Blu Ray viewing in optimum

[Dreemworx]

Greetings,
I would like to submit a point here in the "Movies" area.

I read alot of reviews in here on Blu Ray movies and I get the feeling from some members that perhaps they may not have optimum settings adjusted on their television sets.

There is some movie reviews that talk about "too dark, too grainy, too w/e..." and I am wondering how much time was spent dialing in your player and HDTV?

I just want to make a point and certainly there is a technical thread on the multiple facets of getting labratory values per calibrated discs etc.
I will not try to build upon the other threads that delve into details ad nauseum but rather share a point.

When I first got my HDTV and Blu Ray player, being the technical nut I am I read everything I could on the settings and calibrations.
Even went online to "Sony Bravia" settings and read other members 'settings' and went to CNET as example for their 'lab calibration settings'.

What I found was that MY EYE did not agree with any exact setting be it expert reviewer, calibration theory or other.
I had to set my own values on each differential variable.
Even the Video Only salsemen said don't waste time "hiring" a calibration expert or dialing in disc values.

Long story short, I was in the beginning upset at the pictures I was getting and really was dissapointed in the "Blu Ray" product I was watching.
Especially my early purchases as being nearly unwatchable.
Rambo
Underworld: Rise of Lycans
Batman: Dark Knight

Those flicks are shot such that if I didn't fix my settings, I was not going to watch them.

(after setting to various 'experts')
Rambo was 'too green and hazy'. The Southeast Asian jungle tended to meld all details as one green palette of eye numbing blah.
Rise of Lycans was waay too dark and looked horrible.
Dark Knight was juttering and too dark.

In short; I went back to default settings and built up on my own from there.
I used Rambo (4) as my tool. If I can make that BR look gorgeous, anything will.
There is a part where Rambo is fleeing solo through jungle, near the last part of movie. Using this I paused and tweaked every setting. I got each individual leaf to set apart from it's neighbor. I brought in color that I recalled from walking in the bamboo jungle in Mauii.
I ran some movie would pause again and repeat. Gettings the blacks as close to my black bezel as I could, getting the flickering flames to look as real as I could, ridding the picture of judder, etc.
Note; I of course set BR player at 24Hz and the basics there and the Sony remote has a "Theate mode" which I used (Sony engineers that worked in Sony movies tweaked settings in this mode that can't be unlocked and is a great benefit for those with the applicable Bravia units).

At any rate, once I was very satisfied with the personal tweaking, deviating from all lab results, forum tables and calibration norms...I had my picture.

Every BR there on is money. I am amazed at how incredible my 52" HDTV is showing movies and every movie I watch over I always see more details previously not seen. Rambo, Lycans, Dark Knight all look insanely good there after.

I use a "Custom mode" for sports where I want things brighter and more colorful (football NFL) but for movies...I hit Theater Mode and with my tweaks, get what I feel is better than any movie house now.
The only thing 'better' is an IMAX 3D movie for me imo.

Just a thought on some reviews I see complaining about video quality in some movies.

Hope this helps somebody.

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Dreemworx

Greetings,
I would like to submit a point here in the "Movies" area.

I read alot of reviews in here on Blu Ray movies and I get the feeling from some members that perhaps they may not have optimum settings adjusted on their television sets.

There is some movie reviews that talk about "too dark, too grainy, too w/e..." and I am wondering how much time was spent dialing in your player and HDTV?

I just want to make a point and certainly there is a technical thread on the multiple facets of getting labratory values per calibrated discs etc.
I will not try to build upon the other threads that delve into details ad nauseum but rather share a point.

When I first got my HDTV and Blu Ray player, being the technical nut I am I read everything I could on the settings and calibrations.
Even went online to "Sony Bravia" settings and read other members 'settings' and went to CNET as example for their 'lab calibration settings'.

What I found was that MY EYE did not agree with any exact setting be it expert reviewer, calibration theory or other.
I had to set my own values on each differential variable.
Even the Video Only salsemen said don't waste time "hiring" a calibration expert or dialing in disc values.

Long story short, I was in the beginning upset at the pictures I was getting and really was dissapointed in the "Blu Ray" product I was watching.
Especially my early purchases as being nearly unwatchable.
Rambo
Underworld: Rise of Lycans
Batman: Dark Knight

Those flicks are shot such that if I didn't fix my settings, I was not going to watch them.

(after setting to various 'experts')
Rambo was 'too green and hazy'. The Southeast Asian jungle tended to meld all details as one green palette of eye numbing blah.
Rise of Lycans was waay too dark and looked horrible.
Dark Knight was juttering and too dark.

In short; I went back to default settings and built up on my own from there.
I used Rambo (4) as my tool. If I can make that BR look gorgeous, anything will.
There is a part where Rambo is fleeing solo through jungle, near the last part of movie. Using this I paused and tweaked every setting. I got each individual leaf to set apart from it's neighbor. I brought in color that I recalled from walking in the bamboo jungle in Mauii.
I ran some movie would pause again and repeat. Gettings the blacks as close to my black bezel as I could, getting the flickering flames to look as real as I could, ridding the picture of judder, etc.
Note; I of course set BR player at 24Hz and the basics there and the Sony remote has a "Theate mode" which I used (Sony engineers that worked in Sony movies tweaked settings in this mode that can't be unlocked and is a great benefit for those with the applicable Bravia units).

At any rate, once I was very satisfied with the personal tweaking, deviating from all lab results, forum tables and calibration norms...I had my picture.

Every BR there on is money. I am amazed at how incredible my 52" HDTV is showing movies and every movie I watch over I always see more details previously not seen. Rambo, Lycans, Dark Knight all look insanely good there after.

I use a "Custom mode" for sports where I want things brighter and more colorful (football NFL) but for movies...I hit Theater Mode and with my tweaks, get what I feel is better than any movie house now.
The only thing 'better' is an IMAX 3D movie for me imo.

Just a thought on some reviews I see complaining about video quality in some movies.

Hope this helps somebody.

You have a 52XBR. XBR ? 4,5,6,8,9?

What are your TV settings?

Is your room light controlled, and what are the light conditions when viewing Blu-rays?

[Drogon]

As a Sony XBR9 52" owner, I, too, would love to know your model and settings.

[krazeyeyez]

Cannot say i agree with the "don't have it calibrated" statement... It can be very beneficial and a slight fraction of the cost of your tv to not just "eyeball" it.... At the very least resources such as DVE can be a big help and are extremely cheap.

I do agree most settings posted on the net are not for you, since it is not just the tv itself, but the environment it is in, beyond that you are right, it what YOU feel looks good.

I too hear complaints about blu-rays not looking good when in actuallity they are superb, but this rarely comes from the crowd that has heard the term calibration. Normally it is coming from the crowd that stretches everything to 16:9 and then turns on vivid/flame mode, and goes above and beyond and cranks everything to on/high because if the option is there it must be good right lol.

Glad you got your set to where you like it, but keep in mind not every movie should look the same, and yes some movies are actually supposed to look dark.

[progers13]

At the end of the day, you have to be happy with your experience. And I would never tell you that you can't set your own TV to display to your particular tastes.

However, as another member stated, not every movie is supposed to look the same. Some movies are meant to be dark and grainy, or off-color, whether they look right to us or not. It shouldn't mean that we should have to adjust our set continually to provide a viewing that we think is better than the director's intent. That's what calibration does - ensure that each movie is viewed the way it was meant to be viewed by the people that made it.

I pose this question to you - the 2003 movie HULK was noted for being too much of a push into the green area of the tint scale. Yes, you can adjust the tint value to compensate, but would the character of Hulk look correct with a more normal skin tone? Or is he supposed to look that green?

Just something to think about.

[HD Goofnut]

I used DVE to calibrate all three of my HD displays and I was impressed with the results. Color accuracy became much better and it helped having sharpness set to 0.

[Dreemworx]

Originally Posted by krazeyeyez

Cannot say i agree with the "don't have it calibrated" statement... It can be very beneficial and a slight fraction of the cost of your tv to not just "eyeball" it.... At the very least resources such as DVE can be a big help and are extremely cheap.

I do agree most settings posted on the net are not for you, since it is not just the tv itself, but the environment it is in, beyond that you are right, it what YOU feel looks good.

I too hear complaints about blu-rays not looking good when in actuallity they are superb, but this rarely comes from the crowd that has heard the term calibration. Normally it is coming from the crowd that stretches everything to 16:9 and then turns on vivid/flame mode, and goes above and beyond and cranks everything to on/high because if the option is there it must be good right lol.

Glad you got your set to where you like it, but keep in mind not every movie should look the same, and yes some movies are actually supposed to look dark.

I'm not sure where I said 'every movie should look the same' in fact...I am not sure any Blu Ray movie looks remotely the same to me.
I find that the directer/ cinematographers interpretations of films are one big reason I can watch a film over and over again.

And I agree that if a videophile wants his TV calibrated to labratory conditions, more power to them!

=)

[Dreemworx]

Originally Posted by SquidPuppet

You have a 52XBR. XBR ? 4,5,6,8,9?

What are your TV settings?

Is your room light controlled, and what are the light conditions when viewing Blu-rays?

I purchased the Sony Bravia KDL-52XBR4. At the time it was the best choice for me and the newer part number was just comming out but, opted for the "4" as I didn't need to change bezel colors.

My room settings are theater like. Total darkness except for some light green (the color of theater exit signs) mini lites that wrap around my bar off to the far left of the TV. It gives just enough light to not fatigue my eyes yet basically total dark for viewing movies. Zero reflections and allows the TV to produce great blacks vs whites, while not fighting ambient noise.

I wrote the following settings for a friend with a 42" Bravia and forgive me as it was in haste but, if you need better nomenclature on the variables let me know.

Note; I don't profess to be an expert in HDTV calibrations and these settings may not work with anothers eye, my point was if you are not happy with alot of highly rated Blu Rays...check your settings yourself. Nothing more.

The above noted Bravia unit has a pre-set factory mode on the remote itself, a red/ orange button called "Theater Mode" I believe, Im at work and going off memory. I think to tweak it in menu its called "Cinema Mode". Once again I am going off memory if they are reveresed.

BL 9
Pic 85
Bright 50
color 85
Hue 0
Ctemp Nuetral
Sharp 70
NR Low
Blk Corr low
Advance CE off
gamma off
CW off
cs stnd
lc off
wb 0
D enh med
edge enhn off


Obviously Blu Ray player set to 24Hz, 1080p.

Let me know if this helps anybody.

[Bunker]

I "calibrated" my TV by looking at screenshots from various Blu-Ray discs, then adjusting the picture settings to look identical to the image in the screenshots. Kinda weird, but yeah, it actually worked pretty well.

[MrFattBill]

Originally Posted by Dreemworx

Even the Video Only salsemen said don't waste time "hiring" a calibration expert or dialing in disc values.

That's just silly talk.

Bill

[Beta Man]

Originally Posted by Dreemworx

BL 9
Pic 85
Bright 50
color 85
Hue 0
Ctemp Nuetral
Sharp 70
NR Low
Blk Corr low
Advance CE off
gamma off
CW off
cs stnd
lc off
wb 0
D enh med
edge enhn off


Obviously Blu Ray player set to 24Hz, 1080p.

Let me know if this helps anybody.

Bold ones stick out as "surprises" to me..... what are your white balances set to?

And I never turn on Block reduction or noise reduction.... but whatever works for you, works for you

EDIT:

and when was the last time you had an eye exam?

EDIT again:

Not intended as an insult.... but vision and hearing also vary from person to person.......

[progers13]

Originally Posted by Beta Man

Bold ones stick out as "surprises" to me..... what are your white balances set to?

In addition to the sharpness, backlight and color jumped out at me as abnormally high as well.

To the OP, have you tried Spears & Munsil calibration disc? Might be worth giving it a shot to see if a proper calibration meets to your satisfaction. I know not all sets are the same, but backlight over 5 during the brightest parts of the day is too much (never mind in a dark room - should be 2 or 3 at most). As for color, how is it that the actors don't look severely sunburned?

As I said before, it's your experience and you should be pleased with it. However, it's my opinion that your settings are overblown for the type of viewing you're talking about.

[Dreemworx]

Originally Posted by progers13

In addition to the sharpness, backlight and color jumped out at me as abnormally high as well.

To the OP, have you tried Spears & Munsil calibration disc? Might be worth giving it a shot to see if a proper calibration meets to your satisfaction. I know not all sets are the same, but backlight over 5 during the brightest parts of the day is too much (never mind in a dark room - should be 2 or 3 at most). As for color, how is it that the actors don't look severely sunburned?

As I said before, it's your experience and you should be pleased with it. However, it's my opinion that your settings are overblown for the type of viewing you're talking about.

Actually, I think the settings are specific for the Bravia XBR "Cinema Mode". Not sure others with other units can make a comparison. This was a response to the Bravia user.
The default "Cinema Mode" is very very dark, in fact is unwatchable for me.
One reason the BL is dialed up. However, once I compensate the overall experience is superb.
I have had many viewers over to watch BR's and they are have the same response...high remarks. I have the same or better video experience as the local IMAX theater which I visit appx 1 time per week.

My sports viewing on "Custom" is completely different. Lot less BL as example.
Completely different settings as Im sure I would do with another brand of TV as well.

Brand vs viewer is totally infinite. I don't think one single "calibration" disk fits all.

Btw, yes my eyes have had laser surgery years ago and I have 20/15 with perfect color perception.

[Dreemworx]

Originally Posted by progers13

In addition to the sharpness, backlight and color jumped out at me as abnormally high as well.

To the OP, have you tried Spears & Munsil calibration disc? Might be worth giving it a shot to see if a proper calibration meets to your satisfaction. I know not all sets are the same, but backlight over 5 during the brightest parts of the day is too much (never mind in a dark room - should be 2 or 3 at most). As for color, how is it that the actors don't look severely sunburned?

As I said before, it's your experience and you should be pleased with it. However, it's my opinion that your settings are overblown for the type of viewing you're talking about.

Once again, there are several "modes" at least on my XBR. I see you have the KDL52W 4100.

Have you a "Theater Mode"?
Have you several "modes" to customize?
If so what mode are you using for BL 5?

Not one mode will use the same settings imo, at least on my XBR.

Not sure we are talking apples to apples.

[Beta Man]

"cinema" is a combination of settings pre-set by the TV, "sports" is another, etc..... I don't see how what one you use as a starting point would affect anything

[mzupeman]

I would say, use calibrator settings that are posted on places like AVS or TweakTV or whatever, and use that as a starting point. Your whites and blacks should be spot on with those settings, and then you can adjust the contrast and color to your liking if you're not happy with those results as is. For example, I moved my TV from Warm 2 to Warm 1... and it looked how -I- thought it should look. It was slightly cooler than Warm 2 and gave me a picture I thought was accurate, but still not anywhere close to being considered 'torched'.

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Dreemworx

Actually, I think the settings are specific for the Bravia XBR "Cinema Mode". Not sure others with other units can make a comparison. This was a response to the Bravia user.
The default "Cinema Mode" is very very dark, in fact is unwatchable for me.
One reason the BL is dialed up. However, once I compensate the overall experience is superb.
I have had many viewers over to watch BR's and they are have the same response...high remarks. I have the same or better video experience as the local IMAX theater which I visit appx 1 time per week.

My sports viewing on "Custom" is completely different. Lot less BL as example.
Completely different settings as Im sure I would do with another brand of TV as well.

Brand vs viewer is totally infinite. I don't think one single "calibration" disk fits all.

Btw, yes my eyes have had laser surgery years ago and I have 20/15 with perfect color perception.

Where do you have your energy saving set at, High, Low or Off?

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Beta Man

"cinema" is a combination of settings pre-set by the TV, "sports" is another, etc..... I don't see how what one you use as a starting point would affect anything

Not true on the XBR Beta. Its not just a group of prepackaged settings offered in a different mode, and labeled as such.

In other words, you could use "standard" and tweak a bunch of settings and arrive at picture quality "X", but if you use "cinema" you could never achieve "X". The different "modes" are actually processing the image differently, not just displaying it differently.

[Dreemworx]

Originally Posted by Beta Man

"cinema" is a combination of settings pre-set by the TV, "sports" is another, etc..... I don't see how what one you use as a starting point would affect anything

Each 'Mode' has entirely different pre set values. Even at that, you can put the exact same settings into those modes and they will be slightly different. ESPECIALLY the cinema mode. There are also "locked" values.

Sony Bravia XBR "TheaterMode" was a special one off mode acc to Sony, that the actual engineers that work in the cinema on Sony based film machines, set and can not be code unlocked with several "blind" variables.

Most of the 'other' mode settings can be code unlocked (for those that really want to dig deep into their customization).

Once again, my post in is no way to poo poo those using standard calibration discs or to say "My settings are best".

There are basically useless to anyone other than a Sony KDL52-XBR user. My friend with the 42" didn't even have all the variables.

My point is use your own eye to dial in what is best for YOU. If you are not happy with the picture, and there seems to be alot of members loving the film in question...make changes.

[My_Two_Cents]

Originally Posted by Beta Man

"cinema" is a combination of settings pre-set by the TV, "sports" is another, etc..... I don't see how what one you use as a starting point would affect anything

Not sure if this applies to the OP's set, but I have heard/read that on some sets, the different "modes" are more than simply different preset user adjustments. By this I mean if you set the user-adjustable settings equally for 'cinema' and 'sports', the pictures will not be the same because there are other non-user-adjustable settings that are different for each mode.

Edit: I see Squid was replying with the same thing as I was typing.