Copying of your Media.

[Grumpz]

It was recently brought to my attention, that backing up my own paid for DVD's is illegal. I've never put any thought into as it's been a no brainer. My kids, especially my youngest, destroys everything.

Heck, we're on our 4th copy of Scooby Doo.

My question is, is this true, and the RRIA does not allow for backing up your own disk?

And if so, do they offer to replace the disk once it's been rendered useless, at no cost to you, since you've already bought the liscense?

[Blu-Benny]

any copied movies i've seen always give that "the sole purpose of this disc is for in-home use" warning @ the beginning.

i always thought as long as you weren't copying them for profit, u s/b ok.

[Grumpz]

I will continue to dig further, because that's exactly what I thought.

If what I was told was true, my kids won't be touching media I own...ever...AGAIN!

[quexos]

Yet another example of big corporation abuse of our individual rights.
We are talking about a private copy, no profit there, just a private use of it in order to have the original unscathed by children and you can't even do that.

In a way it makes sense. If your original is destroyed you can go spend your money (again) to buy the same product which means more money for those greedy corporations.

[Johnny Vinyl]

In Canada it is perfectly legal to make a duplicate copy of ANY media source, as long as it is for personal use.

John

[Grumpz]

Originally Posted by John72953

In Canada it is perfectly legal to make a duplicate copy of ANY media source, as long as it is for personal use.

John

Well I just happen to be Canadian, but figured the long arm of the law could get me.

I will check into this. Thanks.

[xtop]

why are you worried about backing up your own dvd's? not like the government has the lines tapped to see if you have backup software

[bhampton]

the laws are debate-able.

However,... teaching your kids not to destroy things is a worthwhile practice. (I admit I'm not "perfect" at it. My 3 year old is still great at breaking stuff and mess in general.)

I have a lot of media and the kids leave it to me to set it up.

Now,... I regularly back up my hard drive and I think having a copy of digital stuff is good practice. But my movie library is big and too big to have multiple versions of. I guess if huge hard drives were cheap enough and making perfect copies was easy enough and legal then I suppose I would be all for it.


-Brian

[brettallica]

Originally Posted by bhampton

the laws are debate-able.

However,... teaching your kids not to destroy things is a worthwhile practice. (I admit I'm not "perfect" at it. My 3 year old is still great at breaking stuff and mess in general.)

I have a lot of media and the kids leave it to me to set it up.

Now,... I regularly back up my hard drive and I think having a copy of digital stuff is good practice. But my movie library is big and too big to have multiple versions of. I guess if huge hard drives were cheap enough and making perfect copies was easy enough and legal then I suppose I would be all for it.


-Brian

This is how I feel. Backing up every kid DVD we have is just not as convenient/economical as I'd like it to be, so I simply don't do it for everything. I've got a nice library of kids stuff to watch on my server at home, but physical DVDs still reign supreme without question in my house.

But yeah, I think you can copy anything you own as long as you don't sell it or give a copy to anyone else. I haven't done the research, but that seems to be the gist I recall.

[Zvi]

Originally Posted by Grumpz

...
My question is, is this true, and the RRIA does not allow for backing up your own disk?

Yes, in US that is illegal. Check out millenium digital copyright act and to controversy surrounding it. And it has its proponents not only in the industry, hell, there are quite a few ppl on this forum defending that law.

in Canada it is legal, however as Logan informed us, every recordable medium you buy has tax applied to it, assuming you will use it to record copyrighted material and that goes to the industry, to ease their pain...

Originally Posted by Grumpz

And if so, do they offer to replace the disk once it's been rendered useless, at no cost to you, since you've already bought the liscense?

No, they do not.

Originally Posted by brettallica

But yeah, I think you can copy anything you own as long as you don't sell it or give a copy to anyone else. I haven't done the research, but that seems to be the gist I recall.

Sadly, that's not the case in US. Read carefully the copyright notice on any dvd. It explicitly states that copying is illegal, even if it is done w/o monetary gain.
That part was main controversy back in the days when the law was passed. It clearly violates fair use principles.

[jono_0101]

Originally Posted by Zvi

Yes, in US that is illegal. Check out millenium digital copyright act and to controversy surrounding it. And it has its proponents not only in the industry, hell, there are quite a few ppl on this forum defending that law.
in Canada it is legal, however as Logan informed us, every recordable medium you buy has tax applied to it, assuming you will use it to record copyrighted material and that goes to the industry, to ease their pain...


No, they do not.




Sadly, that's not the case in US. Read carefully the copyright notice on any dvd. It explicitly states that copying is illegal, even if it is done w/o monetary gain.
That part was main controversy back in the days when the law was passed. It clearly violates fair use principles.

yup, i have seen several heated debates on this site about copyright laws, i feel if i am backing up a copy of something i own, and not selling it for profit, then that should be ok, i realize the law doesnt feel that way, but thats my personal opinion on the matter

[brettallica]

Originally Posted by Zvi

Sadly, that's not the case in US. Read carefully the copyright notice on any dvd. It explicitly states that copying is illegal, even if it is done w/o monetary gain.
That part was main controversy back in the days when the law was passed. It clearly violates fair use principles.

That's pretty weak, man! I haven't read the laws or anything, but now I know. Totally lame!

[Grumpz]

Originally Posted by brettallica

That's pretty weak, man! I haven't read the laws or anything, but now I know. Totally lame!

Indeed. At least when I buy something @ the PS3 store, there's record of it so If I need to replace, I download it again at no cost.

That truely is ridiculous, and heated debates can only be the result.

[Johnny Vinyl]

Originally Posted by Zvi

in Canada it is legal, however as Logan informed us, every recordable medium you buy has tax applied to it, assuming you will use it to record copyrighted material and that goes to the industry, to ease their pain...
.

That's incorrect. DVD's do NOT have that tax applied. Only CD and VHS do. It is why a spindle of 100 CD's costs more than 100 DVD's.

John

[proxpilot]

whether they like it or not all my DVD's and Blu Rays get backed up.

[Sylin]

Originally Posted by Zvi

Sadly, that's not the case in US. Read carefully the copyright notice on any dvd. It explicitly states that copying is illegal, even if it is done w/o monetary gain.
That part was main controversy back in the days when the law was passed. It clearly violates fair use principles.

Actually, the DMCA has had several modifications that further describe the difference between copying and archiving.

You can (legally, in the US) duplicate, for archival purposes, any media that does not have a form of copy protection in place. This includes most CD's and some software. (Hence why ripping your own music for the sake of iTunes import is perfectly legal.)

However, since some CD's, and almost ALL DVD's, include anti-copying technology (Macrovision, for example) then copying that media isn't illegal, per se, but circumventing the copy protection is.

Allowances are made for, say, digital copies of movies where the intent of the bonus disc is to make a portable copy.

Also, you can always write to the copyright holder and ask for an exemption, in writing. I know this sounds impractical, but on the few occasions when I've done it, it worked. (For example, I got permission from Disney, in writing, to duplicate Song of the South from a PAL tape to DVD.)

[Zvi]

Originally Posted by John72953

That's incorrect. DVD's do NOT have that tax applied. Only CD and VHS do. It is why a spindle of 100 CD's costs more than 100 DVD's.

Interesting. He said all recordable medium had tax. So, basically in Canada you can copy DVDs no probs, no taxes?

[Zvi]

Originally Posted by Sylin

You can (legally, in the US) duplicate, for archival purposes, any media that does not have a form of copy protection in place.
...
However, since some CD's, and almost ALL DVD's, include anti-copying technology (Macrovision, for example) then copying that media isn't illegal, per se, but circumventing the copy protection is.

Which in the end doesn't change much. Since on can't be done w/o the other. But technically it is that, using or creating circumventor is illegal, which is why Johansen got in trouble back then for writing DeCSS, and the whole thing was so lame of MPAA...

[Sylin]

Originally Posted by Zvi

Which in the end doesn't change much. Since on can't be done w/o the other. But technically it is that, using or creating circumventor is illegal, which is why Johansen got in trouble back then for writing DeCSS, and the whole thing was so lame of MPAA...

Agreed. It is one of the most convoluted and ridiculous laws around.

By its very definition, the term "copyright" was supposed to help creators control how their original work was copied (ie. distributed), but it has now been twisted to manipulate how people USE an item once they've legitimately purchased it. This is so wrong on so many levels.

My wife and I were talking last week about how the bell companies cried foul when cell phones started taking off, because they were losing so much revenue from pay phones (which, as some younger people might not realize, were HUGE money-makers once upon a time). Yet instead of resisting the technology, they embraced it and many bell companies became cell providers. It's the business-level equivalent of taking lemons and making lemonade.

The MPAA can DIAF. Instead of lobbying for laws that confuse, isolate, and vilify consumers, studios need to embrace the tech and create a new paradigm.

Check out www.eff.org if you're into this sort of thing.