Silent Films on Blu - Blu-ray Forum

Nathan Arizona · 08-21-2009, 05:37 PM

Very happy to read that Sunrise is coming out soon. Is this the first silent feature to be released on blu ray? Really curious to see how films of this era transfer to hd, I would imagine the film stock doesn't quite have the detail of films made in the mid 30s and onwards.

Hopefully we'll be getting more - the complete Metropolis is rumored for next year. I'd love to see Dovzhenko's Arsenal and Earth get blu ray treatment, but that's probably not likely.

Octavio · 08-22-2009, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Arizona

Very happy to read that Sunrise is coming out soon. Is this the first silent feature to be released on blu ray? Really curious to see how films of this era transfer to hd, I would imagine the film stock doesn't quite have the detail of films made in the mid 30s and onwards.

Hopefully we'll be getting more - the complete Metropolis is rumored for next year. I'd love to see Dovzhenko's Arsenal and Earth get blu ray treatment, but that's probably not likely.

'Wings' have been also rumored. But so far it's only that, a rumour.

retablo · 08-22-2009, 02:22 AM

Maybe next we can get the Abel Gance collection, with "J'Accuse", "La Roue" & "Napoleon"... with "Napoleon" uncut (not the Coppola recut) and its partial 4.00:1 aspect ratio intact.

JJJ225 · 08-22-2009, 01:02 PM

There is an import version of Sunrise I think. Or a release was planned (for Britain I think). Kino had announced Metropolis, but literally days later they discovered that lost footage, so I'm assuming they're waiting for that to be restored.

JJJ225 · 08-22-2009, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan Arizona

Very happy to read that Sunrise is coming out soon. Is this the first silent feature to be released on blu ray?.

Is there a region A release announcement that I missed?

koontz1973 · 08-22-2009, 01:08 PM

Imagine all those people with great sound systems who will not buy these films for this reason.

Be nice to see the early cinema on Blu, like Charlie Chaplin, Buster Keaton etc.

Robert Harris · 08-22-2009, 01:22 PM

A problem looming over potential Blu-ray releases of "silent" films is the inability to control speed. I don't believe that this has been solved as yet.

JJJ225 · 08-22-2009, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert Harris

A problem looming over potential Blu-ray releases of "silent" films is the inability to control speed. I don't believe that this has been solved as yet.

Huh?

Mr.White · 08-22-2009, 01:51 PM

I don't think silent films will look any better on blu than on DVD(the source material is old and usually in rough shape) , I have the Fox DVD of "Sunrise" which looks pretty good.

Pyoko · 08-22-2009, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJJ225

Huh?

Many silent films were filmed before 24 fps became a standard. So the speed would vary from film to film, often being shot or shown at speeds such as 16 or 18 fps.

Blu-ray on the other hand only supports 23.976 fps, 24 fps, 25 fps (through 50i) and 29.97 fps (through 59.94i). Thus it would be impossible to encode a 16 fps film in its native speed, and you would either have to speed it up, or convert the frame rate, which would introduce ghosting/blending of frames or other artifacts.

Nathan Arizona · 08-22-2009, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr.White

I don't think silent films will look any better on blu than on DVD(the source material is old and usually in rough shape) , I have the Fox DVD of "Sunrise" which looks pretty good.

I wonder about that too. I`ve seen some excellent looking silents from Kino and MK2 that should benefit from the better resolution of blu ray. The most recent realeases of Metropolis and The General come to mind. I saw a new print of October a few years back that also looked fantastic. This resease of Sunrise should be telling, which looks like a region B release (time for region free player).

tigtat77 · 08-22-2009, 03:02 PM

Bring on "Silent Movie"!!!!!!!!

Weirded Wonder · 08-22-2009, 03:07 PM

Thought I would chime in for Metropolis. The Blu will feature the restored version.

http://www.cinematical.com/2008/07/0...ssing-footage/

It should be noted that the 'original' version that has been discovered is 25 minuted longer. I cannot find out if it is 25 minutes longer than the restored version from 2003 or from the cut version that most of us grew up with.

Knapsack · 08-22-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJJ225

Is there a region A release announcement that I missed?

I don't believe so. The only release I've heard of is through Eureka's Masters of Cinema Collection.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sunrise-Mast...0196615&sr=1-1

Quote:

Many silent films were filmed before 24 fps became a standard. So the speed would vary from film to film, often being shot or shown at speeds such as 16 or 18 fps.

I don't think we have to worry about that. They figured out how to play the films at the proper speed on DVD, so I don't see why Blu-ray would cause any new problems in that arena. Besides, I'm quite confident that Masters of Cinema isn't going to release a Blu-ray disc of Sunrise at the ridiculously wrong speed. I have faith in them.

Quote:

I don't think silent films will look any better on blu than on DVD(the source material is old and usually in rough shape)

I disagree--I think many will benefit from Blu-ray. There are a lot of silents that exist in very fine 35mm prints. Look at the silents that the Criterion Collection has released--I think The Passion of Joan of Arc (1928) and Pandora's Box (1929) would look fantastic on Blu. Also, most of Fritz Lang's silent features exist in amazingly good quality prints that have received meticulous restorations. Those films would look much better on Blu than on DVD. There are a great many other silents that are also in great shape. I, for one, welcome the silents to Blu.

JJJ225 · 08-23-2009, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyoko

Many silent films were filmed before 24 fps became a standard. So the speed would vary from film to film, often being shot or shown at speeds such as 16 or 18 fps.

Blu-ray on the other hand only supports 23.976 fps, 24 fps, 25 fps (through 50i) and 29.97 fps (through 59.94i). Thus it would be impossible to encode a 16 fps film in its native speed, and you would either have to speed it up, or convert the frame rate, which would introduce ghosting/blending of frames or other artifacts.

I knew that there were plenty films filmed at speeds slower than sound speed, but I wasn't aware that Blu Ray didn't support 16 or 18 fps. Thanks for the info!

Nathan Arizona · 08-23-2009, 05:56 AM

I agree about The Passion of Joan of Arc being ideal for Blu Ray with all those intense close-up shots--plus it's an early Criterion release that needs additional restoration work.

syncguy · 08-23-2009, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyoko

Many silent films were filmed before 24 fps became a standard. So the speed would vary from film to film, often being shot or shown at speeds such as 16 or 18 fps.

Blu-ray on the other hand only supports 23.976 fps, 24 fps, 25 fps (through 50i) and 29.97 fps (through 59.94i). Thus it would be impossible to encode a 16 fps film in its native speed, and you would either have to speed it up, or convert the frame rate, which would introduce ghosting/blending of frames or other artifacts.

This shouldn't be an issue. The blu-ray transfer will fill the gaps by repeating frames and making 24fps from the original 16 or 18 fps.

Maswov · 08-23-2009, 09:47 AM

Will that be released in 5.1 or 7.1

syncguy · 08-23-2009, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maswov

Will that be released in 5.1 or 7.1

7.1 I expect

Seriously, would they add a music track? A live orchestra plays music for silent movies?

Stuart_Larkin · 08-23-2009, 10:13 AM

I want the silent versions of Ben-hur and The Ten Commandments on blu-ray.
The Silent version of Ben-hur is pretty much just as good as the Heston version.

08-21-2009, 05:37 PM	#1
Nathan Arizona Junior Member Member since:Feb 2009 Blu-ray reviews:31	Silent Films on Blu Very happy to read that Sunrise is coming out soon. Is this the first silent feature to be released on blu ray? Really curious to see how films of this era transfer to hd, I would imagine the film stock doesn't quite have the detail of films made in the mid 30s and onwards. Hopefully we'll be getting more - the complete Metropolis is rumored for next year. I'd love to see Dovzhenko's Arsenal and Earth get blu ray treatment, but that's probably not likely.

08-22-2009, 03:07 PM	#13
Weirded Wonder Blu-ray Samurai Top contributor Member since:May 2009 Home Theater Gallery:17 4K collection:593 Blu-ray collection:1177 Trading Score:51	Thought I would chime in for Metropolis. The Blu will feature the restored version. http://www.cinematical.com/2008/07/0...ssing-footage/ It should be noted that the 'original' version that has been discovered is 25 minuted longer. I cannot find out if it is 25 minutes longer than the restored version from 2003 or from the cut version that most of us grew up with. Last edited by Weirded Wonder; 08-22-2009 at 03:11 PM.

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08-22-2009, 02:22 AM	#3
retablo Banned Member since:Jul 2007 Location:Hollywood Blu-ray collection:1307 Trading Score:1	Maybe next we can get the Abel Gance collection, with "J'Accuse", "La Roue" & "Napoleon"... with "Napoleon" uncut (not the Coppola recut) and its partial 4.00:1 aspect ratio intact.

08-22-2009, 01:02 PM	#4
JJJ225 Power Member Top contributor Member since:Sep 2008 Location:New York City 4K collection:15 Blu-ray collection:104 DVD collection:1 Trading Score:32	There is an import version of Sunrise I think. Or a release was planned (for Britain I think). Kino had announced Metropolis, but literally days later they discovered that lost footage, so I'm assuming they're waiting for that to be restored.

08-22-2009, 01:08 PM	#6
koontz1973 Blu-ray Guru Member since:Mar 2009 Location:Insane Alylum for the over achievers. Blu-ray collection:133	Imagine all those people with great sound systems who will not buy these films for this reason. Be nice to see the early cinema on Blu, like Charlie Chaplin, Buster Keaton etc.

08-22-2009, 01:22 PM	#7
Robert Harris Senior Member Member since:Oct 2007	A problem looming over potential Blu-ray releases of "silent" films is the inability to control speed. I don't believe that this has been solved as yet.

08-22-2009, 01:51 PM	#9
Mr.White Banned Member since:Jan 2009 Blu-ray collection:502 Blu-ray reviews:29	I don't think silent films will look any better on blu than on DVD(the source material is old and usually in rough shape) , I have the Fox DVD of "Sunrise" which looks pretty good.

08-22-2009, 03:02 PM	#12
tigtat77 Special Member Member since:Jan 2008 Location:San Diego 4K collection:211 Blu-ray collection:777 Trading Score:109	Bring on "Silent Movie"!!!!!!!!

08-23-2009, 05:56 AM	#16
Nathan Arizona Junior Member Member since:Feb 2009 Blu-ray reviews:31	I agree about The Passion of Joan of Arc being ideal for Blu Ray with all those intense close-up shots--plus it's an early Criterion release that needs additional restoration work.

08-23-2009, 09:47 AM	#18
Maswov Active Member Member since:Mar 2009 Location:Sattahip, Thailand Blu-ray collection:91	Will that be released in 5.1 or 7.1

08-23-2009, 10:13 AM	#20
Stuart_Larkin Senior Member Member since:Apr 2007 Blu-ray collection:521 DVD collection:4	I want the silent versions of Ben-hur and The Ten Commandments on blu-ray. The Silent version of Ben-hur is pretty much just as good as the Heston version.

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