Question about the 120Hz & 240Hz - Blu-ray Forum

Wingman1977 · 12-29-2010, 11:13 PM

I've noticed on the calibration settings on any tv that has the 120 or 140Hz features, they always say to turn them off. Why is that? I mean if it's that much of a negative for the picture quality, what's the point of the tv makers to have created that feature in the 1st place?

scweb13 · 12-29-2010, 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wingman1977

I've noticed on the calibration settings on any tv that has the 120 or 140Hz features, they always say to turn them off. Why is that? I mean if it's that much of a negative for the picture quality, what's the point of the tv makers to have created that feature in the 1st place?

I believe you mean the motion interpolation feature. The 120/240 hz function is not something that can be turned off. It's on all the time.

Wingman1977 · 12-29-2010, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scweb13

I believe you mean the motion interpolation feature. The 120/240 hz function is not something that can be turned off. It's on all the time.

Well, the motionflow (which is what it's called on Sony tv's).

DavePS3 · 12-30-2010, 12:21 AM

Some people hate the motion flow but I prefer it. It is really taking 24 frame per second film material and bumping it to about 30 or 32 frames per second which is what video tape is shot at. Some people don't like the smoother flow because they feel it pulls you away from the original look and feel of film which, even in the theater, has a 'judder' on movement because of the slower frame rate. IMAX has a faster rate and larger frame.

Because I come from more of a video background - I used to be an off-line on-line editor before it was all computerized, I actually love the smoother flow. I notice much more detail in that flow than I do from 24 frame material. If you go to the theater and see a film, when a car goes past, there is a static movement because of the 24 frame rate. Put that on video like DVD/BD and the judder is worse because the frame rate does not line up for an equal transfer. This is when the phrase 2/3 pulldown comes into play. It can get pretty technical really but because LCD and LED have always had a tough time with speed, they have to bump up the refresh rate so although the 240hz handles fast motion better, you are kinda stuck with the smoother motion on film based material. On some sets, you can turn it off though like on some Samsung plasma models.

eric oc · 12-30-2010, 12:31 AM

People that don't like LED's generally don't like leds for this reason. It gives the tv a video game look or cartoon look that really annoys me.

Wingman1977 · 12-30-2010, 12:39 AM

I can see both sides of this. I guess traditionalists don't like the Automotion feature. I really don't mind it. I leave it on since I paid for it, I might as well get my money's worth and utilize the features of my tv to the fullest as I can.

ApolloOne · 12-30-2010, 03:20 AM

When someone pays me to calibrate his/her television, the smooth motion feature is one of the first things I turn off. No one has complained, and a few have been grateful. Especially the ones who hated what the feature did when they watched a fast moving action film with subtitles, resulting in smeared, unreadable words.

Wingman1977 · 12-30-2010, 03:03 PM

You know what? I just shut the motionflow off from my set. I don't get what's the point of this feature if it's being shut off by calibrators?

DMAN · 12-30-2010, 03:41 PM

I think technology has improved in the last couple years and the 120hz effect has been improved to add just enough smoothness without the overkill effect I saw on the the 1st generation Models.

I have a Samsung LN52A650 and I like the 120hz effect.

kpkelley · 12-30-2010, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wingman1977

You know what? I just shut the motionflow off from my set. I don't get what's the point of this feature if it's being shut off by calibrators?

A lot of people use it for non-film based material, i.e. sports and other television.

Wingman1977 · 12-30-2010, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMAN

I think technology has improved in the last couple years and the 120hz effect has been improved to add just enough smoothness without the overkill effect I saw on the the 1st generation Models.

I have a Samsung LN52A650 and I like the 120hz effect.

Even if that's the case (and it's most likely is), it's still shunned by calibrators.

Blu Brad · 12-30-2010, 04:55 PM

the problem with having a calibrator is its still going to come down to personal taste... so weather calibrators like it or not my motionflow is on high because i think its AWESOME

Wingman1977 · 12-30-2010, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blu Brad

the problem with having a calibrator is its still going to come down to personal taste... so weather calibrators like it or not my motionflow is on high because i think its AWESOME

Screw it, I put the motionflow back on.

Blu Brad · 12-30-2010, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wingman1977

Screw it, I put the motionflow back on.

live the dream...

Wingman1977 · 12-30-2010, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blu Brad

live the dream...

HHX · 12-30-2010, 06:30 PM

I sometimes use it on sports or live TV but I still see ghosting and halo's around objects from it (I notice it on all brands, not just my samsungs). so most of the time I have the "soap opera" feature off

Stormyhog · 04-18-2011, 03:30 PM

I have an LG 32" lcd 120 hz and it has trumotion which can be set low,high or off but to me it looks far better with it on. Whenever I turn it off the image stutters really bad. I understand the soap opera effect but with trumotion on my set turned on I don't see that effect at all. My tv is a 3 to 4 years old so maybe the feature in the newer models are taking the feature too far making it look that way.

Wingman1977 · 04-18-2011, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wingman1977

Now I've turned it off.

Aquel · 04-18-2011, 04:59 PM

I have motionflow on on my TV (Sony KDL40Z5500), but with film mode on auto 2. With this setting motionflow actually improves image quality in my opinion(I ran a test with the binoculars scenes in Star Wars The CLone Wars. Those binoculars show a lot of horizontal lines. With Motionflow turned off the lines got all smeary when the binoculars were being aimed at something else, Motionflow reduced this problem).

The effects are subtle but it probably helps so I leave it on. It never showed the video like effects (which I don't like) with film mode on auto 2.

With auto 1 I got a soap opera (which wasn't even consistent, some scenes were suddenly sped up and others looked normal..).

I do have to say, my neighbours have a Philips tv (seen from outside, so no idea which model it is) and there the motion interpolation is consistent, so it remains the same speed the whole time. It looks great for the material I usually see being watched there (news, cartoons, normal tv shows).

linkgx1 · 04-18-2011, 09:51 PM

I remember one of the first times I saw the feature was when Circuit City had Jumper playing. I was like, was this a "making of video". When the main character was driving in the car, it looked like they were in a blue-screen room!

But it looked so real. Pirates also looked incredibly real and fake at the same time.

12-29-2010, 11:13 PM	#1
Wingman1977 Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Mar 2008 Location:The empire state Trading Score:23	Question about the 120Hz & 240Hz I've noticed on the calibration settings on any tv that has the 120 or 140Hz features, they always say to turn them off. Why is that? I mean if it's that much of a negative for the picture quality, what's the point of the tv makers to have created that feature in the 1st place?

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12-30-2010, 12:21 AM	#4
DavePS3 Blu-ray Guru Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Toronto Home Theater Gallery:56 Blu-ray reviews:1 Trading Score:1	Some people hate the motion flow but I prefer it. It is really taking 24 frame per second film material and bumping it to about 30 or 32 frames per second which is what video tape is shot at. Some people don't like the smoother flow because they feel it pulls you away from the original look and feel of film which, even in the theater, has a 'judder' on movement because of the slower frame rate. IMAX has a faster rate and larger frame. Because I come from more of a video background - I used to be an off-line on-line editor before it was all computerized, I actually love the smoother flow. I notice much more detail in that flow than I do from 24 frame material. If you go to the theater and see a film, when a car goes past, there is a static movement because of the 24 frame rate. Put that on video like DVD/BD and the judder is worse because the frame rate does not line up for an equal transfer. This is when the phrase 2/3 pulldown comes into play. It can get pretty technical really but because LCD and LED have always had a tough time with speed, they have to bump up the refresh rate so although the 240hz handles fast motion better, you are kinda stuck with the smoother motion on film based material. On some sets, you can turn it off though like on some Samsung plasma models.

12-30-2010, 12:31 AM	#5
eric oc Active Member Member since:Nov 2009 Blu-ray collection:83	People that don't like LED's generally don't like leds for this reason. It gives the tv a video game look or cartoon look that really annoys me.

12-30-2010, 12:39 AM	#6
Wingman1977 Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Mar 2008 Location:The empire state Trading Score:23	I can see both sides of this. I guess traditionalists don't like the Automotion feature. I really don't mind it. I leave it on since I paid for it, I might as well get my money's worth and utilize the features of my tv to the fullest as I can.

12-30-2010, 03:20 AM	#7
ApolloOne Senior Member Top contributor Member since:Jul 2010 Location:USA Trading Score:7	When someone pays me to calibrate his/her television, the smooth motion feature is one of the first things I turn off. No one has complained, and a few have been grateful. Especially the ones who hated what the feature did when they watched a fast moving action film with subtitles, resulting in smeared, unreadable words.

12-30-2010, 03:03 PM	#8
Wingman1977 Blu-ray Champion Top contributor Member since:Mar 2008 Location:The empire state Trading Score:23	You know what? I just shut the motionflow off from my set. I don't get what's the point of this feature if it's being shut off by calibrators?

12-30-2010, 03:41 PM	#9
DMAN Active Member Member since:Mar 2008	I think technology has improved in the last couple years and the 120hz effect has been improved to add just enough smoothness without the overkill effect I saw on the the 1st generation Models. I have a Samsung LN52A650 and I like the 120hz effect.

12-30-2010, 04:55 PM	#12
Blu Brad Active Member Member since:Aug 2009 Location:Chester, UK Home Theater Gallery:57 Blu-ray collection:338 Trading Score:1	the problem with having a calibrator is its still going to come down to personal taste... so weather calibrators like it or not my motionflow is on high because i think its *AWESOME*

12-30-2010, 06:30 PM	#16
HHX Expert Member Member since:Oct 2008 Blu-ray collection:1 Blu-ray reviews:2	I sometimes use it on sports or live TV but I still see ghosting and halo's around objects from it (I notice it on all brands, not just my samsungs). so most of the time I have the "soap opera" feature off

04-18-2011, 03:30 PM	#17
Stormyhog Member Member since:Mar 2007 Location:Canada	I have an LG 32" lcd 120 hz and it has trumotion which can be set low,high or off but to me it looks far better with it on. Whenever I turn it off the image stutters really bad. I understand the soap opera effect but with trumotion on my set turned on I don't see that effect at all. My tv is a 3 to 4 years old so maybe the feature in the newer models are taking the feature too far making it look that way.

04-18-2011, 04:59 PM	#19
Aquel Senior Member Top contributor Member since:Jan 2011 4K collection:4 Blu-ray collection:139 DVD collection:10	I have motionflow on on my TV (Sony KDL40Z5500), but with film mode on auto 2. With this setting motionflow actually improves image quality in my opinion(I ran a test with the binoculars scenes in Star Wars The CLone Wars. Those binoculars show a lot of horizontal lines. With Motionflow turned off the lines got all smeary when the binoculars were being aimed at something else, Motionflow reduced this problem). The effects are subtle but it probably helps so I leave it on. It never showed the video like effects (which I don't like) with film mode on auto 2. With auto 1 I got a soap opera (which wasn't even consistent, some scenes were suddenly sped up and others looked normal..). I do have to say, my neighbours have a Philips tv (seen from outside, so no idea which model it is) and there the motion interpolation is consistent, so it remains the same speed the whole time. It looks great for the material I usually see being watched there (news, cartoons, normal tv shows).

04-18-2011, 09:51 PM	#20
linkgx1 Banned Member since:Feb 2011 Location:Saint Louis, MO	I remember one of the first times I saw the feature was when Circuit City had Jumper playing. I was like, was this a "making of video". When the main character was driving in the car, it looked like they were in a blue-screen room! But it looked so real. Pirates also looked incredibly real and fake at the same time.

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