Heaven's Gate

[oscarmerkx]

I understand there is a Criterion Blu Ray out at the moment.

When can we expect a UK release.

Saw this at the cinema today, brutal and uncompromising I thought and a great story as well.

[Judex]

Second Sight are releasing it over here, they haven't given a date yet.

[oscarmerkx]

Originally Posted by Judex

Second Sight are releasing it over here, they haven't given a date yet.

Thanks

[jacobvongunten]

Just in case some don't know, the upcoming UK BD will be cut by 59sec, it was classified by the BBFC in early August (and they noted: "Compulsory cuts were made to remove scenes of unsimulated animal cruelty orchestrated by the film makers (in this case, a cockfight and sight of horses being deliberately tripped in a cruel fashion). Cuts required in accordance with the BBFC's Guidelines and policy.")

As someone who has kept an interest in BBFC censorship for years, it is amazing to think that the official UK video version of Heaven's Gate will soon have nearly four times the length of cuts compared to the official UK video version of Cannibal Holocaust!

[pro-bassoonist]

Carlotta Films are also releasing the film in France later this year. It will be uncut.



Pro-B

[malcy30]

Originally Posted by jacobvongunten

Just in case some don't know, the upcoming UK BD will be cut by 59sec, it was classified by the BBFC in early August (and they noted: "Compulsory cuts were made to remove scenes of unsimulated animal cruelty orchestrated by the film makers (in this case, a cockfight and sight of horses being deliberately tripped in a cruel fashion). Cuts required in accordance with the BBFC's Guidelines and policy.")

As someone who has kept an interest in BBFC censorship for years, it is amazing to think that the official UK video version of Heaven's Gate will soon have nearly four times the length of cuts compared to the official UK video version of Cannibal Holocaust!

The latest BBFC podcast covers other reasons for censorship in the UK (outside sex, violence and language) so covered animal trips.

Was interesting listening as they discuss Butch Cassidy where the DVD and BD in the UK are cut for horse trips. They said they did not realise it contained illegal horse trips until they heard the DVD commentary where the director gives it away in one scene saying we had to film this bit in Mexico as the horse trips would have been illegal in the US. As they were at edge of frame the BBFC never spotted at it theatrical release or on VHS.

They reduced the cuts in Cannibal Holocaust as only one scene a cruel kill, whereas horse trips and cock fighting are illegal under animal cruelty legislation from 1930s requiring compulsory cuts and there is no latitude allowed.

Hence for Heaven's Gate I have the Criterion, but if had to buy RB agree go for the French release.

[HotRats]

Carlotta are also releasing a limited box set at €70 containg the double disc blu ray, double disc DVD, soundtrack and a book that looks like some sort of reproduction of Cimino's annotated script or shooting guide (the only photo I could find was too small to make out any details including language)

[Mr. Brightside]

Originally Posted by HotRats

Carlotta are also releasing a limited box set at €70 containg the double disc blu ray, double disc DVD, soundtrack and a book that looks like some sort of reproduction of Cimino's annotated script or shooting guide (the only photo I could find was too small to make out any details including language)

Sounds like a great release. The soundtrack is beautiful.

[legolars]

Originally Posted by jacobvongunten

Just in case some don't know, the upcoming UK BD will be cut by 59sec, it was classified by the BBFC in early August (and they noted: "Compulsory cuts were made to remove scenes of unsimulated animal cruelty orchestrated by the film makers (in this case, a cockfight and sight of horses being deliberately tripped in a cruel fashion). Cuts required in accordance with the BBFC's Guidelines and policy.")

As someone who has kept an interest in BBFC censorship for years, it is amazing to think that the official UK video version of Heaven's Gate will soon have nearly four times the length of cuts compared to the official UK video version of Cannibal Holocaust!

Thanks for that info. If the UK version is going to be cut, i'm opting for the Criterion version.

[Buzz201]

Arguably if the BBFC have had to cut it it's illegal in the UK... (The BBFC only issue compulsory cuts to material that is considered to be against the law)

However, if the transaction takes place outside the UK and you import it, it's generally considered to be fine...

[oscarmerkx]

Originally Posted by HotRats

Carlotta are also releasing a limited box set at €70 containg the double disc blu ray, double disc DVD, soundtrack and a book that looks like some sort of reproduction of Cimino's annotated script or shooting guide (the only photo I could find was too small to make out any details including language)

Here is that link https://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Heave...Blu-ray/74192/

I may just buy the regular version since it is cut here in the UK

[Aclea]

It's worth noting that there are quite a few other cuts and alterations in the Blu-ray version, which is Cimino's revised director's cut rather than the original 70mm version that was quickly pulled from theaters but occasionally turns up at the NFT (that has never been released in any home video format, though the main difference from the MGM DVD is different colour grading and a very effective freeze frame ending). One shot at the end of the prologue is run in reverse while the final shot before the intermission, where John Hurt vanishes behind the smoke from a train, is heavily truncated among other minor changes.

[Filmbloke]

This has a release date of 25th November on LoveFilm. How reliable that is, I do not know! Looking out for the Criterion to be in a sale anyways - didn't realise the English version was cut.

[Simon Lewis]

Originally Posted by Buzz201

Arguably if the BBFC have had to cut it it's illegal in the UK... (The BBFC only issue compulsory cuts to material that is considered to be against the law)

However, if the transaction takes place outside the UK and you import it, it's generally considered to be fine...

From my limited understanding of the video recordings act, its illegal to sell material not passed by the BBFC, but not illegal to buy it (even if the transaction is in the UK).

[Buzz201]

Originally Posted by Simon Lewis

From my limited understanding of the video recordings act, its illegal to sell material not passed by the BBFC, but not illegal to buy it (even if the transaction is in the UK).

Yes, but would you buy something if the other person was breaking the law? Almost makes you an accomplice really...

[Yami]

As much as I like to see films uncut/as the director intended, I would feel a little dirty importing a release for the privilege of viewing actual animal cruelty. From what I've heard, the cuts don't disturb the flow of the film and are imperceptible unless you're very familiar with the uncut version.

[Pooch]

Hi,

Originally Posted by Buzz201

Yes, but would you buy something if the other person was breaking the law? Almost makes you an accomplice really...

If Buzz is comparing watching an uncertificated item in the UK, to watching someone actually break the law/committing a criminal act, then I would argue that they are two completely different things.

I doubt anyone in here would knowingly and willingly watch someone breaking the law. But watching an uncut version of a film, is not in-and-of-itself illegal.

The VRA Act 1984, revised 2012, stimpulates the following:
1) All films for sale or rental, or for showing under theatrical conditions, must be BBFC certificated, except for under certain, special criteria (e.g. certain documentaries, sports videos, etc, which may be released as Exempt from Certification).

2) It is illegal to sell films in the UK, that have not been classified by the BBFC.

3) However, whilst it is illegal for a UK company to supply uncertificated films, it is not illegal for a non-UK-based company to supply such material, and more importantly, it is not illegal for UK film fans to import uncertificated, non-BBFC approved films, UNLESS such material contravenes other aspects of English Law, e.g importing certain kinds of illegal hardcore pornography, or material that might breach the Obscene Publications Act, etc, etc.

With that all said, it's almost unheard of these days, of anyone being taken to court for purchasing non-BBFC-certificated films, due to the internet age, where any adult can obtain plenty of non-BBFC-approved films with ease, from numerous online companies.

And to be fair, an uncut version of HEAVEN'S GATE, complete with the footage featuing actual horse-falls/trips is unlikely to garner anyone's attention, and certainly not that of the Government, HM Customs or the Police.

So, I really don't think anyone need worry about importing a non-BBFC-approved version of a near-4-hour-long, historical western/drama from 1980.


Pooch

[Buzz201]

Originally Posted by Pooch

Hi,



If Buzz is comparing watching an uncertificated item in the UK, to watching someone actually break the law/committing a criminal act, then I would argue that they are two completely different things.

I doubt anyone in here would knowingly and willingly watch someone breaking the law. But watching an uncut version of a film, is not in-and-of-itself illegal.

The VRA Act 1984, revised 2012, stimpulates the following:
1) All films for sale or rental, or for showing under theatrical conditions, must be BBFC certificated, except for under certain, special criteria (e.g. certain documentaries, sports videos, etc, which may be released as Exempt from Certification).

2) It is illegal to sell films in the UK, that have not been classified by the BBFC.

3) However, whilst it is illegal for a UK company to supply uncertificated films, it is not illegal for a non-UK-based company to supply such material, and more importantly, it is not illegal for UK film fans to import uncertificated, non-BBFC approved films, UNLESS such material contravenes other aspects of English Law, e.g importing certain kinds of illegal hardcore pornography, or material that might breach the Obscene Publications Act, etc, etc.

With that all said, it's almost unheard of these days, of anyone being taken to court for purchasing non-BBFC-certificated films, due to the internet age, where any adult can obtain plenty of non-BBFC-approved films with ease, from numerous online companies.

And to be fair, an uncut version of HEAVEN'S GATE, complete with the footage featuing actual horse-falls/trips is unlikely to garner anyone's attention, and certainly not that of the Government, HM Customs or the Police.

So, I really don't think anyone need worry about importing a non-BBFC-approved version of a near-4-hour-long, historical western/drama from 1980.


Pooch

That's not entirely true:

The Video Recordings Act 1984 (VRA) makes it illegal to supply any video or DVD within the UK which has not been age rated by the BBFC. There are some exceptions to this (for example, educational works or works predominantly concerned with sport, religion and music) but all feature films and TV programmes must be age rated.

Although it is not a customs offence to import an unclassified video or DVD it must be for your personal use only and the content must not breach the UK law (for example, The Obscene Publications Acts 1959 and 1964, Protection of Children Act 1978).

You may therefore purchase unclassified videos or DVDs whilst abroad, provided they contain no illegal material and are solely for personal use.

http://www.bbfc.co.uk/about-bbfc/faqs#F7

Therefore it is technically illegal to own an uncut copy of The Human Centipede 2 in the UK (I believe it was banned on the ground that it woul breach the Obscene Publications Act), but Heaven's Gate you could probably get away with.

[Simon Lewis]

Originally Posted by Buzz201

Therefore it is technically illegal to own an uncut copy of The Human Centipede 2 in the UK (I believe it was banned on the ground that it woul breach the Obscene Publications Act), but Heaven's Gate you could probably get away with.

Thats not entirely true either

It would be illegal to import The Human Centipede 2, but it would not be illegal to own it.

For example, you could download it from the internet, burn it to a DVD and watch it, all quite legally.

What is illegal to import really depends on the customs officer who opens the package and decide whether its obscene or not. I dont believe customs have a list of films that are illegal.

Fortunately I have no interest in owning Human Centipede 2

[aewb]

Up for pre-order at Moviemail.

Extras are listed as:

Restored director's cut
2 discs
New interview with Jeff Bridges
New interview with cinematographer Vilmos Zsigmond
Extracts from acclaimed documentary 'Final Cut: The Making and Unmaking of Heaven's Gate'