TT Quest '09

[mdabb]

First of all thanks in advance and please, anyone feel free to jump in.........


So, I'm looking for a great TT, so many choices and combinations out there, and that's great, but sorting through all of it is another. This will definitely be a great project for me, which I'm really excited about !!!

On with the quest.........


I will only be looking at new TT's exclusively. Yes I might/should be able to pick up an "even better" one on Audiogon, but not this time around. Nothing against Audigon, because I love, love Audiogon and use it quite often. I want to say I have a budget but it's more like a limit. I tend to get kind of happy and feeling good once I start thinking about a new toy, but being that this is my first serious adventure into the analogue realm I want to stay "somewhat" grounded. So currently I am setting the limit at +/- $2500. I am pretty open to suggestions, but I'm limited to what is available within a few hours drive of me, and I would like to limit my final list to just a handful of possibilities when it comes down to it.

First up is a small but high-end audio dealer that carries a couple of the brands I have already been looking at, but carries others as well. I will provide a link below, so if anyone has any experience or knows something that I should take under advisement, please don't hesitate. I am actually excited about this first place because it's small, personal and best of all he has some great toys !!!!

My first stop..........

Don Better Audio http://www.donbetteraudio.com/
A better, full list of products/manufacturers is listed toward the bottom of the page.

Much Thanks !!!

[richteer]

I'm a bit too tired tonight to give you a proper reply, but I can give you a few nuggets that don't require much thought. :-)

1. I think you're very wise to avoid buying used. As good as Audiogon et al are for less delicate things, I'd be very wary about buying a used TT. Original packaging is a must, and personal pick up highly recommended. You just don't know how much damage the bearing might suffer during shipping.

2. A budget of ±$2,500 is great. What are looking to acquire with that: just the TT/arm, TT/arm and cartridge, or TT/arm/cartridge and phono stage? All 4 are required if you don't already have them.

3. Kudos to you for wanting to support your local dealer(s)!

[mdabb]

Thanks Rich !!!

I am in no real hurry so basically wanted to get the ball rolling. I just got done working a few hours ago so I can relate to being worn out.

For $2500, I'm hoping to get my foot in the door and then progress as time goes bye (as I become more experienced), but yeah I'm hoping for the budget +/- to come away with something that will let me start enjoying. Phono stage/pre is excluded from the budget. Haven't decided on that since I don't know what TT/cartridge combo I will be going with. Although I'm hoping I can find a tube based one.

[mdabb]

I have an hour or so to kill, so I thought I would update this in case anyone was interested. Rich I accidentally erased your email address without saving it, the last time. I was in too much of a hurry or excited that day

OK........

I listened to quite a few different TT setups during my visit. Think I pretty much stayed there all day, so I could get this right for me. I couldn't of asked for a better experience either !!!!

After comparing a number of high-end - mid - entry level TT's to make sure I had a good idea of what is possible. I simply let my ears make the choice as there was no denying what I heard. Sure the high-end tables sounded better, but was it $10,000 better or $5000 better or even $1500 better ??? It is also like picking a single item of food from a buffet of fine cuisine. So if you could only have one, what do you do ??? My answer: again, I let my ears make decision for me, and this is what I think I love the most at a price that allowed me a solid entry into the analogue realm. Simply there is no denying what I heard, so why fight it ??? Naturally there is better, but it is a give and take that I feel you make with "all" gear at any given price point. So given the strengths and weaknesses, I am coming away a happy man.

Some of the TT's I listened to where from Well Tempered, SME, Basis, Rega, Nottingham and one more company that I need to look up the name of again.


I know, I know !!! So what did you get ???

Like I said there simply was no denying what I heard of my choice. Drum roll.............................................. ...........................


Rega P5 in cherry
http://www.rega.co.uk/index2.htm

Dynavector 17D3 cartridge
http://www.dynavector.com/products/cart/e_17d3.html

Dynavector P-75mkII phono pre
http://www.dynavector.com/products/amp/e_p75mk2.html


This combo did it for me again and again, and like I said there was no denying it. I switched back and forth between the low to high priced tables on the same system basically, The same pre-amp, amp, and speakers, and "not" in a crappy sales oriented showroom environment. I made my own decisions and "nothing" was pushed on me.


I have been to quite a few of super high-end showrooms on the Northeast coast and in the Toronto Canada area, and none of them have anything on the one place that was closest to me. Go figure, right ??? So what makes this place so great to me ??? Well, the setting first of all. It's a home and a wonderful one at that. So You get a better idea of what it will sound like under real conditions. You also have the experience of a true life-long audio aficionado that is a musician, college professor, etc..., etc... There is also so much great gear in all price ranges. Easily the best experience I have ever had shopping for two channel gear !!! The real deal !!!

[naturephoto1]

Originally Posted by mdabb

I have an hour or so to kill, so I thought I would update this in case anyone was interested. Rich I accidentally erased your email address without saving it, the last time. I was in too much of a hurry or excited that day

OK........

I listened to quite a few different TT setups during my visit. Think I pretty much stayed there all day, so I could get this right for me. I couldn't of asked for a better experience either !!!!

After comparing a number of high-end - mid - entry level TT's to make sure I had a good idea of what is possible. I simply let my ears make the choice as there was no denying what I heard. Sure the high-end tables sounded better, but was it $10,000 better or $5000 better or even $1500 better ??? It is also like picking a single item of food from a buffet of fine cuisine. So if you could only have one, what do you do ??? My answer: again, I let my ears make decision for me, and this is what I think I love the most at a price that allowed me a solid entry into the analogue realm. Simply there is no denying what I heard, so why fight it ??? Naturally there is better, but it is a give and take that I feel you make with "all" gear at any given price point. So given the strengths and weaknesses, I am coming away a happy man.

Some of the TT's I listened to where from Well Tempered, SME, Basis, Rega, Nottingham and one more company that I need to look up the name of again.


I know, I know !!! So what did you get ???

Like I said there simply was no denying what I heard of my choice. Drum roll.............................................. ...........................


Rega P5 in cherry
http://www.rega.co.uk/index2.htm

Dynavector 17D3 cartridge
http://www.dynavector.com/products/cart/e_17d3.html

Dynavector P-75mkII phono pre
http://www.dynavector.com/products/amp/e_p75mk2.html


This combo did it for me again and again, and like I said there was no denying it. I switched back and forth between the low to high priced tables on the same system basically, The same pre-amp, amp, and speakers, and "not" in a crappy sales oriented showroom environment. I made my own decisions and "nothing" was pushed on me.


I have been to quite a few of super high-end showrooms on the Northeast coast and in the Toronto Canada area, and none of them have anything on the one place that was closest to me. Go figure, right ??? So what makes this place so great to me ??? Well, the setting first of all. It's a home and a wonderful one at that. So You get a better idea of what it will sound like under real conditions. You also have the experience of a true life-long audio aficionado that is a musician, college professor, etc..., etc... There is also so much great gear in all price ranges. Easily the best experience I have ever had shopping for two channel gear !!! The real deal !!!

Andrew,

What kind of package deal price will your store offer you?

Rich

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by naturephoto1

Andrew,

What kind of package deal price will your store offer you?

Rich

I'll PM you.

[naturephoto1]

Originally Posted by mdabb

I'll PM you.

Andrew,

Looks like a really good price. Having that kind of price including installation service like that and the ability to visit and listen in the store as much as you want certainly makes this an ideal store.

That is the kind of service that I received from Chris Brad of Teres Audio, though I had to fly him out and he installed everything including the Cartridge and Preamp which were from Soundsmith and were not his products or sales. I will fly Chris out again once I move to assure everything is just right and he will have to help me move my Teres Audio Certus 450 Turntable which is a 135 or so pound monster.

Congrats on the purchase. Hope you enjoy it. Fill us in as how it is performing once things are up and running.

Rich

[richteer]

Originally Posted by mdabb

I have an hour or so to kill, so I thought I would update this in case anyone was interested. Rich I accidentally erased your email address without saving it, the last time. I was in too much of a hurry or excited that day

If you're referring to me, that's OK. You couldn't have had a better excuse! :-)

I know, I know !!! So what did you get ???

Like I said there simply was no denying what I heard of my choice. Drum roll.............................................. ...........................


Rega P5 in cherry
http://www.rega.co.uk/index2.htm

Dynavector 17D3 cartridge
http://www.dynavector.com/products/cart/e_17d3.html

Dynavector P-75mkII phono pre
http://www.dynavector.com/products/amp/e_p75mk2.html


This combo did it for me again and again, and like I said there was no denying it. I switched back and forth between the low to high priced tables on the same system basically, The same pre-amp, amp, and speakers, and "not" in a crappy sales oriented showroom environment. I made my own decisions and "nothing" was pushed on me.

Excellent, and welcome to the club! I'm glad that you took your time and evaluated all the options available to you, and hope that your wallet isn't hurting too much! :-) Next on your shopping list: lots of lovely records to play on your new turntable!

Keep us informed--with pics!--on how things go.

[richteer]

Originally Posted by naturephoto1

Andrew,

Looks like a really good price. Having that kind price including installation service like that and the ability to visit and listen in the store as much as you want certainly makes this an ideal store.

Agreed. There's a lot to be said about supporting your local (or sometimes not so local) specialist dealer!

[Johnny Vinyl]

Many congrats Andrew on a wonderful purchase! It's additionally encouraging to read about your local dealer and how comfortable you were and the service they provided. This is the mark of a true audiophile shop. It's great to get a good price, but good service and a wonderful experience is even more gratifying.

I suppose for the next few weeks you'll be going on a bit of a vinyl-binge and giving your new rig a proper workout! Enjoy it not just now, but for many years to come. I'm very happy for you!

John

[FreddieFerric]

Originally Posted by mdabb

Drum roll.............................................. ...........................


Rega P5 in cherry
http://www.rega.co.uk/index2.htm

Dynavector 17D3 cartridge
http://www.dynavector.com/products/cart/e_17d3.html

Dynavector P-75mkII phono pre
http://www.dynavector.com/products/amp/e_p75mk2.html


This combo did it for me again and again, and like I said there was no denying it. I switched back and forth between the low to high priced tables on the same system basically, The same pre-amp, amp, and speakers, and "not" in a crappy sales oriented showroom environment. I made my own decisions and "nothing" was pushed on me.

Wow! Congratulations! Looks like wonderful equipment. Glad to see that you had the chance to really audition the gear in a relaxed atmosphere. No doubt you'll get hours on end of great use out of it.

If you don't get a chance to pm me those tube links I will totally understand. I myself would plan on being completey "pre-occupied" if I where in your shoes right about now.

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by richteer

If you're referring to me, that's OK. You couldn't have had a better excuse! :-)



Excellent, and welcome to the club! I'm glad that you took your time and evaluated all the options available to you, and hope that your wallet isn't hurting too much! :-) Next on your shopping list: lots of lovely records to play on your new turntable!

Keep us informed--with pics!--on how things go.

It was well worth the money !!! If I would have just ordered something online, I'm sure I wouldn't be as happy as I am with this purchase. It is easy to understand why a lot of TT manufacturers use the Rega tonearm that comes with the P5. I was really ready to under-estimate Rega when it came to the competitors, but I'm glad I was wrong. Through the years a number of the audio companies out there basically sold out their standards, and Rega seems to only have perfected their work. No substitute for experience and passion !!!

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by naturephoto1

Andrew,

Looks like a really good price. Having that kind of price including installation service like that and the ability to visit and listen in the store as much as you want certainly makes this an ideal store.

Rich

Actually it's not a store, it's a home business. Don has the room and ability to showcase the products that he carries in his 100+ year old home. It's also a one on one service and by appointment only. No distractions, just pure audio bliss !!! Best of all, he carries a number of the greatest audio brands in the world. Don's father was one of the first and only high-end audio dealers in Cleveland, so he grew up around audio his whole life !!! A great way to grow up if you ask me !!! What I like best is that music is his life and the passion for top shelf audio. Don is a professional musician, has or had his own recording studio, is college professor of music, can't remember exactly what, but Don himself plays guitar and studied/plays improvisational jazz. If there is one thing you ever do, schedule a pit stop next time you go to Michigan. It simply doesn't get much better than this. It's a hidden gem !!!

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by John72953

Many congrats Andrew on a wonderful purchase! It's additionally encouraging to read about your local dealer and how comfortable you were and the service they provided. This is the mark of a true audiophile shop. It's great to get a good price, but good service and a wonderful experience is even more gratifying.

I suppose for the next few weeks you'll be going on a bit of a vinyl-binge and giving your new rig a proper workout! Enjoy it not just now, but for many years to come. I'm very happy for you!

John

Thank you John, much appreciated !!!

Like I said in the post above, this is no audio store. It's a one on one experience in a beautiful home full of amazing gear. Take a minute to browse the website, and talk to him, I know you will be convinced to drive a few hours down this way. He also carries brands that aren't listed on the website. Even though he carries some of the most expensive brands on the planet it is much more than that, and offers products at all price ranges. It's all about the passion not the money and it really shows. If I only had a few hundred dollars for a TT, Don will still treat you like royalty. It's not about making a sale, because you will immediately find out he doesn't need the money. Really the only time I ever felt like it's all about me. He doesn't stock the products either, so he doesn't push anything on you. You call or email and he sets up a basic demo system, depending on what you are auditioning. with a single audiophile chair and have at it. If you decide to buy, he orders it for you. He pretty much has one of everything on hand ready to audition.

Also, almost forgot. I already had 40-50 LP's sitting at home and no TT so I can't wait !!!

Also John, one of the great things about living down this way is all the record stores like this mega store in Pittsburgh. One of eleven new/used record stores within a thirty mile radius of me that I have gone to so far.

Jerry's Records......... comes with lots of character as to be expected with vinyl !!!!

http://www.jerrysrecords.com/

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by BluRayFred

Wow! Congratulations! Looks like wonderful equipment. Glad to see that you had the chance to really audition the gear in a relaxed atmosphere. No doubt you'll get hours on end of great use out of it.

If you don't get a chance to pm me those tube links I will totally understand. I myself would plan on being completey "pre-occupied" if I where in your shoes right about now.

No, I'll get the links to you !!!

I haven't taken ownership of what I bought yet, order only. I picked out a unique cartridge so it takes experience to set it up properly. So everything will be done for me in the absolute best way. The cartridge is so tiny, you barely even notice it. The reason I bought it ???? What I heard !!! Plus you get this kind of service from where I bought it. Dynavector is also gonna match all the internal settings inside the phono pre for me before it leaves them. If all works out, I'm gonna go up Sunday to pick it up and watch him set it up. For my own experience as well.

Then after I get accustomed to the sound, I'm gonna order the external power supply for the P5, so I can compare the upgrade to hear the improvement it makes in my own system.

If I go up Sunday, I plan on taking some of the gear I already own and hook it up there to make comparisons. By the time I get home I won't be able to hook it all back up until the following Sunday. Sunday is my day to myself..... "Stereo Day" !!! Now it's gonna be "Analogue Day" !!! So I'll have time to get the info and links to you tomorrow !!!

[Johnny Vinyl]

Hi Andrew!

Have you received your new gear yet?

John

[Psychonaut]

Originally Posted by mdabb

Also John, one of the great things about living down this way is all the record stores like this mega store in Pittsburgh. One of eleven new/used record stores within a thirty mile radius of me that I have gone to so far.

Jerry's Records......... comes with lots of character as to be expected with vinyl !!!!

http://www.jerrysrecords.com/

I go through this area often for work and have been here several times. Jerry's is to blame for many of my large hauls. His vinyl is really clean and his prices more than fair. I have stuff local to me that charge more than double what Jerry's does and the vinyl is in terrible shape. He's closing in on two million records in stock, so it's not hard to find something you want.

[mdabb]

Originally Posted by Psychonaut

I go through this area often for work and have been here several times. Jerry's is to blame for many of my large hauls. His vinyl is really clean and his prices more than fair. I have stuff local to me that charge more than double what Jerry's does and the vinyl is in terrible shape. He's closing in on two million records in stock, so it's not hard to find something you want.

Sorry !!! Haven't revisited my thread in some time, didn't mean to leave you hanging

Jerry's is a great place for records, the selection and the prices are "probably" unmatched anywhere !!! The last time I was there I came away with twenty or so excellent and near mint Blue Note jazz titles for less than ten bucks a piece

To me what is best of all is that Jerry and his workers are all down to Earth guys who enjoy music and what they do !!! None of that fake crap at Jerry's. Just pack a lunch, dinner, and let someone know you are gonna be gone for a long time and not to worry

Love me some Jerry's

[Psychonaut]

No prob. I was going to be there tomorrow or Friday but my co-worker took the job out that way. He just saved me money and an angry missus.