Problems with new vinyl?

[gardengirl1331]

Just checking here to see if anyone else is having kind of major issues with new vinyl in the last 3-4 months? Everything we've been buying is coming warped (wow the Firestarter soundtrack we got yesterday actually looks like a freakin' cup, the company is giving us shit about exchanging it, wanting photos which we gently put it on one of the speakers since it's trashed anyway, and on one side it's somewhat flat, but when I flipped it for a comparison photo the outer edge is off the speaker by over 1/4"!!!!!!??? And before anyone asks, no it wasn't sitting outside in the sun, I grabbed it from the delivery person. And even with the photos showing the problems they now want video of it?! what?!) But we've had return about 4 albums very recently all because of scratches and horrible static. The other one this week was STP Purple we got one at Walmart and it had horrible pops and weird static in between songs (when I looked real close at the grooves instead of them being smooth the edges of them were scalloped), the replacement we ordered online had the same exact problem?! Pressing issues we assume. So we're not going to try to replace it, we'll get it when they re-release it again and get it direct from the band.

My husband has an email in to the player manufacturer (U-Turn) to see what they might suggest. But he just replaced the needle this month, so it's not that. All the other albums we own all play fine, and the other two new albums we got this week play fine too, so it is 100% the new stuff we're ordering. He's getting so mad he said he won't order online any more, aside from getting stuff directly from the bands, but due to the severe lack of stores around here that's going to greatly curb him being able to buy stuff.

Now I know vinyl is super popular, but I'm wondering if QC is going way down because of that. I mean his band can't even hope to get a good vinyl release again because bigger acts like Taylor Swift are all doing vinyl. They used to have to wait 3-6 months to get their albums pressed, now it's almost 24 months! Smaller bands just don't have a chance any more!

[Mojo Blue]

Quality control is definitely a problem lately, but your experience sounds particularly bad. The warping is probably post production. Although you were handed the package from the carrier, who knows what it was exposed to between the pressing plant and your hand.

Hisses and pops could be attributed to QC, though. I have had some issues myself, with my only solution to clean the vinyl several times (I just have a manual Spin Clean contraption). It always helps, but sometimes not well enough. I also clean the needle after a particularly noisy record.

Static is really nobody’s fault, just the nature of using vinyl. A brush or destat gun will help, as well as climate control in your listening room. (I’m debating on picking up a humidifier or air cleaner for the winter when it’s always worse).

It sucks that you’ve been having so many issues. Some pressing plants are better than others, so you might have to do some research, but it doesn’t matter if the record you want was pressed at one with poor QC. I wouldn’t let those companies persuade you to not return the bad merchandise though. Take the photos/video and make them honor their product.

Sorry there’s no easy solution to your dilemma. Some of these companies just don’t care about customer service after they have your money.

[Mezzanine]

I use a brush (Furutech ASB-1) before I play my albums. But that´s not always enough, so I´m planning to buy an ionizer.
I have been recommended ION-001 Vinyl Ionizer.

[quickdraw]

Yes, I think QC on new vinyl in general has been a roll of the dice lately. I've noticed that the past couple of Record Store Day releases have had some pretty bad problems (check out Steve Hoffman music forums), but it's not just limited to those titles. I've had good success with Music on Vinyl releases and the new Roxy Music 1/2 speed remasters, which have been quite good. Some of the most egregious crap releases that come to mind are the Beach Boys Pet Sounds, Tom Petty Damn the Torpedos and Tom Waites' Nighthawks at the Diner remaster done by Anti. I've had pretty good luck with Discogs vendors, especially with vintage vinyl and they tend to use more robust packaging for shipping, but I have also noticed with new vinyl that warping and surface noise are more common as of late and that can be problematic when returning defective new/sealed product with those vendors. I suspect that the resurgence of vinyl lps in the past couple of years and the lack of manufacturing facilities along with pent up demand may have caused some companies to cut QC corners or taking pressing dies way past their intended serviceable use.

[gardengirl1331]

Mojo, it's not the typical vinyl static, that I know the sound of and love hearing a little bit of it. But this is crazy static, along with the pops and hisses.

The company we were having problems with once they saw the video we sent were crazy apologetic and have been working with my husband to get a new copy, he even asked them to open the shrink wrap on it to help prevent warping in case it's coming from shipping instead of the manufacturing. We're def going to not order so much vinyl in summer since our normally mild summers are now really really hot and humid. I did just order 4 LPs for him through a sale I heard about on here to get the Halloween box set for $30 off, it was a second order from them and I just got it today, not sure how they play/look since that's my husband's thing more than mine, but I did open the shrink wrap, and I was really pleased with one that came with a sticker on it saying they ship without shrink wrap! I really wish more companies did that! The other two have it, so I hope the weather didn't affect them. The box did come in about 4 days, so hopefully it wasn't sitting in trucks too long. I just read an article about drivers passing out and even dying while delivering this summer due to the heat, those trucks get to about 130* in summer!! They're trying to fight to get UPS to put AC in the trucks.

the warping part I get, between the weather and the shrink wrap being on them so tight. It's more so the constant scratches and other playback issues. I mean we have stuff from the 60's that sounds better and we're like the 3rd owner of it. It seems similar to the 4K disks that keep coming scratched on people here. QC just isn't what it used to be. Kind of glad to hear we're not the only ones, yes it's been bad lately, I just hope it gets better again.

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by gardengirl1331

Mojo, it's not the typical vinyl static, that I know the sound of and love hearing a little bit of it. But this is crazy static, along with the pops and hisses.

The company we were having problems with once they saw the video we sent were crazy apologetic and have been working with my husband to get a new copy, he even asked them to open the shrink wrap on it to help prevent warping in case it's coming from shipping instead of the manufacturing. We're def going to not order so much vinyl in summer since our normally mild summers are now really really hot and humid. I did just order 4 LPs for him through a sale I heard about on here to get the Halloween box set for $30 off, it was a second order from them and I just got it today, not sure how they play/look since that's my husband's thing more than mine, but I did open the shrink wrap, and I was really pleased with one that came with a sticker on it saying they ship without shrink wrap! I really wish more companies did that! The other two have it, so I hope the weather didn't affect them. The box did come in about 4 days, so hopefully it wasn't sitting in trucks too long. I just read an article about drivers passing out and even dying while delivering this summer due to the heat, those trucks get to about 130* in summer!! They're trying to fight to get UPS to put AC in the trucks.

the warping part I get, between the weather and the shrink wrap being on them so tight. It's more so the constant scratches and other playback issues. I mean we have stuff from the 60's that sounds better and we're like the 3rd owner of it. It seems similar to the 4K disks that keep coming scratched on people here. QC just isn't what it used to be. Kind of glad to hear we're not the only ones, yes it's been bad lately, I just hope it gets better again.

I'm not completely sold that the warping is due to shipping or shrink wrap. I suppose if it sits in a super hot mailbox for an extended period of time it's possible, however if it's packaged properly with spacers to keep the product ridged and flat, I don't think that would do it either. I live in an area where summer temps can typically go up to 105° and have a metal communal mailbox which is exposed to direct sunlight and rarely get a warped record due to it sitting there of hours. I have received warped records in the middle of winter though, which I don't think is the result of weather conditions. Lately I've had a couple of records that were not only warped, but were also dished and this is definitely a manufacturing problem, not shipping or shrink wrap. If you look on Discogs for specific releases, sometimes you will see a pattern of complaints in the comments / reviewer section from buyers that indicate manufacturing problems. Discogs is an excellent resource for vetting certain manufacturers and their track record for QC.

Some vendors like Amazon will just toss a record in a box and let it bounce around in transit, however lately they have been getting much better and sending records in LP media mailers, which generally are much better. Vendors on Discogs, especially those with a large transaction number and good ratings take a lot of care in their packaging and description of product including existing warps, since they are judged on the accuracy of their description and customer satisfaction, so buying used is also a viable and often cheaper option. A lot of these vendors will bend over backwards to make it right too, since they generally deal with a community of savvy vinyl purchasers. Plus some of the older pressings actually sound way better than the new vinyl represses.

[stvn1974]

I don't do vinyl. I tried a few years ago and if vinyl was any worse quality it would be a 4K UHD. Too many dished LPs with non-fill. Plus the skips and pops drive me batty.

[gardengirl1331]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

I'm not completely sold that the warping is due to shipping or shrink wrap. I suppose if it sits in a super hot mailbox for an extended period of time it's possible, however if it's packaged properly with spacers to keep the product ridged and flat, I don't think that would do it either. I live in an area where summer temps can typically go up to 105° and have a metal communal mailbox which is exposed to direct sunlight and rarely get a warped record due to it sitting there of hours. I have received warped records in the middle of winter though, which I don't think is the result of weather conditions. Lately I've had a couple of records that were not only warped, but were also dished and this is definitely a manufacturing problem, not shipping or shrink wrap. If you look on Discogs for specific releases, sometimes you will see a pattern of complaints in the comments / reviewer section from buyers that indicate manufacturing problems. Discogs is an excellent resource for vetting certain manufacturers and their track record for QC.

Some vendors like Amazon will just toss a record in a box and let it bounce around in transit, however lately they have been getting much better and sending records in LP media mailers, which generally are much better. Vendors on Discogs, especially those with a large transaction number and good ratings take a lot of care in their packaging and description of product including existing warps, since they are judged on the accuracy of their description and customer satisfaction, so buying used is also a viable and often cheaper option. A lot of these vendors will bend over backwards to make it right too, since they generally deal with a community of savvy vinyl purchasers. Plus some of the older pressings actually sound way better than the new vinyl represses.

That's interesting, I'll tell my husband about the shipping and shrink wrapping possibly not being the problem. The worst (and the one I spoke of above) looked like a bowl it was so bad. Our mailbox is way too small for vinyl so they bring it up to the front door where it's better protected. (we did have one person leave it at the box in pouring rain!!! Somehow that one once unboxed was perfectly fine and played great! And I'm not 100% sure it is the heat, like you said, since we have some older stuff from people who did not store it properly and kept it in an attic for years. If it's anything like ours it gets to about 120-130*+ up there in the late afternoon on real hot days.

We've been vinyl lovers since we were kids, I grew up with hippy parents and when everyone was listening to Debbie Gibson and Bobby Brown I was playing Waiting For the Sun, Houses of the Holy and Led Zeppelin III and Hocus Pocus on our old player through the Marantz which the on/off button didn't work and you had to jam this metal thingy my dad somehow figured out would keep the button in. (one of my sad memories from when I was younger was bringing Hocus Pocus to show and tell in Kindergarten, I was so excited for everyone to hear it and the teacher put it on then immediately turned it right back off again making me cry. hahaha.

We've only ordered vinyl a couple times from amazon and both times they put it in a vinyl mailer inside the box with the other stuff and both came in good shape, but the third one that came on it's own was warped and had to be exchanged.

And yes, we obviously buy vinyl because my husband is a musician and wants the best. But he cautions me with surprising him with some stuff because he says some places are not mastering for vinyl and they're pressing MP3 quality stuff on vinyl because a lot of these bigger bands their fans don't know the difference and don't care!!!??? He just got a re-release of something that he's been listening to for many years and heard stuff in the mix that he's never heard before, because of how much more info (or whatever) is on vinyl compared to CDs or MP3. And he REALLY listens, he has this annoyance, well I say it's an annoyance, where his hearing is so specific to musical stuff he can hear every single little thing, and can pick out mistakes in the recording, the mixing and mastering etc....

[quickdraw]

OMG! That’s so awesome that you were a fan of Hocus Pocus at such a young age. I was totally into Focus in high school and played the hell out of Hamburger Concerto when it came out.

That’s interesting that you mention about some new vinyl releases being mastered from digital sources. There’s a HUGE controversy on this topic right now regarding MoFi (Mobile Fidelity) vinyl releases. They’ve been known for their analog vinyl releases and charge a premium accordingly. However, a small record retailer became suspicious with their recent releases after hearing rumors about them using a digital intermediate source for mastering and arranged a meeting with their engineering staff where they admitted they use a digital recording from an original analog source to produce their new vinyl master. Looks like there will be multiple class action lawsuits filed. YouTube has a ton of videos about about it over the past couple of weeks if you’re interested in this story. This is blowing the lid off of a lot of audiophile’s perception of supposedly premium analog releases and record company’s transparency of their production chain.

[gardengirl1331]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

I've had good success with Music on Vinyl releases and the new Roxy Music 1/2 speed remasters, which have been quite good. Some of the most egregious crap releases that come to mind are the Beach Boys Pet Sounds, Tom Petty Damn the Torpedos and Tom Waites' Nighthawks at the Diner remaster done by Anti. I've had pretty good luck with Discogs vendors,

My husband LOVES Music on Vinyl and knows of Roxy, but hasn't gotten anything from them. He does go to Discogs a lot too.

Thankfully he has an older copy of Pet Sounds, it's one of both of our favorites. We have the DVD and a copy of Love and Mercy which is such a good yet horribly depressing movie!

Originally Posted by quickdraw

OMG! That’s so awesome that you were a fan of Hocus Pocus at such a young age. I was totally into Focus in high school and played the hell out of Hamburger Concerto when it came out.

I loved that album so much!! I still have it, along with some other greats from my childhood, some I've bought again recently just to keep the originals safe and damage free. I was such a weird kid! Luckily I met a guy who grew up the same. His first love was Queen in the Flash Gordon soundtrack! His father brought him up on Queen, Black Sabbath and the Who. He started playing guitar around 14 thanks to Jimmy Page, Malcom Young and others, and hasn't ever looked back.

Originally Posted by quickdraw

That’s interesting that you mention about some new vinyl releases being mastered from digital sources. There’s a HUGE controversy on this topic right now regarding MoFi (Mobile Fidelity) vinyl releases. They’ve been known for their analog vinyl releases and charge a premium accordingly. However, a small record retailer became suspicious with their recent releases after hearing rumors about them using a digital intermediate source for mastering and arranged a meeting with their engineering staff where they admitted they use a digital recording from an original analog source to produce their new vinyl master. Looks like there will be multiple class action lawsuits filed. YouTube has a ton of videos about about it over the past couple of weeks if you’re interested in this story. This is blowing the lid off of a lot of audiophile’s perception of supposedly premium analog releases and record company’s transparency of their production chain.

Oh wow!! I know when my husband's band records they have two masters one for MP3 and CDs and one for vinyl since it has to be mastered so different. They had Tony Reed (from Mos Generator) do the mastering for the vinyl and it turned out well. He said that not many people record to tape any more so it starts digital then goes to analog. So I don't know if that's part of the reason older vinyl sounds better. I assume that also due to the lack of good products out there over the last decade or more, all the stuff that goes into making vinyl has probably gone down in quality too. But going from analog, or even digital, to a digital recording for vinyl is so bad! I'm glad people are calling them out on it!! Like you said paying a premium for what should be a premium product and having it sound no better than an MP3 really sucks!

Thankfully the 3 albums that came sound great! The one might not be 180grams but he thinks it might be around 160 (can't remember what exact number he thinks) since it's not real thin/light. I got him the Goblin soundtrack for Suspiria which he LOVES, Escape From NY, and the soundtrack to Vertigo. Coming soon is the Black Christmas soundtrack, so hopefully that one will be fun too! The problem one that is getting replaced is the Firestarter soundtrack. So I really hope that one comes in great shape! He's mad he can't get the Stranger Things Season 4 music (not the soundtrack with all the other bands, he's getting in playing synth along with the guitar so he's been having fun getting these albums).

[gardengirl1331]

Well thankfully the replacement from that company we bought Firestarter from was really good and checked the album over before shipping and who knows if having the plastic cut open by them helped or not, but even shipping in this heat it arrived this afternoon in perfect shape! The cupped album is now hanging on the wall behind his desk at work.

[sfmarine]

I picked up Green Day and played it and no problems. Today I had pops and skips so I stopped the player and restarted..now it's fine! What gives?

Also same thing happened with La La Land which was also sealed. Second play-through was worse than the first.

This is turning into a box of chocolates situation.

[Scarriere]

It sounds like the tone arm balance may be off. That counter weight has to be in a slim tolerance. On my Fluance, the set up guide was pretty specific on getting that right.

You made a comment in a different thread on volume. Maybe you could think about a turntable amplifier. They’re fairly cheap and help a lot. I had the same issue and also am new this scene .

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by sfmarine

I picked up Green Day and played it and no problems. Today I had pops and skips so I stopped the player and restarted..now it's fine! What gives?

Also same thing happened with La La Land which was also sealed. Second play-through was worse than the first.

This is turning into a box of chocolates situation.

Like Scarriere stated, sounds like it might be a tone arm issue. Might want to look at a couple of things like weight/balance, cartridge alignment and if the anti-skate is adjusted properly. Also, how old is the cartridge and check to see if the needle is dirty or damaged. Pops can also be attributed to static electricity, so try using an anti-static brush before you put the needle down (there's a technique to doing this, look on YouTube). Cheers, and hope you can figure it out.

BTW Scarriere, nice to see a fellow Fluance owner here. Love mine, but I changed out the cartridge to an Audio Technica VM 540ML and couldn't be happier.

[sfmarine]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

Like Scarriere stated, sounds like it might be a tone arm issue. Might want to look at a couple of things like weight/balance, cartridge alignment and if the anti-skate is adjusted properly. Also, how old is the cartridge and check to see if the needle is dirty or damaged. Pops can also be attributed to static electricity, so try using an anti-static brush before you put the needle down (there's a technique to doing this, look on YouTube). Cheers, and hope you can figure it out.

BTW Scarriere, nice to see a fellow Fluance owner here. Love mine, but I changed out the cartridge to an Audio Technica VM 540ML and couldn't be happier.

I have a brand new (days old), Audio Technica LP60 so everything should be aligned unless I have a defective unit. . Perhaps it was static. I'll have to pick up a brush.

[WonkaBedknobs83]

I bought a re-release of the Chitty Chitty Bang Bang film soundtrack and it had a scratch at the end of side 2 right out of the box!

[quickdraw]

Originally Posted by WonkaBedknobs83

I bought a re-release of the Chitty Chitty Bang Bang film soundtrack and it had a scratch at the end of side 2 right out of the box!

Sorry to hear about that. Sadly QC issues aren't that uncommon these days.

The new re-release of Pink Floyd's Animals evidently has a very high defect rate (surface noise, pops and skips) - something like near 40%, which is pretty outrageous. That release is so bad, I know of one online retailer that won't take that particular album back unless YOU pay return shipping!

[minkaz]

I've noticed pretty much every LP I've purchased from wally world has had issues. warped 180 grams mostly. I stopped buying from there and have not experienced the consistent QC issues elsewhere.