Johnnie To's Vengeance - HK

[Clueless_Monkey]

Mega Star will release Johnnie To's Vengeance on December 11th in HK:
http://www.asianblurayguide.com/deta...ng_kong_china/

[ZeTi]

Hmm Region A ... hope the French Blu does not have forced subs

[McCrutchy]

I might be making my first HK import ever with this.

Too bad there are no extras.

EDIT: Ordered, because there isn't even a U.S. cinema release date yet, and $37.48 is very reasonable for a 12/15 arrival ($25.49 + $11.99 express shipping).

[onceachilde]

Has anyone here seen this yet? Word of mouth seemes to range from "awful" to "meh," but To's recent output has been pretty awesome . . .

[Kevtronn]

I have been very impressed with Mega Star Blu-rays, will have to add this title to my ever growing blu-ray import wishlist

[Sagacious Koreo]

Yes, finally. I've been waiting for this one.

I say don't listen to the haters. If you like Johnnie To then there's something you'll end up liking about it. I can't wait to watch it.

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by Sagacious Koreo

Yes, finally. I've been waiting for this one.

I say don't listen to the haters. If you like Johnnie To then there's something you'll end up liking about it. I can't wait to watch it.

Same here. And to be fair, this film hads only had a cinema release in France, Belgium, Hong Kong and Taiwan. It has yet to see even a festival in either the USA or the UK at that.

And therefore, this HK disc might be the only English option for quite a while...

[Fergubond]

Douban reviews average out to 6.4 stars on this one, which seem to be par for the course for a Johnnie To film. Sparrow has the exact same average. Although my Chinese is not great, most of the reviews seem to range from ok to average. As a fan of his other work, I'll probably blind buy this one.

[Sagacious Koreo]

Well, if that's the case then I'm sure I'll like it. I loved Sparrow. I thought it was fantastic.

[Volume11]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

I might be making my first HK import ever with this.

Too bad there are no extras.

EDIT: Ordered, because there isn't even a U.S. cinema release date yet, and $37.48 is very reasonable for a 12/15 arrival ($25.49 + $11.99 express shipping).

I can think of 10 HK titles to import before this one. I wouldn't mind owning this title myself but there are much better To films available.

[McCrutchy]

Originally Posted by Volume11

I can think of 10 HK titles to import before this one.

Could you list them?

This is my first HK Blu-ray Disc, but my impression is they're usually bested technically by US/UK counterparts, like Mad Detective.

Originally Posted by Volume11

I wouldn't mind owning this title myself but there are much better To films available.

So you've seen this film? Where would you rank it among To's work? What do you think is his greatest film so far?

Sorry to ask so many questions, but this and the UK release of Mad Detective will be my first Johnnie To films when the Blu-rays arrive, so I'm curious to get some perspective.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

Could you list them?

We have reviewed:

Exiled:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Exile...y-Review/1210/

Breaking News:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Break...y-Review/5204/

PTU:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/PTU-Blu-ray-Review/2722/

Accident (produced by Johnnie To):
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Accid...y-Review/8412/

Sparrow:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Sparr...y-Review/2080/

Election Part I:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Elect...y-Review/6071/

Election Part II:
https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Elect...y-Review/6072/


In my opinion, Sparrow is the most mature To film to be released on Blu-ray thus far, paying homage to classic HK cinema from the 50s and 60s, and the Election films being the best To discs released this year.

Pro-B

[Volume11]

Originally Posted by McCrutchy

Could you list them?

This is my first HK Blu-ray Disc, but my impression is they're usually bested technically by US/UK counterparts, like Mad Detective.



So you've seen this film? Where would you rank it among To's work? What do you think is his greatest film so far?

Sorry to ask so many questions, but this and the UK release of Mad Detective will be my first Johnnie To films when the Blu-rays arrive, so I'm curious to get some perspective.

The quality of the discs vary depending on who is releasing them, like PTU on Blu (which is a top five To film IMO) has a watermark that pops up. Not a huge deal but it can be very distracting to some. But, a good portion of the deltamac releases have a rather obvious level of contrast boosting present (ala Mad Detective). That being said, the majority of these titles won't see the light of the day in the U.S. for some time and if they do they likely will be the same encode used in HK ala deltamac to dragon dynasty. In Mad Detective's case its solely (as Im sure you know) because it was a Eureka MOC release approved by To (who also requested a few scenes be cut that he didn't like that DO appear in the HK version). However, this will be the exception, not the rule. For the most part ordering HK titles is fine and you likely won't get a better version elsewhere (Red Cliff and Mad Detective notwithstanding).

As for what titles I would suggest I would start with Exiled. Its a sequel to another To film called the Mission and, IMO, is vastly superior and easily one of To's best offerings (I would at least suggest renting the Mission just to understand the character dynamics and relationships in this film as y ou will be lost otherwise and not understand the first fifteen minutes). Overall the PQ is solid and despite some hiccups EASILY bests the DVD release in every way. Next, I would go with Election 1 and 2. The PQ is so so with some slight EE and possibly contrast boosting ( I have nothing to compare it to but it appears artificially boosted), but all in all very solid and two of Tos better works (and looks to be the same encode the US Tartan DVD releases used. Could be wrong but to my recollection it appeared that way so you likely wont find a better version). If the watermark doesn't bother you I would next suggest PTU. The picture quality, all in all, is very good but the story is the winner here. Its a Kurosawa remake (loosely) set in modern HK where an officer loses his gun to thugs and relies on a Police Tactical Unit to help him hunt it down for him. Despite the set up seeming like a typical HK cop thriller its more of a pensie and oddly structuered art film. Svet reviewed it here and I think he game it 3 out of 5 (one of his few) but I would rank it higher. Like a lot of To films, it grows on you as you think about it and revisit it.

As for other random titles, I would look into Protege. Again, the PQ appears to have been contrast boosted but in general the picture does look very solid. It doesn't get a lot playtime on forums in terms of the quality of the story but its a winner. Its about a undercover agent trying to work his way up in a drug trade that reaches from HK to mainland China all while during his home life interacting with a female neighbor that is a junky and her child. It also had a twist ending I didn't see coming.

As side note, I think Sparrow is mediocre at best and doesnt even feel like To film and I would place Exiled way above Election 1 and 2, although I love both.

And, if you want to rent some good To films and you don't mind the mediocre quality I would highly suggest Throwdown. Its by and far my favorite To film and to me represents his best and most artistic effort.

[pro-bassoonist]

Originally Posted by Volume11

The quality of the discs vary depending on who is releasing them, like PTU on Blu (which is a top five To film IMO) has a watermark that pops up. Not a huge deal but it can be very distracting to some. But, a good portion of the deltamac releases have a rather obvious level of contrast boosting present (ala Mad Detective). That being said, the majority of these titles won't see the light of the day in the U.S. for some time and if they do they likely will be the same encode used in HK ala deltamac to dragon dynasty. In Mad Detective's case its solely (as Im sure you know) because it was a Eureka MOC release approved by To (who also requested a few scenes be cut that he didn't like that DO appear in the HK version). However, this will be the exception, not the rule. For the most part ordering HK titles is fine and you likely won't get a better version elsewhere (Red Cliff and Mad Detective notwithstanding).

I wholeheartedly agree with your observation. One should opt getting HK films from Hong Kong. Yes, there are and will be exceptions - such as the above metnioned MOC release of Mad Detective - but when it comes to older titles that have seen some disastrous DVD treatments outside of Hong Kong (as well as locally), I would look for the HK release. Obviously, a lot of these older films that are starting to come out in Hong Kong won't even make it to the U.S.

These are good times to be an Asian Cinema afficionado, and it will only get better.

Pro-B

[Volume11]

Originally Posted by pro-bassoonist

I wholeheartedly agree with your observation. One should opt getting HK films from Hong Kong. Yes, there are and will be exceptions - such as the above metnioned MOC release of Mad Detective - but when it comes to older titles that have seen some disastrous DVD treatments outside of Hong Kong (as well as locally), I would look for the HK release. Obviously, a lot of these older films that are starting to come out in Hong Kong won't even make it to the U.S.

These are good times to be an Asian Cinema afficionado, and it will only get better.

Pro-B

Yes. Being in the states and sharing the same region code as Asia (not to mention that most of the MOC BDs will be region free and when they aren't it will likely be because Criterion is releasing it domestically) makes me a happy camper as I prefer Asian over all. The UK got the shaft in that regard with having to buy a region free momitsu or clone to view both MOC BDs and Criterions.

I actually feel kind of spoiled compared to the torture I went through with the early years of DVD and the UK getting more and better HK and Japanese films.

[McCrutchy]

Thanks Volume 11 and pro-bassoonist! I appreciate your insights and comments.

I suppose that I will begin with what is coming to me already, and then move on to your suggestions.

[Sagacious Koreo]

Yes. Throwdown is my personal favorite To film as well. It was my first To film and it's still my favorite. I think it's a masterpiece. It pays homage to Akira Kurosawa (my favorite director) and it just does everything right. I particularly like To's camerawork in this one too. I've been waiting for this one to hit bluray for a long time now.

[Kevtronn]

I also highly recommend "Exiled" & "Protoge", great suggestions!

[logboy]

worried about mentions of bad reviews too, but, after looking around briefly, I'd say something similar to what's been mentioned already, in that it seems reviewers may not be that specifically tempering their reactions by remembering what HK films are like. may or may not make sense, but I think fans are more likely to be interested in the general field of Asia or in HK itself, but reviewers will often see the film from a more general point of view.

I like Johnnie To. biggest barrier on this is the BD is $19 and the DVD $11 at dddhouse.

loved "accident"; so I'd recommend the BD of that as the photography and general production values are lovely.

[Sagacious Koreo]

$19 bucks is cheap for a bluray dude...I don't see that as a barrier at all.