UHD player for the PC

[SVTStingRay]

anyone know when a drive for the pc is coming out

..........bueller............bueller..........

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by SVTStingRay

anyone know when a drive for the pc is coming out

..........bueller............bueller..........

Some say that later BDXL capable models already can read these discs, it's just that the industry has to license software players and give them the encryption keys to do so.

They may be reluctant to do that given that these discs are closer to the studio masters than ever before.

[Jeff R 1]

2017, according to Cyberlink-Hicham (administrator over at Cyberlink)

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/47675.page

I also have one of those drives from LG that can read the UHD Blu-rays, but with out any AACS 2.0 authentication in the drive, it isn't much good.

[applemac]

Can't wait. Hopefully there will be an official update on this at some point.

[jeff_rigby]

Originally Posted by Jeff R 1

2017, according to Cyberlink-Hicham (administrator over at Cyberlink)

http://forum.cyberlink.com/forum/posts/list/47675.page

I also have one of those drives from LG that can read the UHD Blu-rays, but with out any AACS 2.0 authentication in the drive, it isn't much good.

UHD AACS 2.0 and BD+ must be run in what amounts to a TEE that has a Trusted boot. On a PC that requires Windows 10 and AMD drivers or Nvidia or Intel. This I think is part of the holdup. The PC drive, provided it already supports BDXL must be updated to support a on-line server for pairing encryption over the USB or eSATA bus between drive and TEE. What amounts to a white list/black list server is also required.

The PS4 and XB1 are getting firmware updated to support UHD late this year.

UHD Blu-ray Game Consoles shipped in 2013 but won't be firmware updated to support it till 2016. There is a BDA Licence for UHD Blu-ray game consoles and Sony has a License for a UHD Movie player/Game Console/test player and a License for a UHD Blu-ray PC application. There is a second paper naming both the XB1 and PS4 as UHD game consoles. The PS3 and Xbox 360 are labeled as HD.

[dvdmike]

Are you paid to post that fud about firmware upgrades?

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by jeff_rigby

UHD AACS 2.0 and BD+ must be run in what amounts to a TEE that has a Trusted boot. On a PC that requires Windows 10 and AMD drivers or Nvidia or Intel. This I think is part of the holdup. The PC drive, provided it already supports BDXL must be updated to support a on-line server for pairing encryption over the USB or eSATA bus between drive and TEE. What amounts to a white list/black list server is also required.

The PS4 and XB1 are getting firmware updated to support UHD late this year.

Even so, the PS4, for instance, will still need the newest hardware HDMI support and so that means a version 2 of the console will have to be released just like the previous PS3 (fat and then slim models).

[jeff_rigby]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

Even so, the PS4, for instance, will still need the newest hardware HDMI support and so that means a version 2 of the console will have to be released just like the previous PS3 (fat and then slim models).

Read the first page of the second paper. The Launch XB1 and PS4 are UHD Capable which means they have the Trusted boot and TEE with HDCP 2.2 taking place in the TEE and mapped to the HDMI port. In the case of the PS4, it has a custom Panasonic HDMI chip to support HDMI 2 with mapping to the Southbridge ARM Trustzone TEE.

UHD Blu-ray Game Consoles shipped in 2013 but won't be firmware updated to support it till 2016. There is a BDA Licence for UHD Blu-ray game consoles and Sony has a License for a UHD Movie player/Game Console/test player and a License for a UHD Blu-ray PC application. There is a second paper naming both the XB1 and PS4 as UHD game consoles. The PS3 and Xbox 360 are labeled as HD.

HDCP 2.0 was developed in 2008, 2.1 was found to be vulnerable and 2.2 developed in 2012. It was primarily used for streaming DRM like DTCP-IP and Miracast. In Feb 2013 the standards for HDCP 2.2 running in a TEE mapped to the HDMI port was published, anyone part of the HDMI org would have access to that project way before Feb 2013...HINT Sony is a HDMI member. The HDMI 2 port to be backwardly compatible with HDMI 1.4 has to use the same negotiation, voltages, pins etc. HDMI 2 must support the newer clock speeds which were known before 2012 and in all platforms must pass negotiations for HDCP be it 1.4 or 2.2 to the TEE. HDCP 2.2 running in the TEE is also used for Miracast and DTCP-IP as well as HDMI 2 which has a HDMI 2 over lan feature which the platform labels as HDMI in the Source Menu on the TV. HDMI 2 over LAN never touches either HDMI port either Transmitter or Receiver, it's all software with the requirement that HDCP 2.2 occurs in the TEE.

[jeff_rigby]

Originally Posted by dvdmike

Are you paid to post that fud about firmware upgrades?

You have Fear Uncertainty and Doubt which could be alleviated if you read the cites I provide.

I have no uncertainty or doubt, certainly no fear that I am wrong on this as I have done the research and have provided Cites for everyone to read and confirm.

If you are technically challenged you can rely on two points, the Microsoft VP stated the Launch XB1 has the hardware to play UHD Disks and second, the paper above that states the PS4 and XB1 are UHD Capable.

I do not understand why there is so much resistance to the idea that Sony wanted it as easy as possible to support UHD Blu-ray with standard blu-ray drives. Three layer 100 GB is easy to produce and easy to read with a standard Blu-ray drive able to be firmware updated. There are many other incompatible harder to implement standards with greater storage capacity they could have used that would have required a new drive.

[James Freeman]

I doubt that there will be UHD Bluray support for PC in the next 2 years.

There is no point if the GPU doesn't support HDMI 2.0a (it'll be 2.1 by then).
The minimum we'll need is a new BD Drive and a new GPU.

It'll be no fun if the display doesn't support, local dimming HDR, wider gamut, and 4k.
So sRGB (709) PC monitors is definitely not the way to watch UHD Bluray.
The chances that there will be an HDR PC monitor are none.

For UHD Bluray HTPC you'll have to buy:
1. PowerDVD 2017.
2. UHD Bluray disc drive.
3. Powerful PC.
4. Powerful GPU with HDMI 2.0a or 2.1.
5. New HDR TV.

Might as well give up on the HTPC and go for a UHD Bluray Player and an HDR TV.

[jeff_rigby]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

I doubt that there will be UHD Bluray support for PC in the next 2 years.

There is no point if the GPU doesn't support HDMI 2.0a (it'll be 2.1 by then).
The minimum we'll need is a new BD Drive and a new GPU.

It'll be no fun if the display doesn't support, local dimming HDR, wider gamut, and 4k.
So sRGB (709) PC monitors is definitely not the way to watch UHD Bluray.
The chances that there will be an HDR PC monitor are none.

For UHD Bluray HTPC you'll have to buy:
1. PowerDVD 2017 or Sony's PC UHD application.
2. UHD Bluray disc drive. (BDXL or BD-ROM that the manufacturer will firmware update)
3. Powerful PC Not needed as ALL UHD occurs in a ARM trustzone block in AMD APUs and dGPUs or dedicated hardware in Intel APUs.
4. Powerful GPU with HDMI 2.0a or 2.1 not needed as the Power of the GPU is irrelevant, it just has to be a newer version with a trusted boot TEE. Same for various HDR schemes which is just software running in the TEE.
5. New HDR TV in the living room or as the monitor.

Might as well give up on the HTPC and go for a UHD Bluray Player and an HDR TV.

Polaris is a dGPU that supports UHD. Carrizo is an APU that supports UHD. The UHD Player requires a trusted boot for a TEE and AACS 2 decryption as well as HDCP 2.2 encryption takes place in that TEE. Optimally DDR3/4 or HBM will be used as they supports power modes like Network standby and low media power. GDDR5 can not be used for network standby but can be clocked slower to support a sorta low power media mode (5 watts or so greater than HBM).


Who watches UHD movies on their PC? It's assumed the PC UHD player application supports UHD blu-ray digital bridge (Vidipath) or HDMI 2 over LAN to support remote playing the UHD movie on any Vidipath STB then to a UHD TV with a HDMI 2 traditional or HDMI 2 over LAN.

[prerich]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

I doubt that there will be UHD Bluray support for PC in the next 2 years.

There is no point if the GPU doesn't support HDMI 2.0a (it'll be 2.1 by then).
The minimum we'll need is a new BD Drive and a new GPU.

It'll be no fun if the display doesn't support, local dimming HDR, wider gamut, and 4k.
So sRGB (709) PC monitors is definitely not the way to watch UHD Bluray.
The chances that there will be an HDR PC monitor are none.

For UHD Bluray HTPC you'll have to buy:
1. PowerDVD 2017.
2. UHD Bluray disc drive.
3. Powerful PC.
4. Powerful GPU with HDMI 2.0a or 2.1.
5. New HDR TV.

Might as well give up on the HTPC and go for a UHD Bluray Player and an HDR TV.

If there are HDR TV's - you also have HDR monitors...just use a TV as your monitor. That's what most HTPC people use anyway - most of us don't watch on a computer screen...its usually a projector or a TV.

The PC itself doesn't need to be that powerful. The GPU...We currently have HDMI 2.0 and HDCP 2.2 compliant video cards for under $150. PowerDVD is currently testing drives that can read the file structure of UHD BD's (I have one such drive myself - make sure you get one of the BDXL's that pump out around 63mbps, you need at least 30mbps for UHD). The issue is getting the player - which Cyberlink is currently working on. http://www.cyberlink.com/eng/press_r...31_36210_0_ENU

So basically it's not an if, its a when.

[Jeff R 1]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

I doubt that there will be UHD Bluray support for PC in the next 2 years.

There is no point if the GPU doesn't support HDMI 2.0a (it'll be 2.1 by then).
The minimum we'll need is a new BD Drive and a new GPU.

It'll be no fun if the display doesn't support, local dimming HDR, wider gamut, and 4k.
So sRGB (709) PC monitors is definitely not the way to watch UHD Bluray.
The chances that there will be an HDR PC monitor are none.

For UHD Bluray HTPC you'll have to buy:
1. PowerDVD 2017.
2. UHD Bluray disc drive.
3. Powerful PC.
4. Powerful GPU with HDMI 2.0a or 2.1.
5. New HDR TV.

Might as well give up on the HTPC and go for a UHD Bluray Player and an HDR TV.

Why would any one with an HTPC plan on using a dinky PC monitor to watch UHD Blu-rays ?
I would go for an UHD Blu-ray player if it has some sort of internal FI system.
My Sony 300es can't do FI at 2160p, so my only hope for an HTPC.

[jeff_rigby]

Looks like NO PC or Game Console will have a UHD BLu-ray player till after September due to this:

Originally Posted by https://www.w3.org/blog/2016/04/html-media-extensions-to-continue-work/

The HTML Media Extensions Working Group was extended today (April 2016) until the end of September 2016. As part of making video a first class citizen of the Web, an effort started by HTML5 itself in 2007, W3C has been working on many extension specifications for the Open Web Platform: capturing images from the local device camera, handling of video streams and tracks, captioning and other enhancements for accessibility, audio processing, real-time communications, etc. The HTML Media Extensions Working Group is working on two of those extensions: Media Sources Extensions (MSE), for facilitating adaptive and live streaming, and Encrypted Media Extensions (EME), for playback of protected content. Both are extension specifications to enhance the Open Web Platform with rich media support.

Since all UHD Media uses HTML5 <video> MSE EME in some manor (UHD BLu-ray uses the C-ENC format but with AACS2) this could explain the PS4 and XB1 as UHD Capable Consoles not being firmware updated till after September 2016.

[bming]

I have been shooting in 4K for a few months now= before that I shot if full HD and burnt BlueRay disks for playpack on TV's and Projectors on standard Blue-Ray players. As an amateur film maker my films are short -30 minutes max so quad layer Blueray would be an overkill. Is it yet possible to burn native 4K blueray on a normal BlurRay-R disk. Would it not be a software solution to be able to do this using my current BlueRay burner and would a 4K player be capable of playing the disk.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by bming

I have been shooting in 4K for a few months now= before that I shot if full HD and burnt BlueRay disks for playpack on TV's and Projectors on standard Blue-Ray players. As an amateur film maker my films are short -30 minutes max so quad layer Blueray would be an overkill. Is it yet possible to burn native 4K blueray on a normal BlurRay-R disk. Would it not be a software solution to be able to do this using my current BlueRay burner and would a 4K player be capable of playing the disk.

I would think if the data/bit rate doesn't saturate the capabilities of a BD-R, it fits within a BD-25, and somebody could play the 2160p file on the computer or send it to a 4k TV given a video card that supports UHD resolutions and frame rates, you could just use the BD-R as a file storage device, like a thumb drive. There wouldn't be a menu structure, of course.

We are talking about your short 4k projects, correct?

[bming]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

I would think if the data/bit rate doesn't saturate the capabilities of a BD-R, it fits within a BD-25, and somebody could play the 2160p file on the computer or send it to a 4k TV given a video card that supports UHD resolutions and frame rates, you could just use the BD-R as a file storage device, like a thumb drive. There wouldn't be a menu structure, of course.

We are talking about your short 4k projects, correct?

Yes. I have burnt a number of standard blue-ray disks using Magix and other PC based software Editors. These same programs edit native 4K footage and output native 4K (mainly use MP4). But can only burn 1080P blueRay disks. So I was wondering what needs to be done so that i can burn native $K disks that would play on the a 4K player. As the films are short there would be plenty of room on a standard BD-R,

[zmarty]

Originally Posted by jeff_rigby

Looks like NO PC or Game Console will have a UHD BLu-ray player till after September due to this:

Since all UHD Media uses HTML5 <video> MSE EME in some manor (UHD BLu-ray uses the C-ENC format but with AACS2) this could explain the PS4 and XB1 as UHD Capable Consoles not being firmware updated till after September 2016.

That has literally nothing to do with UHD Blu-ray. Please get your facts straight and do not post misinformation.

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