Official word from Sony on PS3/HD audio issues! - Blu-ray Forum

JohnGalt · 12-28-2007, 05:49 PM

Well, official non-answer is more like it. The question:

Quote:

I recently upgraded my home theater and chose your PS3 as my Blu-ray player. I'm extremely happy with the performance of your product thus far with the exception of its seeming deficiency in the HD Audio arena. Specifically I'd like to know if the PS3 will eventually be able to: 1) Decode DTS HD Master Audio internally and send it to my receiver as an LPCM stream? 2) Pass Dolby True HD to my receiver via bitstream to allow my receiver to decode this format? and 3) Pass DTS True HD via bitstream to my receiver to allow my receiver to decode this format? I'm not requesting specific dates or timetables and understand that you cannot provide such information but I would like to have some idea as to whether I should keep the PS3 in my system or replace it with a newer stand-alone from a competitor that implements this functionality. Any light you can shed on this issue will be very helpful.

And the non-answer:

Quote:

Dear Sir or Madam,

I am sorry to hear that you are experiencing problems with your product. Unfortunately, Sony Direct Customer Care representatives do not have the detailed technical knowledge to diagnose and troubleshoot your product.

For technical assistance with the PlayStation 2, PS One, or PSP in the U.S. & Canada, please contact SCEA Consumer Service at 1-800-345-SONY (7669) Monday - Saturday 6:00 AM - 8:00 PM PST and Sunday 7:00 - AM 6:30 PM PST.

Please let me know if you have any further questions.

Thank you for choosing Sony Style!

Belinda Alva,
Sony Direct Customer Care
www.sonystyle.com

I asked a question regarding the PS3. Sony not only misinterpreted the question, presuming I has having trouble when it seems quite clear to me that I inferred no such thing, but also responded with a number to call regarding issues with PS2, PS1 and PSP products but made no mention whatsoever of the PS3 which is the only Sony product to which I referred in my original question.

That was helpful.

maximiza · 12-28-2007, 05:51 PM

looks like a bot response I think they are off this week.

JohnGalt · 12-28-2007, 05:54 PM

I submitted the question two weeks ago. The bot response came in five minutes, this is, unfortunately, the real one.

JohnGalt · 12-28-2007, 05:55 PM

Though they could save a lot of money by just closing down their support group if this is the best it can do. A 'bot would be just as effective.

catterwall · 12-28-2007, 05:59 PM

mother fu$%ers... i hate "customer service". almost always a disservice.

sj001 · 12-28-2007, 06:00 PM

Well, hopefully after the beginning of the new year, we will see the SCEA insider on here and he can answer those questions.

JohnGalt · 12-28-2007, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sj001

Well, hopefully after the beginning of the new year, we will see the SCEA insider on here and he can answer those questions.

That's actually the reason I bothered to post this thread.

mgonzo2u · 12-28-2007, 06:03 PM

IMO, the Sony written reply is clear in its intent to help you (despite the apparent typo on the PS # type).

YOU need to contact their technical support team with your question. They have supplied you with the number to call and the time frame to do it within. What more do you want/need?

This is how DirecTv operates as well.

If I have questions about my equipment, I can't just call a CSR and expect technical questions answered, they have to transfer me to their "Tech Support" division where I get the properly trained personal to usually answer my question.

KingDeezie · 12-28-2007, 06:05 PM

I think by the time that Sony has actually released the firmware that lets the PS3 internally decode DTS MA, there will be a standalone player excellently priced that does it and most of us will have moved on.

un4gvn94538 · 12-28-2007, 06:08 PM

i sent the same question and got the same response a month ago. then i replied and told them they are useless. then they sent me the same response again

in the mean time i found the answers to my questions except for when will it decode dts ma. seems no one really knows. even though bitstreaming isnt ever going to be possible, im ok with it as long as they get off thier buts and release dts ma decoding

Scorxpion · 12-28-2007, 06:47 PM

I recently upgraded my home theater and chose your PS3 as my Blu-ray player. I'm extremely happy with the performance of your product thus far with the exception of its seeming deficiency in the HD Audio arena. Specifically I'd like to know if the PS3 will eventually be able to: 1) Decode DTS HD Master Audio internally and send it to my receiver as an LPCM stream? 2) Pass Dolby True HD to my receiver via bitstream to allow my receiver to decode this format? and 3) Pass DTS True HD via bitstream to my receiver to allow my receiver to decode this format? I'm not requesting specific dates or timetables and understand that you cannot provide such information but I would like to have some idea as to whether I should keep the PS3 in my system or replace it with a newer stand-alone from a competitor that implements this functionality. Any light you can shed on this issue will be very helpful.

Let me answer your question in what i believe is going to be true:

DTSHDMA is going to be released through firmware update early in January 2008 and the middle of that month this is what i conclude and gathered my information from different sites including dvdfile and Digitalbits.The problem is not available now doesnt mean at all sony is not working on it ,they already know PS3 capability and what a wonderful machine as customers have in their hand now"probably the firmware update exist in their laboratory under their supervision and not ready to be released yet".If they released it now and according to my belief nobody will buy blu-ray player as standalone we will buy only PS3.

On the other hand,Panasonic player BD30 is doing great in decoding and outputting DTSHDMA through HDMI.Sony players the 500 series and the elite one will be getting sooner DTSHDMA decoding.

The only problem and i'm not sure about it 100 percent is PS3 cannot output DTSHDMA as bitstream via HDMI to the receiver.Decoding it internally and passing it as LPCM right.

FOX knows that PS3 will decode DTSHDMA or otherwise they will never released their movies using this lossless sound.Patient is the key and in overall we will soon get the only missing future from PS3.

ryoohki · 12-28-2007, 10:47 PM

The HDMI Transmitter chip inside the PS3 is a HDMI 1.3 LITE chip

I can transmit all video spec of HDMI 1.3 (including Deep Color) but can only do PCM upto 7.1, DD and DTS. This chip can't output bitstream of DTS HD and DD TrueHD. It's not a question of software, but it's a hardware limitation.

fattyslimslim · 12-28-2007, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryoohki

The HDMI Transmitter chip inside the PS3 is a HDMI 1.3 LITE chip

I can transmit all video spec of HDMI 1.3 (including Deep Color) but can only do PCM upto 7.1, DD and DTS. This chip can't output bitstream of DTS HD and DD TrueHD. It's not a question of software, but it's a hardware limitation.

So is that posted somewhere-about the LITE chip? What is this...some diet soda we are talking about?

Maybe it is just me, but to me it makes sense that a compressed soundtrack (dts-ma) would take less bandwidth than a decoded PCM soundtrack (otherwise what is the use for compression?) so if it can pass the pcm soundtrack at 6-8mbps, tell me the bitstream of dts-ma is larger than that....

I'm sorry, but if you can give me the link where Sony says the hdmi chip is "lite" it might be easier to believe that...

Robmx · 12-28-2007, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryoohki

The HDMI Transmitter chip inside the PS3 is a HDMI 1.3 LITE chip

I can transmit all video spec of HDMI 1.3 (including Deep Color) but can only do PCM upto 7.1, DD and DTS. This chip can't output bitstream of DTS HD and DD TrueHD. It's not a question of software, but it's a hardware limitation.

I heard it was switched in Nov 06 to HDMI 1.3a.... Nothing was mentioned about it being a LITE chip.

un4gvn94538 · 12-28-2007, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robmx

I heard it was switched in Nov 06 to HDMI 1.3a.... Nothing was mentioned about it being a LITE chip.

where did you hear this?

Robmx · 12-28-2007, 11:12 PM

[QUOTE=fattyslimslim;448670]

Maybe it is just me, but to me it makes sense that a compressed soundtrack (dts-ma) would take less bandwidth than a decoded PCM soundtrack (otherwise what is the use for compression?) so if it can pass the pcm soundtrack at 6-8mbps, tell me the bitstream of dts-ma is larger than that....

DTS-HD Master Audio is capable of delivering audio that is a bit-for-bit identical to the studio master. DTS-HD Master Audio delivers audio at super high variable bit rates -24.5 mega-bits per second (Mbps) on Blu-ray discs and 18.0 Mbps on HD-DVD - that are significantly higher than standard DVDs . This bit stream is so "fast" and the transfer rate is so "high" that it can deliver the Holy Grail of audio: 7.1 audio channels at 96k sampling frequency/24 bit depths that are identical to the original. With DTS-HD Master Audio, you will be able to experience movies and music, exactly as the artist intended: clear, pure, and uncompromised.

quetzalcoatl · 12-28-2007, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fattyslimslim

So is that posted somewhere-about the LITE chip? What is this...some diet soda we are talking about?

Maybe it is just me, but to me it makes sense that a compressed soundtrack (dts-ma) would take less bandwidth than a decoded PCM soundtrack (otherwise what is the use for compression?) so if it can pass the pcm soundtrack at 6-8mbps, tell me the bitstream of dts-ma is larger than that....

I'm sorry, but if you can give me the link where Sony says the hdmi chip is "lite" it might be easier to believe that...

Where you might think that PCM goes back to the begining with HDMI and the bitstreaming of TrueHD and DTS HD MA was added with 1.3.

As to the chip not doing it this is from an insider.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=3057

Quote:

This question is for Talk or any other Blu-Ray insider. Will it ever be possible with a firware update for the PS3 to pass DTS MA or Dolby HD bitstream to a receiver?

I'm told by a Sony contact (not in the Playstation group) that it's likely the current hardware design doesn't support bitstream output.

It is really not a lite chip as was said it is the fact that HDMI does not require certian things to be a 1.3 chip. It is like a buffet take what you want and leave what you want. Would be nice if it was all or nothing but it is not.

http://www.hdmi.org/learningcenter/faq.aspx#hdmi_1.3

Quote:

Q. How will consumers know which products have the latest implementation of HDMI 1.3?

Consumers should not look for a particular version of HDMI, but rather for the functionality that they want the device to support (Deep Color, specific audio formats, etc.). Alternatively, consumers can look for support for these features called out in the manufacturer’s product information.

fattyslimslim · 12-29-2007, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robmx

DTS-HD Master Audio is capable of delivering audio that is a bit-for-bit identical to the studio master. DTS-HD Master Audio delivers audio at super high variable bit rates -24.5 mega-bits per second (Mbps) on Blu-ray discs and 18.0 Mbps on HD-DVD - that are significantly higher than standard DVDs . This bit stream is so "fast" and the transfer rate is so "high" that it can deliver the Holy Grail of audio: 7.1 audio channels at 96k sampling frequency/24 bit depths that are identical to the original. With DTS-HD Master Audio, you will be able to experience movies and music, exactly as the artist intended: clear, pure, and uncompromised.

Thanks for that detailed information, I did not know that. It just seems unreal to me that it would take up more bandwidth than pcm...

ryoohki · 12-29-2007, 01:48 AM

It's not a question of bandwithd but feature..

The PS3 have the SIL9132 HDMI 1.3 Transmiter Chip, witch is called 'LITE' because there's a 9134 is was release in Jan 07 for manifacturing..

By a Simple EMAIL with Silicone here's the reply

'9132 doesn't support Dolby True HD and DTS HD.'

Her Sister the 9134 does support it and it's what the panasonic and samsung latest model have, i think the S500 and ES2000 from Sony have this chip too...

The XA2 and A35 on the HD DVD side also have this chip...

The PS3 could one day DECODE IT and send it in PCM , just like it does for TrueHD, but Bitstreaming is just impossible..

DrasticPlastic · 12-31-2007, 08:00 PM

I guess we will have to wait for the PS4 to be able to bitstream TrueHD and DTS-MA

Too bad Sony couldn't have used the updated 9134 chip on the new 40 gig PS3s, but I'm sure they just used their current supply of 9132 chips, and that helped keep the cost down, and everyone who has a diff. PS3 model from getting upset.

12-28-2007, 06:47 PM	#11
Scorxpion Blu-ray Guru Member since:Dec 2006 Location:Middle East,Lebanon Blu-ray collection:57	I recently upgraded my home theater and chose your PS3 as my Blu-ray player. I'm extremely happy with the performance of your product thus far with the exception of its seeming deficiency in the HD Audio arena. Specifically I'd like to know if the PS3 will eventually be able to: 1) Decode DTS HD Master Audio internally and send it to my receiver as an LPCM stream? 2) Pass Dolby True HD to my receiver via bitstream to allow my receiver to decode this format? and 3) Pass DTS True HD via bitstream to my receiver to allow my receiver to decode this format? I'm not requesting specific dates or timetables and understand that you cannot provide such information but I would like to have some idea as to whether I should keep the PS3 in my system or replace it with a newer stand-alone from a competitor that implements this functionality. Any light you can shed on this issue will be very helpful. Let me answer your question in what i believe is going to be true: DTSHDMA is going to be released through firmware update early in January 2008 and the middle of that month this is what i conclude and gathered my information from different sites including dvdfile and Digitalbits.The problem is not available now doesnt mean at all sony is not working on it ,they already know PS3 capability and what a wonderful machine as customers have in their hand now"probably the firmware update exist in their laboratory under their supervision and not ready to be released yet".If they released it now and according to my belief nobody will buy blu-ray player as standalone we will buy only PS3. On the other hand,Panasonic player BD30 is doing great in decoding and outputting DTSHDMA through HDMI.Sony players the 500 series and the elite one will be getting sooner DTSHDMA decoding. The only problem and i'm not sure about it 100 percent is PS3 cannot output DTSHDMA as bitstream via HDMI to the receiver.Decoding it internally and passing it as LPCM right. FOX knows that PS3 will decode DTSHDMA or otherwise they will never released their movies using this lossless sound.Patient is the key and in overall we will soon get the only missing future from PS3. Last edited by Scorxpion; 12-28-2007 at 06:50 PM.

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12-28-2007, 05:51 PM	#2
maximiza Active Member Member since:Sep 2007 Location:Queens Village, NYC	looks like a bot response I think they are off this week.

12-28-2007, 05:54 PM	#3
JohnGalt Senior Member Member since:Sep 2007 Trading Score:4	I submitted the question two weeks ago. The bot response came in five minutes, this is, unfortunately, the real one.

12-28-2007, 05:55 PM	#4
JohnGalt Senior Member Member since:Sep 2007 Trading Score:4	Though they could save a lot of money by just closing down their support group if this is the best it can do. A 'bot would be just as effective.

12-28-2007, 05:59 PM	#5
catterwall Active Member Member since:May 2007 Location:Newberg, OR	mother fu$%ers... i hate "customer service". almost always a disservice.

12-28-2007, 06:00 PM	#6
sj001 Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Rochester, NY Blu-ray collection:317 DVD collection:17 Trading Score:5	Well, hopefully after the beginning of the new year, we will see the SCEA insider on here and he can answer those questions.

12-28-2007, 06:03 PM	#8
mgonzo2u Expert Member Member since:Jul 2007 Location:O.C. KOOK FOR LIFE Blu-ray collection:112	IMO, the Sony written reply is clear in its intent to help you (despite the apparent typo on the PS # type). YOU need to contact their technical support team with your question. They have supplied you with the number to call and the time frame to do it within. What more do you want/need? This is how DirecTv operates as well. If I have questions about my equipment, I can't just call a CSR and expect technical questions answered, they have to transfer me to their "Tech Support" division where I get the properly trained personal to usually answer my question.

12-28-2007, 06:05 PM	#9
KingDeezie Active Member Member since:Mar 2007	I think by the time that Sony has actually released the firmware that lets the PS3 internally decode DTS MA, there will be a standalone player excellently priced that does it and most of us will have moved on.

12-28-2007, 06:08 PM	#10
un4gvn94538 Blu-ray Knight Top contributor Member since:Dec 2007 Location:Limbo (Bakersfield, Ca.) 4K collection:143 Blu-ray collection:811 DVD collection:54 Digital collection:1494 Trading Score:277	i sent the same question and got the same response a month ago. then i replied and told them they are useless. then they sent me the same response again in the mean time i found the answers to my questions except for when will it decode dts ma. seems no one really knows. even though bitstreaming isnt ever going to be possible, im ok with it as long as they get off thier buts and release dts ma decoding

12-28-2007, 10:47 PM	#12
ryoohki Blu-ray Samurai Member since:May 2007 Home Theater Gallery:6 Blu-ray collection:6 Blu-ray reviews:8 Trading Score:5	The HDMI Transmitter chip inside the PS3 is a HDMI 1.3 LITE chip I can transmit all video spec of HDMI 1.3 (including Deep Color) but can only do PCM upto 7.1, DD and DTS. This chip can't output bitstream of DTS HD and DD TrueHD. It's not a question of software, but it's a hardware limitation.

12-28-2007, 11:12 PM	#16
Robmx Active Member Member since:Aug 2007 Location:Niagara, Ontario, Canada	[QUOTE=fattyslimslim;448670] Maybe it is just me, but to me it makes sense that a compressed soundtrack (dts-ma) would take less bandwidth than a decoded PCM soundtrack (otherwise what is the use for compression?) so if it can pass the pcm soundtrack at 6-8mbps, tell me the bitstream of dts-ma is larger than that.... DTS-HD Master Audio is capable of delivering audio that is a bit-for-bit identical to the studio master. DTS-HD Master Audio delivers audio at super high variable bit rates -24.5 mega-bits per second (Mbps) on Blu-ray discs and 18.0 Mbps on HD-DVD - that are significantly higher than standard DVDs . This bit stream is so "fast" and the transfer rate is so "high" that it can deliver the Holy Grail of audio: 7.1 audio channels at 96k sampling frequency/24 bit depths that are identical to the original. With DTS-HD Master Audio, you will be able to experience movies and music, exactly as the artist intended: clear, pure, and uncompromised.

12-29-2007, 01:48 AM	#19
ryoohki Blu-ray Samurai Member since:May 2007 Home Theater Gallery:6 Blu-ray collection:6 Blu-ray reviews:8 Trading Score:5	It's not a question of bandwithd but feature.. The PS3 have the SIL9132 HDMI 1.3 Transmiter Chip, witch is called 'LITE' because there's a 9134 is was release in Jan 07 for manifacturing.. By a Simple EMAIL with Silicone here's the reply '9132 doesn't support Dolby True HD and DTS HD.' Her Sister the 9134 does support it and it's what the panasonic and samsung latest model have, i think the S500 and ES2000 from Sony have this chip too... The XA2 and A35 on the HD DVD side also have this chip... The PS3 could one day DECODE IT and send it in PCM , just like it does for TrueHD, but Bitstreaming is just impossible..

12-31-2007, 08:00 PM	#20
DrasticPlastic Senior Member Member since:Dec 2007 Home Theater Gallery:6 Trading Score:2	I guess we will have to wait for the PS4 to be able to bitstream TrueHD and DTS-MA Too bad Sony couldn't have used the updated 9134 chip on the new 40 gig PS3s, but I'm sure they just used their current supply of 9132 chips, and that helped keep the cost down, and everyone who has a diff. PS3 model from getting upset.

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