Fantastic 4 (BD) vs Transformers (HD-DVD) - Blu-ray Forum

kknight · 10-21-2007, 09:20 PM

Has anyone seen Transformers PQ?? I was at Ultimate Electronics last night and was watching Transformers in HD-DVD. All I can say is, how the F*** did this movie get rated near perfect scores from critics when I and my friend agreed that the PQ was awful!!! I felt like I was watching Click (BD) which were first generation of Blu-ray movies... There were a lot of grain, especially in the dark, the trasnfer did not seem clean at all... When I compare this to Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer, it doesn't even come close in terms of PQ. On the other TV next to Transformers, it was showing Superman Returns on Blu-ray, even that looked better.

WickyWoo · 10-21-2007, 09:29 PM

Are you sure they didn't just put the DVD into the HD DVD player?

kknight · 10-21-2007, 09:40 PM

Yep, it was running on a Toshiba HD-DVD player with a Toshiba 1080p LCD. I can tell it was hi-def.

jorg · 10-21-2007, 09:42 PM

set up probly bad then?

jhansla · 10-21-2007, 09:48 PM

lol I picked up Transformers HD-DVD yesterday and watched it last night. I thought it was amazing myself and definitely showcase material

davidPS3 · 10-21-2007, 09:49 PM

FF looks great on Blu. Though I have to say that Transformers looks pretty good on a PS3 upscaled.

Banjo · 10-21-2007, 09:49 PM

I thought the DVD looked quite good when upconverted on the PS3. Not Blu-ray quality though.

Gamma_Winstead · 10-21-2007, 10:14 PM

transformers and FF 2 are both

quality.

gandley · 10-21-2007, 10:38 PM

I have transformers on HDDVD, (oi put that rock down) and i have to say i was underwelmed, i was expecting much better, but to be frank its a good encode, but its not the best AVC encode as it lacks the clarity of some others i can think off, and at times the picture does look a bit soft.

Sound was not on par with the BD lossless audio tracks, not even close. i watched spidey 3 first and then transformers sounded less dynamic, and definately lacked punch and clarity.

Transformers if it was on BD (but in its HDDVD guise spec wise) would be considered a good encode but not reference.

Hype is pushing this titles as its a good movie, and about the only thing worth buying on HDDVD until borne comes out. So the HDDVD fans are pushing the title for all its worth but for them its a good AVC encode compared to alot of crap they have been getting from Universal etc, so for them i guess it does look hot.

Knowing if this was on BD it would of been incredible with lossless audio and highbitrate AVC is abit of a crime for movie fans.

aristotles · 10-21-2007, 10:47 PM

Not to defend Transformers HD DVD but in general, store displays are setup poorly. If the TV has the default settings then it will most likely have Sharpen set to 60% which will bring out all of the grain including grain that should be hidden in the image itself and bring out all of the compression artifacts that should normally be invisible or hard to catch.

Think of it like taking picture compressed with JPG, loading it into Photoshop and applying sharpen filter several times.

I was initially turned off getting a 1080p display because I thought blu-rays like A Knights tail were going to have all sorts of grain on such displays based on how the TV's in the stores were setup. They are all setup to make soft HD look sharp.

Also, turning on the noise filter can tone down the grain a bit without loosing too much detail.

teacher_man99 · 10-21-2007, 10:55 PM

Transformers HD DVD looked great, just finished watching it.

SBrooks1 · 10-21-2007, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kknight

There were a lot of grain, especially in the dark, the trasnfer did not seem clean at all...

Grain is part of the movie. That's how it was filmed, how it looked in the theater and how it looks on the DVD/HD-DVD.

cpgator · 10-22-2007, 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBrooks1

Grain is part of the movie. That's how it was filmed, how it looked in the theater and how it looks on the DVD/HD-DVD.

Correct. Some people seem to think that grain = bad PQ.

Finally got to watch the HD-DVD this weekend - Amazing! Not sure why everyone was trashing this movie - It was extremely fun to watch. Picture was amazing, and the audio sounded great. I did notice that I had to turn it more than other movies, though.

gandley · 10-22-2007, 04:49 PM

yeah the film grain was preserved quite well, it was nice to see transformers without that filtered look you get with some other titles on hd-dvd

patrick99 · 10-22-2007, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gandley

yeah the film grain was preserved quite well, it was nice to see transformers without that filtered look you get with some other titles on hd-dvd

Unfortunately the filtered look is not limited to HD DVD but is carried over by Warner to the BD versions as well.

gandley · 10-22-2007, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patrick99

Unfortunately the filtered look is not limited to HD DVD but is carried over by Warner to the BD versions as well.

indeed.

kknight · 10-23-2007, 02:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpgator

Correct. Some people seem to think that grain = bad PQ.

Finally got to watch the HD-DVD this weekend - Amazing! Not sure why everyone was trashing this movie - It was extremely fun to watch. Picture was amazing, and the audio sounded great. I did notice that I had to turn it more than other movies, though.

I understand that grain is part of the movie, maybe in the day time the movies look outstanding. The time I watched it was at night time, I can see white dots in black which I thought looks awful. I noticed this type of transfer on first generation movies (Miami Vice & Crash), not so much anymore on new BD movies... I just don't think this movie deserves a 4 1/2 or perfect scores.

BTBuck1 · 10-23-2007, 02:30 AM

I can tell you from personel experience that it does look great. However because of the director intent, pumped up color/contrast could be offensive to some.

If your TV has calibration opportunies this disc will exploit them.

Footloose301 · 10-23-2007, 02:34 AM

The Transformers HD DVD looked like crap. I posted in another thread about it. Very grainy in the darker areas and not consistant AT ALL.

SBrooks1 · 10-23-2007, 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Footloose301

The Transformers HD DVD looked like crap. I posted in another thread about it. Very grainy in the darker areas and not consistant AT ALL.

You have no knowledge of how movies are filmed and what's involved with using certain types of film stock during night scenes.

10-21-2007, 09:20 PM	#1
kknight Senior Member Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Minnesota Blu-ray reviews:55	Fantastic 4 (BD) vs Transformers (HD-DVD) Has anyone seen Transformers PQ?? I was at Ultimate Electronics last night and was watching Transformers in HD-DVD. All I can say is, how the F*** did this movie get rated near perfect scores from critics when I and my friend agreed that the PQ was awful!!! I felt like I was watching Click (BD) which were first generation of Blu-ray movies... There were a lot of grain, especially in the dark, the trasnfer did not seem clean at all... When I compare this to Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer, it doesn't even come close in terms of PQ. On the other TV next to Transformers, it was showing Superman Returns on Blu-ray, even that looked better.

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10-21-2007, 09:29 PM	#2
WickyWoo Blu-ray Champion Member since:May 2007 Trading Score:2	Are you sure they didn't just put the DVD into the HD DVD player?

10-21-2007, 09:40 PM	#3
kknight Senior Member Member since:Jan 2007 Location:Minnesota Blu-ray reviews:55	Yep, it was running on a Toshiba HD-DVD player with a Toshiba 1080p LCD. I can tell it was hi-def.

10-21-2007, 09:42 PM	#4
jorg Power Member Member since:Dec 2006 Location:Ontario, Canada Home Theater Gallery:2	set up probly bad then?

10-21-2007, 09:48 PM	#5
jhansla Expert Member Member since:Feb 2007 Location:Orlando, Florida Blu-ray collection:257 Trading Score:3	lol I picked up Transformers HD-DVD yesterday and watched it last night. I thought it was amazing myself and definitely showcase material

10-21-2007, 09:49 PM	#6
davidPS3 Special Member Member since:Jul 2007 Location:Seattle	FF looks great on Blu. Though I have to say that Transformers looks pretty good on a PS3 upscaled.

10-21-2007, 09:49 PM	#7
Banjo Blu-ray Guru Member since:Dec 2006 Location:Ontario, Canada Blu-ray collection:143	I thought the DVD looked quite good when upconverted on the PS3. Not Blu-ray quality though.

10-21-2007, 10:14 PM	#8
Gamma_Winstead Blu-ray Prince Top contributor Member since:Jul 2007 Location:U.S.G. Ishimura 4K collection:118 Blu-ray collection:764 Blu-ray reviews: 36 Trading Score:6	transformers and FF 2 are both quality.

10-21-2007, 10:38 PM	#9
gandley Special Member Member since:Feb 2007 Location:The Drowning Pool	I have transformers on HDDVD, (oi put that rock down) and i have to say i was underwelmed, i was expecting much better, but to be frank its a good encode, but its not the best AVC encode as it lacks the clarity of some others i can think off, and at times the picture does look a bit soft. Sound was not on par with the BD lossless audio tracks, not even close. i watched spidey 3 first and then transformers sounded less dynamic, and definately lacked punch and clarity. Transformers if it was on BD (but in its HDDVD guise spec wise) would be considered a good encode but not reference. Hype is pushing this titles as its a good movie, and about the only thing worth buying on HDDVD until borne comes out. So the HDDVD fans are pushing the title for all its worth but for them its a good AVC encode compared to alot of crap they have been getting from Universal etc, so for them i guess it does look hot. Knowing if this was on BD it would of been incredible with lossless audio and highbitrate AVC is abit of a crime for movie fans.

10-21-2007, 10:47 PM	#10
aristotles Expert Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Canada Blu-ray collection:401 Blu-ray reviews:1	Not to defend Transformers HD DVD but in general, store displays are setup poorly. If the TV has the default settings then it will most likely have Sharpen set to 60% which will bring out all of the grain including grain that should be hidden in the image itself and bring out all of the compression artifacts that should normally be invisible or hard to catch. Think of it like taking picture compressed with JPG, loading it into Photoshop and applying sharpen filter several times. I was initially turned off getting a 1080p display because I thought blu-rays like A Knights tail were going to have all sorts of grain on such displays based on how the TV's in the stores were setup. They are all setup to make soft HD look sharp. Also, turning on the noise filter can tone down the grain a bit without loosing too much detail.

10-21-2007, 10:55 PM	#11
teacher_man99 Active Member Member since:Mar 2007	Transformers HD DVD looked great, just finished watching it.

10-22-2007, 04:49 PM	#14
gandley Special Member Member since:Feb 2007 Location:The Drowning Pool	yeah the film grain was preserved quite well, it was nice to see transformers without that filtered look you get with some other titles on hd-dvd

10-23-2007, 02:30 AM	#18
BTBuck1 Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Jun 2006 Location:Oceanside, CA. Blu-ray collection:507 DVD collection:1	I can tell you from personel experience that it does look great. However because of the director intent, pumped up color/contrast could be offensive to some. If your TV has calibration opportunies this disc will exploit them.

10-23-2007, 02:34 AM	#19
Footloose301 Special Member Member since:May 2007 Location:Fort Myers, FL Home Theater Gallery:38 4K collection:2 Blu-ray collection:2 Blu-ray reviews: 1	The Transformers HD DVD looked like crap. I posted in another thread about it. Very grainy in the darker areas and not consistant AT ALL.

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