LG OLED Panels...oh my!!!

[4kUltraBD]

I went to Best Buy to waste time today and was looking at the LG OLED tvs...holy smokes guys!!! Seriously the best looking tv I have ever seen in my life. My TCL looks embarrassingly bad in comparison.

The blacks on that LG were seriously deep. None more black I tells ya!!! Dream panel right there.

To be completely honest here, I had never really checked them out prior to today. I was out running around and had a bunch of time to kill, so I went to best buy to see what 4k discs were in stock, and thought I would peruse the tvs they had.

I was in for quite a shock when I saw them in person. The blacks were so deep that you would think the tv was off if it wasn't for the image on screen to show off the PQ of the set.

I don't know much about OLED tech, but I am guessing that there is no backlight scheme in these sets. I don't know how it could be done otherwise.

By comparison, my 4 Series TCL looks very washed out and has a serious dirty screen effect happening, however, it was an ultra budget model, so I cannot expect flagship levels of performance. What I didn't expect was how dramatically different a high end panel looks. I knew there would be a gap in performance, I just didn't realize how truly large that gap is.

To you OLED owners...I am truly jealous.

[Integra1995]

Originally Posted by 4kUltraBD

I went to Best Buy to waste time today and was looking at the LG OLED tvs...holy smokes guys!!! Seriously the best looking tv I have ever seen in my life. My TCL looks embarrassingly bad in comparison.

The blacks on that LG were seriously deep. None more black I tells ya!!! Dream panel right there.

To be completely honest here, I had never really checked them out prior to today. I was out running around and had a bunch of time to kill, so I went to best buy to see what 4k discs were in stock, and thought I would peruse the tvs they had.

I was in for quite a shock when I saw them in person. The blacks were so deep that you would think the tv was off if it wasn't for the image on screen to show off the PQ of the set.

I don't know much about OLED tech, but I am guessing that there is no backlight scheme in these sets. I don't know how it could be done otherwise.

By comparison, my 4 Series TCL looks very washed out and has a serious dirty screen effect happening, however, it was an ultra budget model, so I cannot expect flagship levels of performance. What I didn't expect was how dramatically different a high end panel looks. I knew there would be a gap in performance, I just didn't realize how truly large that gap is.

To you OLED owners...I am truly jealous.

I am in the market too for that LG OLED E8 version or 2 models behind. And that new Panasonic 4K player 9000 that's not out yet. I am just waiting for a price drop by year-end. Constantly checking Amazon.com & Frys and let Best Buy to price match. Patient is the key. Black Friday is another factor.

[ROSS.T.G.]

Originally Posted by 4kUltraBD

I went to Best Buy to waste time today and was looking at the LG OLED tvs...holy smokes guys!!! Seriously the best looking tv I have ever seen in my life. My TCL looks embarrassingly bad in comparison.

The blacks on that LG were seriously deep. None more black I tells ya!!! Dream panel right there.

To be completely honest here, I had never really checked them out prior to today. I was out running around and had a bunch of time to kill, so I went to best buy to see what 4k discs were in stock, and thought I would peruse the tvs they had.

I was in for quite a shock when I saw them in person. The blacks were so deep that you would think the tv was off if it wasn't for the image on screen to show off the PQ of the set.

I don't know much about OLED tech, but I am guessing that there is no backlight scheme in these sets. I don't know how it could be done otherwise.

By comparison, my 4 Series TCL looks very washed out and has a serious dirty screen effect happening, however, it was an ultra budget model, so I cannot expect flagship levels of performance. What I didn't expect was how dramatically different a high end panel looks. I knew there would be a gap in performance, I just didn't realize how truly large that gap is.

To you OLED owners...I am truly jealous.

They really are incredible. Just wait till you see one setup properly in a dark room screening UHD. Best display I’ve owned hands down. I won’t be getting rid of mine till it dies.

[maperez1987]

Originally Posted by 4kUltraBD

I went to Best Buy to waste time today and was looking at the LG OLED tvs...holy smokes guys!!! Seriously the best looking tv I have ever seen in my life. My TCL looks embarrassingly bad in comparison.

The blacks on that LG were seriously deep. None more black I tells ya!!! Dream panel right there.

To be completely honest here, I had never really checked them out prior to today. I was out running around and had a bunch of time to kill, so I went to best buy to see what 4k discs were in stock, and thought I would peruse the tvs they had.

I was in for quite a shock when I saw them in person. The blacks were so deep that you would think the tv was off if it wasn't for the image on screen to show off the PQ of the set.

I don't know much about OLED tech, but I am guessing that there is no backlight scheme in these sets. I don't know how it could be done otherwise.

By comparison, my 4 Series TCL looks very washed out and has a serious dirty screen effect happening, however, it was an ultra budget model, so I cannot expect flagship levels of performance. What I didn't expect was how dramatically different a high end panel looks. I knew there would be a gap in performance, I just didn't realize how truly large that gap is.

To you OLED owners...I am truly jealous.

Have you checked out also Sonys OLED? Also don't OLED easily get burn in or something?

[Robert Zohn]

Not easily at all. Over time, persistent viewing of static images for 2+ hrs per day without changing the content can burn the static image into the screen.

This year LG built-in a new static image dimming algorithm to reduce the potential of image retention and burn-in.

[wesslan]

That static image dimming doesn't seem to work good at all from V. Teohs youtube video but haven't tried it myself.

[worldchmps]

LG had an embarrassing moment recently with burnin and now I never want to buy an OLED and risk it!

https://www.zdnet.com/article/lg-emb...-at-tradeshow/

[AlexIlDottore]

Originally Posted by worldchmps

LG had an embarrassing moment recently with burnin and now I never want to buy an OLED and risk it!

https://www.zdnet.com/article/lg-emb...-at-tradeshow/

That's your loss.

[micks_address]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Not easily at all. Over time, persistent viewing of static images for 2+ hrs per day without changing the content can burn the static image into the screen.

This year LG built-in a new static image dimming algorithm to reduce the potential of image retention and burn-in.

Hi Robert,

I have an lg e55 from 2016. I think its a 7 series. I had it calibrated and it really is awesome. It was the last to support 3d before it was dropped. A nice to have feature more than anything else. What do you think of the oled screens in the last 2 years? Have them come on a lot in terms of picture quality? I don't have any issue with my tv so hoping to get a few more years out of it before attempting an upgrade. I have a question on the new Panasonic oleds - they seem to be getting the 'best' reviews. What does Netflix content in dolby vision playback as on tvs that don't support dolby vision? Is it flagged as 4k and you don't get hdr?

Also whats your opinion on best set to buy if you are buying this year? I have a friend who's torn between Panasonic and lg c8 at the moment (based in Ireland)

Thanks,
Mick

[Robert Zohn]

Originally Posted by worldchmps

LG had an embarrassing moment recently with burnin and now I never want to buy an OLED and risk it!

https://www.zdnet.com/article/lg-emb...-at-tradeshow/

Glad you posted this article. It gives me an opportunity to post here a cut and paste of my comment that I posted on the article comments section, which was quickly deleted by the magazine.

Here’s a copy of my comment that I posted on the article when it first published:

"It's true that image retention and even burn-in is more of a concern for all emissive display technologies, e.g. CRT, Plasma and OLED vs, the less susceptible back-lit and edge-lit LCD/LED and LCD/QLED displays. However with that said it's not easy to burn an image into any display, OLED included.

To burn-in an image into an OLED display you would need to leave an opaque static image on the screen for many hours without changing the content. For example, with an opaque static image on the screen without ever changing the content for two or more hours per day for a week or longer or even 8 hrs per day for two days might cause some static images to burn-in.

Here's my respectful comments on this article and it's findings. First, we don't know if the residue of the long playing static image is image retention or actually burned into the screen. After using an OLED TV for a few hours with normal content any image retention goes away on it's own.

Second, my company sells all premium brands and models of TVs and we have sold thousands of OLED TVs and have never been told by any client that they experienced burn-in. Other than our educating our clients on how to avoid burn-in you can consider the following five reasons:

A) With normal use burn-in will not occur even when users play content with static images for many hours as changing the content reverses the static image residue.

B) All OLED TVs have a built-in pixel orbiter that helps reduce the effects of image retention. The pixel orbiter is a factory default, but can be disabled in the user menu.

C) All OLED TVs have "Pixel Refresher" program built-in that automatically runs when the TV has been on for 3 or more hours and when the TV is power off the "Pixel Refresher" program runs while the TV is off to remove all image retention and correct any screen uniformity issue.

D) OLED TVs are more susceptible to burn-in when they are brand new. The panel stabilizes after 200 hrs of use and burning in an image is more difficult.

E) For all 2018 OLED TVs LG added an automatic logo/static image dimming algorithm that gradually lowers the luminance level of static images to help eliminate the threat of image retention/burn-in. (I was surprised to see the exhibitor used a 2017 OLED TV against the 2018 QLED. If they selected the same model year for both displays we would likely not see any image retention.)

Please also consider that if it was this easy to get burn-in the big box store like Best Buy and the giant Amazon would have tens of thousands of returned OLED TVs.

Finally, regarding LG's swapping the OLED TVs for LCD displays at the airport; LCD displays should have been used from the start as the flight schedule with lots of static images is not a good choice for an OLED display. But all that does is prove the point that an abused OLED is likely to get burn-in. OLED displays are not matched for commercial static use, like static signage. OLED TVs are for the discerning video lover when wants to see the very best image quality on their TV."

Also note that this article was solely based on Nanosys, a quantum dot developer's, exhibited at their SID booth.

With all this said if your usage requires hours with continues viewing of a static image on the screen and you don't watch much else then OLED technology is not a good choice.

[Zoland2020]

Originally Posted by worldchmps

LG had an embarrassing moment recently with burnin and now I never want to buy an OLED and risk it!

https://www.zdnet.com/article/lg-emb...-at-tradeshow/

Then just get a QLED and call it a day.

[slaizer2000]

Originally Posted by 4kUltraBD

I don't know much about OLED tech, but I am guessing that there is no backlight scheme in these sets. I don't know how it could be done otherwise.

B

No backlighting is used because each cell/pixel is it's own light source (Organic Light Emitting Diode). Blacks are true black because the OLED is turned off to produce the black. Can't do that with LCD and backlighting.
But also another reason why the OLED tv's are more expensive.

[JimDiGriz]

I had a compare with an LG and a Panasonic. Went for the EZ952 and have never regretted it.

[micks_address]

Originally Posted by JimDiGriz

I had a compare with an LG and a Panasonic. Went for the EZ952 and have never regretted it.

what would you say swung you toward the panny?

[ack_bak]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Glad you posted this article. It gives me an opportunity to post here a cut and paste of my comment that I posted on the article comments section, which was quickly deleted by the magazine.

Here’s a copy of my comment that I posted on the article when it first published:

"It's true that image retention and even burn-in is more of a concern for all emissive display technologies, e.g. CRT, Plasma and OLED vs, the less susceptible back-lit and edge-lit LCD/LED and LCD/QLED displays. However with that said it's not easy to burn an image into any display, OLED included.

To burn-in an image into an OLED display you would need to leave an opaque static image on the screen for many hours without changing the content. For example, with an opaque static image on the screen without ever changing the content for two or more hours per day for a week or longer or even 8 hrs per day for two days might cause some static images to burn-in.

Here's my respectful comments on this article and it's findings. First, we don't know if the residue of the long playing static image is image retention or actually burned into the screen. After using an OLED TV for a few hours with normal content any image retention goes away on it's own.

Second, my company sells all premium brands and models of TVs and we have sold thousands of OLED TVs and have never been told by any client that they experienced burn-in. Other than our educating our clients on how to avoid burn-in you can consider the following five reasons:

A) With normal use burn-in will not occur even when users play content with static images for many hours as changing the content reverses the static image residue.

B) All OLED TVs have a built-in pixel orbiter that helps reduce the effects of image retention. The pixel orbiter is a factory default, but can be disabled in the user menu.

C) All OLED TVs have "Pixel Refresher" program built-in that automatically runs when the TV has been on for 3 or more hours and when the TV is power off the "Pixel Refresher" program runs while the TV is off to remove all image retention and correct any screen uniformity issue.

D) OLED TVs are more susceptible to burn-in when they are brand new. The panel stabilizes after 200 hrs of use and burning in an image is more difficult.

E) For all 2018 OLED TVs LG added an automatic logo/static image dimming algorithm that gradually lowers the luminance level of static images to help eliminate the threat of image retention/burn-in. (I was surprised to see the exhibitor used a 2017 OLED TV against the 2018 QLED. If they selected the same model year for both displays we would likely not see any image retention.)

Please also consider that if it was this easy to get burn-in the big box store like Best Buy and the giant Amazon would have tens of thousands of returned OLED TVs.

Finally, regarding LG's swapping the OLED TVs for LCD displays at the airport; LCD displays should have been used from the start as the flight schedule with lots of static images is not a good choice for an OLED display. But all that does is prove the point that an abused OLED is likely to get burn-in. OLED displays are not matched for commercial static use, like static signage. OLED TVs are for the discerning video lover when wants to see the very best image quality on their TV."

Also note that this article was solely based on Nanosys, a quantum dot developer's, exhibited at their SID booth.

With all this said if your usage requires hours with continues viewing of a static image on the screen and you don't watch much else then OLED technology is not a good choice.

I am not an OLED owner right now (JVC projector guy) so I have not skin in the game, but I had been hearing about burn in and started doing some research for my relative who is going to buy a new TV and was concerned about burn in. In short, based on other podcasts, articles, etc I have read I think you are spot on and your thoughts echo what other experts have said.

Is burn in possible with an OLED? Yes. Is it likely? No. Unless you almost go out of your way to display static content then yes. Or if you are someone who leaves their TV on all day long on some channel that has a static image.

I would guess only a very small percentage of people would need to worry about burn in, and for those folks, LED is probably a better option. But for the vast majority of people OLED burn in is a non-issue.

At least that is what I told me relative and they are going to buy an OLED

[WKoA13]

I've had a B6 for about a year and a half now.

Coming from a 2011 Panasonic Plasma, I'm pretty damned happy.

I haven't had any issues with actual burn in so far. I mean, I don't watch sports or news networks non-stop, so I really never have tickers or banners to worry about. I do mostly watch cable networks that have their logo in the lower right corner, but, I think with commercial breaks, etc, it (so far) hasn't given any of them time to cause a problem.

On certain picture settings (Game, Expert Bright Room), if I sit on my Sony X700 or my Xbox One X's menu for several minutes, I do get VERY temporary image retention of the brighter menu tiles. But, it does disappear within a couple minutes or less of actually watching something. I also do game, but really only one to two nights out of the week. However, that's still usually for 3-5 hours at time, and still have yet to see any actual "burn-in" of a HUD etc.

The only concern I have with my set is....maybe a panel issue that I was just ignorant of in the past? Or maybe it's just how new, non plasma's work....

Several movies or shows that I remember having BLACK night skies, or black backgrounds on my Panny, or newer ones that seem like they SHOULD have black backgrounds.....are more of a blurry/fuzzy grey??

For example, the "The Deep" episode of Blue Planet II on UHD. Most of it looks absolutely stunning. But then the "no light" scenes that feature the various bioluminescent fish/animals.... have said background. It's not black. It's an almost charcoal grey? It really actually undercuts all the amazing colors the creatures produce.

Is that normal these days for 4k/HDR displays? Or is that possibly a different panel defect beyond uniformity issues?

Anyway, outside of that though, it's still been a stunning set. HDR/DolbyVision has been spectacular on it. Depending on the network, even some shows over cable look fantastic. Thanks to upscaling, even older blu-rays of catalog titles have really surprised me. The imperfect, original PREDATOR BR disc threw me for a loop with the detail and colors. And the more recent restoration of SORCERER was stunning. Obviously still not the same as say, PLANET EARTH II or BLUE PLANET II etc etc, but...eye catching none the less.

[McGarnigal]

Loving my new C7

[WKoA13]

And yes, based on everything I've seen, and read, "burn-in" IS a risk if you aren't careful with your set.

I see a TON of complaints and outrage from people with burn-in on their OLEDs, and when you ask what they normally watch, it's always a 24hr news and/or sports network with a ticker, and they also leave it on those networks for more than half of the day, on the brighter settings.

A) Don't do that.

B) If all you are going to watch are cable sports/news networks....why are you spending that kind of money on an OLED??

[McGarnigal]

Originally Posted by WKoA13

And yes, based on everything I've seen, and read, "burn-in" IS a risk if you aren't careful with your set.

I see a TON of complaints and outrage from people with burn-in on their OLEDs, and when you ask what they normally watch, it's always a 24hr news and/or sports network with a ticker, and they also leave it on those networks for more than half of the day, on the brighter settings.

A) Don't do that.

B) If all you are going to watch are cable sports/news networks....why are you spending that kind of money on an OLED??

Same thing plasma owners (like myself) had to be aware of, I don't know why people are freaking out so much now about it

[WKoA13]

Originally Posted by McGarnigal

Same thing plasma owners (like myself) had to be aware of, I don't know why people are freaking out so much now about it

Right? And I'm sure it will get better over time (or at least I would hope). I seem to remember that the later plasma models were less at risk for it than earlier ones. But, that might have just been BS....*shrug*

But, yeah, even with my plasma, as long as I was careful, I never had a problem with it. I had friends who had a small issue with their plasma at the time, because it was brand new, and most of what they watched on late night cable was 4:3. So, anytime they would watch a movie etc in wide screen, you could sorta, kinda, barely notice that the sides of the picture were a bit brighter than the rest.

I just told them to watch as much widescreen content as they could for a while, including "zooming" on those re-runs of Married With Children at 3am. At least for several weeks. Sure enough, after a few months, those side bars balanced out, everything was fine.