps     35,793 kbps     00:55:25.488    33,161 kbps     00:50:15.137    32,992 kbps     00:50:09.256    155,575 bytes   426,698 bytes   00:46:40.130    
12              0:55:26.489     0:01:29.214     31,810 kbps     36,611 kbps     00:55:48.344    34,014 kbps     00:55:55.852    33,194 kbps     00:55:50.972    165,843 bytes   319,938 bytes   00:55:49.346    
13              0:56:55.703     0:08:20.208     28,285 kbps     39,033 kbps     00:56:57.914    37,448 kbps     00:56:57.914    37,257 kbps     00:56:58.081    147,463 bytes   337,843 bytes   01:00:55.902    
14              1:05:15.912     0:11:39.365     30,395 kbps     38,005 kbps     01:11:38.627    36,865 kbps     01:11:39.837    35,946 kbps     01:11:25.948    158,465 bytes   428,315 bytes   01:06:50.631    
15              1:16:55.277     0:13:41.278     31,149 kbps     37,915 kbps     01:29:19.145    36,483 kbps     01:29:19.187    35,245 kbps     01:22:36.660    162,398 bytes   376,206 bytes   01:27:53.268    
16              1:30:36.556     0:04:39.028     32,189 kbps     39,689 kbps     01:35:13.791    36,415 kbps     01:35:10.579    34,769 kbps     01:34:22.823    167,821 bytes   344,479 bytes   01:30:47.358    
17              1:35:15.584     0:12:03.806     30,164 kbps     39,049 kbps     01:35:15.668    35,154 kbps     01:44:03.862    34,826 kbps     01:44:02.861    157,262 bytes   459,338 bytes   01:46:06.777    
18              1:47:19.391     0:03:22.785     31,191 kbps     37,875 kbps     01:50:40.592    36,869 kbps     01:50:36.421    35,403 kbps     01:50:32.167    162,613 bytes   333,559 bytes   01:50:03.888    
19              1:50:42.177     0:00:13.596     34,089 kbps     38,043 kbps     01:50:42.510    35,857 kbps     01:50:42.177    35,241 kbps     01:50:42.260    178,819 bytes   304,916 bytes   01:50:54.481    

STREAM DIAGNOSTICS:

File            PID             Type            Codec           Language                Seconds                 Bitrate                 Bytes           Packets         
----            ---             ----            -----           --------                --------------          --------------          -------------   -----           
00002.M2TS      4113 (0x1011)   0x1B            AVC                                     6655.649                30,002                  24,960,415,220  135,749,321     
00002.M2TS      4352 (0x1100)   0x86            DTS-HD MA       deu (German)            6655.649                2,075                   1,726,140,720   10,456,915      
00002.M2TS      4353 (0x1101)   0x81            AC3             eng (English)           6655.649                192                     159,740,160     1,039,975       
00002.M2TS      4608 (0x1200)   0x90            PGS             eng (English)           6655.649                15                      12,271,998      69,588          
00002.M2TS      4609 (0x1201)   0x90            PGS             spa (Spanish)           6655.649                24                      20,039,893      112,786         
00002.M2TS      4610 (0x1202)   0x90            PGS             fra (French)            6655.649                24                      20,029,641      112,708         
00002.M2TS      4611 (0x1203)   0x90            PGS             jpn (Japanese)          6655.649                18                      15,325,720      87,125

Day of Freedom:

QUICK SUMMARY:

Disc Title: TRIUMPH OF THE WILL
Disc Size: 32,996,221,094 bytes
Protection: AACS
BD-Java: No
Playlist: 00002.MPLS
Size: 4,293,766,080 bytes
Length: 0:17:02.146
Total Bitrate: 33.61 Mbps
Video: MPEG-4 AVC Video / 29817 kbps / 1080p / 23.976 fps / 16:9 / High Profile 4.1
Audio: German / DTS-HD Master Audio / 2.0 / 48 kHz / 2081 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 2.0 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)

[bigshot]

I am waiting to hear from Synapse about whether the burned in stuff is a mistake or not. If they intended that, I am returning the disk to Amazon for a refund, and I am never going to pre-order a Synapse disk again.