Standard or Cinema?

[steve1971]

Question for you guy's. Whats the best setting to have my tv on? Standard or Cinema? Right now its set to Standard but I have heard and read that alot of people have their tv's set to Cinema. So can anyone tell me which is the best one and why?

Thanks guys.

[Wingman1977]

Try these settings:

* Picture Modes
o Picture Mode : Standard
o Color Temperature : Warm
o Aspect Ratio : Full
* Picture Settings
o Backlight : 3
o Picture (Contrast) : 90
o Brightness : 55
o Color : 40
o Hue : R6
o Color Temperature : Warm
o Sharpness : Min
o Noise Reduction : Off
o Adv. Contrast Enhancer : Off
o Gamma : Low
o Clear White : Off
o Live Color : Off
* Advanced Settings
o Cinemotion : Auto 1
o Game : Off
o MotionFlow : Off
o White Balance : Factory Default

Source: http://www.tweaktv.com/tweak-my-tv/c...46v5100-3.html

[The_Donster]

Check out WM1977's settings and see how you like them. I personally don't like the look of the standard on both my 47" Vizio and 55" LG. I basically have them set to Cinema on both, with the exception of my 360 HDMI's, which are set to game.

[Dwayne]

Originally Posted by steve1971

Question for you guy's. Whats the best setting to have my tv on? Standard or Cinema? Right now its set to Standard but I have heard and read that alot of people have their tv's set to Cinema. So can anyone tell me which is the best one and why?

Thanks guys.

Cinema Mode, Movie mode, never the Standard for me.

[krazeyeyez]

i vote custom with a calibration blu-ray, very cheap and well worth it... unless out of the box settings have actually improved recently

[spaceape]

Cinema/movie mode is the best one. HDTV Calibration 101: Part 1, HDTV Calibration Part 2: Brightness and Contrast, HDTV Calibration Part 3: Color and Tint, HDTV Calibration Part 4: Sharpness.

[Canada]

From everything that I have heard cinema / movie mode is usually the best place to start

[steve1971]

Originally Posted by Wingman1977

Try these settings:

* Picture Modes
o Picture Mode : Standard
o Color Temperature : Warm
o Aspect Ratio : Full
* Picture Settings
o Backlight : 3
o Picture (Contrast) : 90
o Brightness : 55
o Color : 40
o Hue : R6
o Color Temperature : Warm
o Sharpness : Min
o Noise Reduction : Off
o Adv. Contrast Enhancer : Off
o Gamma : Low
o Clear White : Off
o Live Color : Off
* Advanced Settings
o Cinemotion : Auto 1
o Game : Off
o MotionFlow : Off
o White Balance : Factory Default

Source: http://www.tweaktv.com/tweak-my-tv/c...46v5100-3.html

Thanks wingman for the settings from tweaktv I will check these out tonight on my tv and see how they look.

[-RONIN-]

I wouldn't use either. People don't realize just how much the avaliable light and viewing distance effects the image quality. Those preset settings will almost always look like garbage compaired to a properly calibrated TV. I am also not a fan of using other users settings even if they have the same model TV as you because their viewing environment is different then yours. I would recommend going out and buying one of those calibration disks and sitting down in your TV room and dialing the TV in to compliment your environment. We spend so much on these HDTV's that another $20 for a calibration disks is a good investment. You will be shocked at just how much it will improve your image and you don't have to be a genius to do it.

[SammyB]

Movie mode is generally better. It will likely be more accurate, and be easier to further calibrate. However, leaving it at the presets is not recommended; Further calibration will be require, either with a colorimeter, calibration disk, or hiring an knowledgeable ISF pro.

However, I did adjust both on my tv. I have everything going through my receiver, so Movie mode is the same for my ps3 and cable. I adjusted movie mode for a dark room, so I needed a setting for when I have the lights on. I adjusted Standard, and while it was piss poor to start, I was able to get great results.

Getting great results from Standard is not easy on most tvs, especially if you don't own a colorimeter. I had to adjust the whitebalance (gray scale) which requires a colorimeter. Standard mode's gray scale adjustments were far more finicky than Movie modes grayscale. I did however achieve an accurate grayscale (alsmost as accurate as Movie mode), with a pretty okay gamma, good Delta E levels, etc...

However don't adjust the whitebalance if you don't have a colorimeter. Eyeballing it is impossible and you'll probably be further off than were you started.

And when copying somebody's settings, a few things to think about. If it's designed for a dark room you might get away with it, but still better you do it yourself with a disk. If it's for a bright room, don't use it. Settings right for one persons room might not work in somebody else's room, because of different room have different brightness.

Also if you're copying somebody's settings don't copy their gray scale (whitebalance). The adjustments for one tv's grayscale will always be different than another, even if it's the same model, in the same room, in the same lighting conditions, with the same source. Just leave that setting at factory default unless you can adjust it yourself with a colorimeter or hire an good ISF pro.

[Hillside Trece]

As me and Lloyd have been discussing with other people on this site in various other threads, it's not a good idea to just "copy" someone else's settings, even for the same TV model. I realize many people leave their settings here in posts just to provide a baseline of sorts to go off of, and I suppose that's okay to TRY, but don't use them as gospel.

Further, with regard to the OP's question -- Steve, I believe you have been using Standard on your Sony for some time now, no? I can recall you even suggesting those settings to someone in the "Share Your Settings" thread when a certain Sony owner was having issues; at any rate, why change if you've been happy with them? Most EVERYONE on the internet will suggest Cinema/Movie/Custom or some kind of "User/Expert" mode (AVS' membership roster is infamous for this) so your question of "which should be used" is going to be fraught with replies about why YOU should be using Cinema, yadda yadda yadda...

But I am one of the Sony owners using Standard mode -- I do not have an LCD like you, but my rear projection SXRD has been adjusted (I don't say "calibrated" because it has not been professionally so) in Sony's Standard mode via three different setup discs. To me, I just didn't want the hassle of adjusting all the extra controls in Custom even though you can just turn them all off, and I don't really know what I'm doing enough to tweak in the White Balance menu (although admittingly I was able to dial out some blue push I noticed once when I was fooling around in Custom) so to me, Standard seemed like a good compromise in which I could just adjust the "main" picture controls like Contrast, Color, Sharpness, etc. and not worry about "extra" pro adjustments. To me, Standard looks just fine, with enough punch not to look dull, and yet without colors that are garish or cartoonish like in Vivid...and, anyway, Sony's manual and marketing materials exclaim "Standard should be used for home entertainment..." so I just go by that, too.

Come on, HT enthusiasts! There must be some of you who run Standard mode like me and Steve!

[SammyB]

Well, Trece, movie mode is almost always capable of more accurate results. Out of the box standard and movie will both be a mess (except on rare occasions), but with calibration or even just adjustments movie mode will almost be more accurate than standard. I've never heard of a tv that could achieve a more accurate picture with standard than movie mode. It's possible a really good calibrator could make them both equally accurate, probably would have to use the service menu however.

Movie mode however might not be suitable on certain displays in a room with lights on. My Panasonic plasma for example, under movie mode can not achieve a light out put high enough for a lit room, so I have to use standard with the lights on. I never owned a dlp, but I suspect they might have a hard time achieving a high enough light out put for a bright room under movie. Lcds can use movie mode in a lit room because they have an adjustable backlight.

[Hillside Trece]

Originally Posted by lloyd_nasty

Well, Trece, movie mode is almost always capable of more accurate results. Out of the box standard and movie will both be a mess (except on rare occasions), but with calibration or even just adjustments movie mode will almost be more accurate than standard. I've never heard of a tv that could achieve a more accurate picture with standard than movie mode. It's possible a really good calibrator could make them both equally accurate, probably would have to use the service menu however.

Movie mode however might not be suitable on certain displays in a room with lights on. My Panasonic plasma for example, under movie mode can not achieve a light out put high enough for a lit room, so I have to use standard with the lights on. I never owned a dlp, but I suspect they might have a hard time achieving a high enough light out put for a bright room under movie. Lcds can use movie mode in a lit room because they have an adjustable backlight.

I disagree, respectfully, regarding the "inaccuracy" under most circumstances -- which it seems you are implying -- of a TV's Standard picture mode. I believe it's a great compromise between a Dynamic/Vivid and one of the "dimmer" modes like Cinema/Custom, and depending on manufacturer, can be tamer than another set's Standard without being too dim. Of course, these are just presets which could be made to look like each other using all the available settings, pretty much, but out of the box, I never had a problem with Standard mode on my SXRD and with adjustments via setup discs, the picture looks pretty dialed in to my eyes. Could it be perfected? Sure. Will enthusiasts go right to a "Cinema" or "Custom" mode? Sure. I prefer the way Standard looks without needing to go into an Advanced Settings menu, where I'd just play Russian Roulette with two dozen combinations of adjustments I most likely know nothing about. I don't experience excessive ringing, noise, grain or aliasing in my Standard mode, after it's been adjusted by the three discs I mentioned...

Also, keep in mind that publications like Home Theater magazine in roundups they do like their HDTV Buyer's Guide even recommend switching to a "Standard" mode if a mode like Cinema looks too "soft" or "gauzey" which they claimed happens more than people think -- in their last Buyer's Guide issue, Shane Buettner, editor, stated that when shopping for an HDTV, take the set out of Vivid/Dynamic and if the Film/Cinema mode doesn't look appealing, appearing too soft and "gauzey," put the set in Standard mode...

Further, it says something to me, personally, when the manual for a display/TV claims "Standard" mode is recommended for "home entertainment" use...

[SammyB]

Trece, you seem to speaking more about "looking good", a person argument, while I'm talking about specific quantifiable specs defined by experts in the image industry. Standard almost always has less accurate colors (as in they're xy coordinates are further off) the gray scale is likely not to be 6,500K or fall on the D65K coordinates, RGB levels are not going to be mapped out smooth, the Delta E levels are likely to higher (lower the better), gamma is more likely to be nonlinear or not near 2.2.

Then even once standard is calibrated (using the user menu, not the service menu) is will still be further off in most cases than what could be done in movie. I've calibrated my standard mode myself, which luckily had a user whitebalance. I've seen results from other DIY and some pro calibrators who posted their results on numerous tvs, to show what standard mode is capable of and what it lacks. While it's possible to get near 6,500K, the amount off is usually greater. Since gray scales don't track completely flat all the way through out, there is allows a bit off. The goal is to be no more than 100K off, either above or below. With standard the best I could do is about 350K, and that's good for a standard modes grayscale tracking.

As for home theater magazine... You said that was from HDTV buyers guide. First of all, ignore any "buyers guide" whether it be cnet, home theater magazine, plasmabuyingguide, etc... They tend dumb it down so much that those articles become useless.

Move mode is meant for a dark room. It has dark blacks, and less light out put than standard. So movie mode will appear soft in a bright room, which is not it's intended purpose. Any mode if too dim can appear soft. If I take my tv, put it on standard, lower the backlight, turn on my lights it will appear very soft using standard. That's because movie mode is made for 30 to 40 ftL, while for dimly lit room it should be 40 to 50ftL, and higher for an even brighter room. Sadly I think this might be what home theater mag is talking about, but they simplified their statement so much, the meaning got lost.

You can prefer you set on standard, that's your choice. Just note it's a preference. It's as close to accurate as you want, which is fine, but I can guarantee you the Delta E levels are high, grayscale, RGB levels are off, and perhaps more.

I'm talking about quantifiable measurements, which you seem to have a disdain for. Standard mode can't out perform movie mode in conforming to the specs of what a calibrated tv should be. I've never seen a case to the contrary, and that's why professionals recommend movie mode.

[Qwan]

I prefer Cinema over Standard. However I have spent countless hours playing with my settings to get the picture just the way I like it. I recommend you get a cheap calibrating tool and attempt to find settings that work for you. In fact today I found the code to enter the service menu on my Sharp so will be spending a good portion of tonight fiddling with the settings there to see if I can get it even better. Will post my settings when I am satisfied as a guideline to any who may be interested.

[Hillside Trece]

Originally Posted by lloyd_nasty

Trece, you seem to speaking more about "looking good", a person argument,

A "personal argument"....? No argument here...

while I'm talking about specific quantifiable specs defined by experts in the image industry. Standard almost always has less accurate colors (as in they're xy coordinates are further off) the gray scale is likely not to be 6,500K or fall on the D65K coordinates, RGB levels are not going to be mapped out smooth, the Delta E levels are likely to higher (lower the better), gamma is more likely to be nonlinear or not near 2.2.

I already admitted that I know settings such as mine are not based on any industry standards, and that I acknowledge such standards exist...

Then even once standard is calibrated (using the user menu, not the service menu) is will still be further off in most cases than what could be done in movie. I've calibrated my standard mode myself, which luckily had a user whitebalance. I've seen results from other DIY and some pro calibrators who posted their results on numerous tvs, to show what standard mode is capable of and what it lacks. While it's possible to get near 6,500K, the amount off is usually greater. Since gray scales don't track completely flat all the way through out, there is allows a bit off. The goal is to be no more than 100K off, either above or below. With standard the best I could do is about 350K, and that's good for a standard modes grayscale tracking.

Some of us simply are not after the very last inch of light-balanced/white balanced performance from our sets, and enjoy it when we get it in the ballpark of a suitable/watchable picture. If you are going by kelvin ratings and targets, so be it -- I was not after that with my adjustments. I wanted something that wasn't in the blinding range of Vivid and yet wasn't that dim out of the box; I found Standard to be the mode I was looking for.

Also -- all this discussion may be moot, because my TV actually doesn't provide a "Cinema" mode or the like...just Vivid, Standard and what Sony calls "Custom" although each of these modes can save customized settings, so that one's a bit misleading.

As for home theater magazine... You said that was from HDTV buyers guide. First of all, ignore any "buyers guide" whether it be cnet, home theater magazine, plasmabuyingguide, etc... They tend dumb it down so much that those articles become useless.

Well, that's strictly opinion -- I disagree with this statement as well, because I happen to personally know the magazine's ex-video editor Geoffrey Morrison (who went on to become editor of another A/V publication) and I know for a fact they have a stringent set of rules when reviewing these sets each issue. Thomas J. Norton, their resident video reviewer now, has a unique sense of humor, but he sticks to the science of calibrating a set like nobody's business...I'm telling you. Regardless, this "Buyer's Guide" I referenced wasn't a joke to be "passed off" or looked at as a dumbed down periodical of some kind...Shane Buettner's point in that statement he made was that IF a set doesn't seem to be wowing a potential buyer of a new HDTV in a Cinema/Film mode, STANDARD could be used as an alternative -- that's all I was pointing out.

Move mode is meant for a dark room. It has dark blacks, and less light out put than standard. So movie mode will appear soft in a bright room, which is not it's intended purpose. Any mode if too dim can appear soft. If I take my tv, put it on standard, lower the backlight, turn on my lights it will appear very soft using standard. That's because movie mode is made for 30 to 40 ftL, while for dimly lit room it should be 40 to 50ftL, and higher for an even brighter room. Sadly I think this might be what home theater mag is talking about, but they simplified their statement so much, the meaning got lost.

I understand what Movie mode is meant for -- the dim environment of a theatrical-like setting to view films. And indeed, Home Theater's editor was referring to looking at TVs in stores and how their Cinema modes may look when viewing them that way -- BUT, what Shane meant (because I sent him an email about that statement) also applied to, and stretched to, getting the set home and still finding Cinema mode too dim. And I understand these are all factory presets that could be made to look like one another -- I get that. You could lower Standard's settings to make it look like Cinema or "Pro" while you could also jazz up a Pro's settings to hyped contrast and color to make it look like Vivid. However, I found, after playing for many hours and subsequently years, that no matter how many times I tweaked my set's "Custom" mode (the only one available once you eliminate Standard and Vivid) I could not get it to the satisfying punch level I achieved in a tweaked Standard mode...in addition, the Advanced Settings menu proved daunting and intimidating to me, and I didn't like the fact I had so many settings available to me, most of which I had no idea what they did to the picture to be honest. To me, Standard is a compromise between Dynamic/Vivid and a Theater setting...

Which brings me to this:

You can prefer you set on standard, that's your choice. Just note it's a preference. It's as close to accurate as you want, which is fine, but I can guarantee you the Delta E levels are high, grayscale, RGB levels are off, and perhaps more.

I'm talking about quantifiable measurements, which you seem to have a disdain for. Standard mode can't out perform movie mode in conforming to the specs of what a calibrated tv should be. I've never seen a case to the contrary, and that's why professionals recommend movie mode.

You seem to be losing track of the fact that I never claimed my settings or recommendations to people for Standard mode were "correct" or "preferred" over profesionally calibrated Cinema/Theater modes, etc. I NEVER stated that nor think it...

However, as I stated, I don't really care about "Delta E levels" or "quantifiable measurements" as seen in a lab or by people spending countless hours and dollars in front of a spectrometer on a tripod trying to squeeze the last drop of accurate color out of their sets -- I am NOT saying that to piss on the professionals that do care about these parameters, or enthusiasts such as yourself who do; I got in the personal ballpark with my adjusted Standard settings, and I'm comfortable knowing I'm at least not using Vivid, Dynamic or something like that...

Also, as I said, my set does not offer a Theater/Movie/Cinema preset anyway, so the "argument" may be moot.

[Hillside Trece]

Originally Posted by Qwan

I prefer Cinema over Standard. However I have spent countless hours playing with my settings to get the picture just the way I like it. I recommend you get a cheap calibrating tool and attempt to find settings that work for you. In fact today I found the code to enter the service menu on my Sharp so will be spending a good portion of tonight fiddling with the settings there to see if I can get it even better. Will post my settings when I am satisfied as a guideline to any who may be interested.

Qwan,

If you're talking to me, I have adjusted my Standard mode with no less than three different setup discs.

[spaceape]

@Hillside Trece: It looks like you might need to set it to custom to be able to choose the warm setting on your KDS-50A2020:

* Picture Modes
o Picture Mode : Custom
o Color Temperature : Warm 2
o Aspect Ratio : Full
o Advanced Iris : Medium
* Picture Settings
o Contrast (Picture) : 70
o Brightness : 48
o Color : 52
o Hue : R1
o Sharpness : 25
o Noise Reduction : Mid
* Advanced Settings
o Black Corrector : Off
o Gamma : Off
o Clear White : Off
o Live Color : Off
o White Balance : Factory Default
* Video Options
o Motion Enhancer : Off
o Motion Enhancer : Off
o Cinemotion : Auto

Also check out the Color Matrix and Power saving mode.

Nice tv you have there. Im jealous

[Hillside Trece]

Originally Posted by spaceape

@Hillside Trece: It looks like you might need to set it to custom to be able to choose the warm setting on your KDS-50A2020:









Also check out the Color Matrix and Power saving mode.

Nice tv you have there. Im jealous

Hey Tommy,

Thanks for the kind words at the end there; what kind of display are you running that you are "jealous" of my SXRD?

As for the modes, I realize that Custom opens up access to Warm color temp -- and I still have my manual which you graciously clipped for me above. I was merely pointing out to Lloyd that my model doesn't have an "official" Cinema/Theater mode.

BTW -- where did you get the settings you posted?

Oh, also -- with regard to Color Matrix, I leave this on "Standard" as I was told this shouldn't really be played with in the "Custom" Color Matrix menu...and with Power Save, I leave this OFF as it seems to provide full output from this lamp.

In my opinion, any lamp-driven display should be configured to allow full light output (not through picture modes like putting it on Vivid or cranking contrast up to 100, but by opening up Power Save features, etc.)...

What made you mention Color Matrix and Power Save?

[spaceape]

Originally Posted by Hillside Trece

Hey Tommy,

Thanks for the kind words at the end there; what kind of display are you running that you are "jealous" of my SXRD?

As for the modes, I realize that custom opens up access to Warm color temp -- and I still have my manual which you graciously clipped for me above. I was merely pointing out to Lloyd that my model doesn't have an "official" Cinema/Theater mode.

BTW -- where did you get the settings you posted?

Oh, also -- with regard to Color Matrix, I leave this on "Standard" as I was told this shouldn't really be played with in the "Custom" Color Matrix menu...and with Power Save, I leave this OFF as it seems to provide full output from this lamp.

In my opinion, any lamp-driven display should be configured to allow full light output (not through picture modes like putting it on Vivid or cranking contrast up to 100, but by opening up Power Save features, etc.)...

What made you mention Color Matrix and Power Save?

In that case mate i would recommended custom and warm 2 but it's totally up to you of cause. Just giving you the option.

About the setting i just looked at the online manual >Link< (navigate at the left side of the page).

>Direct link to your online manual<

http://www.tweaktv.com/tweak-my-tv/c...s-50a2000.html

About the last two options. Well they just seemed relevant be cause they would influence your color and black level but i just quickly looked over it. There might have been a couple things i'd miss

My tv is only a cheap old 32" lcd so that's why i said that last part hehe