Toshiba CE Sales Strategy: Salt the Earth? - Blu-ray Forum

olarmy96 · 11-01-2007, 05:54 PM

I'd like some of those in the CE realm to comment on this, but it seems to me that Toshiba's pricing strategy is effectively a "salt the earth" campaign that will limit other CE companies from even considering entering the HD-DVD market.

If we assume that Toshiba is losing money on these low-priced players, which seems like a safe assumption, then why would any other company enter this space? Once consumers buy players for $200, they will not go back and pay $400 for a player.

Without other CE companies supporting the market, it seems like HD-DVD player sales growth will be severely limited. Sure there may be a temporary uptick, but how long will Toshiba keep dumping money down that hole alone?

MatrixS2000 · 11-01-2007, 05:56 PM

That is already the case with HD DVD. How many other CEs are building HD DVD players that are not rebranded Toshibas?

U_MAD? · 11-01-2007, 05:57 PM

Correct. It's a last effort to control the market.

BluFox · 11-01-2007, 05:58 PM

Does anybody else own patents in HD-DVD laser disc technology (not software) other than Toshiba?? (I know Warner own patents in both HD-DUD and BD)

thrlride · 11-01-2007, 05:59 PM

The only way another manufacturer is going to support HD-DVD with a more expensive player is if it is a good name brand. Just because apex sells a $30 dvd player doesn't mean yamaha doesn't sell a $400 one.

The percentage will favor the cheaper player though I'm sure.

Jim L · 11-01-2007, 05:59 PM

Toshiba looks like they won't go quietly. They want to keep the DVD gravy train going or replace it with the HD DVD gravy train.

At this point they have no way to win this, NONE.

They harder they fight, the more they kill the market for a new hi-def format.

This will screw all the other CE companies, anger the studios and play everything into Microsoft's hands. I have to say that the one who is really interested in quality for the consumer is the Blu-ray side. Both the Microsoft and Toshiba vision of hi-def and home theater is half-assed.

Sometimes I wonder if this is what Toshiba had in mind all along.

Deane Johnson · 11-01-2007, 06:05 PM

I think we can all agree that HD-DVD will fold. With this in mind, think about the internal strife at Toshiba right now.

Someone internally made the decision to develop and market HD-DVD
Someone internally made the decision not to merge with Blu-ray and avoid a war
Someone internally made a decision to rush players to market with defective firmware
Someone internally made the decision to market players below cost
Someone internally made the decision to blow $150 million on bribes
Someone internally made the decision to lower the price even further below cost on players, effectively gutting the market for anyone else to jump in
Someone internally made the decision to keep the format war going when it's obviously lost, and at great cost.

Would you want to be that person at this point? You'd certainly want one of those big corporate golden parachutes about now.

Pete2s · 11-01-2007, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deane Johnson

I think we can all agree that HD-DVD will fold. With this in mind, think about the internal strife at Toshiba right now.

I can't agree HD DVD is going to fold. From the look of things, they just took off their gloves.

Deane Johnson · 11-01-2007, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete2s

I can't agree HD DVD is going to fold. From the look of things, they just took off their gloves.

How so?

olarmy96 · 11-01-2007, 06:13 PM

My point is that they aren't trying to "take off the gloves." In effect, they are trying to burn down the gym, so no one wins. Are other companies really going to fall for this and join up?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete2s

I can't agree HD DVD is going to fold. From the look of things, they just took off their gloves.

thrlride · 11-01-2007, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deane Johnson

How so?

By dropping prices.

If the BD players dropped to $299 or $199 at B&M stores the comments would be the war is over. HD-DVD does the same thing and it reeks of desperation.

Flawed logic. It MAY be desperation and a last effort or it may have been planned all along.

joeorc · 11-01-2007, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluFox

Does anybody else own patents in HD-DVD laser disc technology (not software) other than Toshiba?? (I know Warner own patents in both HD-DUD and BD)

yes Sony can make HD DVD players IF THEY WANTED TO..would they no they do not need to...

Deane Johnson · 11-01-2007, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thrlride

By dropping prices.

If the BD players dropped to $299 or $199 at B&M stores the comments would be the war is over. HD-DVD does the same thing and it reeks of desperation.

Flawed logic. It MAY be desperation and a last effort or it may have been planned all along.

If they've dropped prices, why can't I buy one. My local Wal-marts won't have them at $98, but rather $198. Every Best Buy within 200 miles has none.

Doesn't seem to me this one day promotion is going to shake up too much, much less result in Toshiba "taking off the gloves". More like Toshiba gasping for air.

lymzy · 11-01-2007, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thrlride

It MAY be desperation and a last effort or it may have been planned all along.

I would say it was planned all along. This kind of campaign require a coordinated effort across the board.

Large inventory, distribution channel arrangement, and software ad doesn't happen overnight.

lymzy · 11-01-2007, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeorc

yes Sony can make HD DVD players IF THEY WANTED TO..would they no they do not need to...

If the medium market price for HD DVD player is at $99-$150, it really doesn't matter who makes them.

Living Near Shamu · 11-01-2007, 06:59 PM

Sorry for the ignorance, but what is a DUD? as in HD-DUD?

Deane Johnson · 11-01-2007, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Living Near Shamu

Sorry for the ignorance, but what is a DUD? as in HD-DUD?

DUD would be a DVD that used old red laser technology and only held 30 GB, and wasn't selling very well.

GoldenRedux · 11-01-2007, 08:03 PM

CED

Longshot · 11-01-2007, 08:07 PM

If POShiba had been selling these units as they originally projected there would not be this slash and burn sale. Make no mistake POSihba knows they are in danger of loosing Warner Bros to Bd exclusively. They are doing whatever they can to put as many players in consumers hands to plead with WB's not to leave. It is absolutley a strategy of desperation.

sj001 · 11-01-2007, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lymzy

I would say it was planned all along. This kind of campaign require a coordinated effort across the board.

Large inventory, distribution channel arrangement, and software ad doesn't happen overnight.

But, most people can't find them anywhere, how does this equate into intelligent planning???

11-01-2007, 05:54 PM	#1
olarmy96 Active Member Member since:Jul 2007 Blu-ray collection:110 Digital collection:683 Trading Score:15	Toshiba CE Sales Strategy: Salt the Earth? I'd like some of those in the CE realm to comment on this, but it seems to me that Toshiba's pricing strategy is effectively a "salt the earth" campaign that will limit other CE companies from even considering entering the HD-DVD market. If we assume that Toshiba is losing money on these low-priced players, which seems like a safe assumption, then why would any other company enter this space? Once consumers buy players for $200, they will not go back and pay $400 for a player. Without other CE companies supporting the market, it seems like HD-DVD player sales growth will be severely limited. Sure there may be a temporary uptick, but how long will Toshiba keep dumping money down that hole alone?

11-01-2007, 05:59 PM	#6
Jim L Special Member Top contributor Member since:Apr 2006 Location:Myrtle Beach, SC Blu-ray reviews: 12 Trading Score:20	Toshiba is greedy, plain and simple Toshiba looks like they won't go quietly. They want to keep the DVD gravy train going or replace it with the HD DVD gravy train. At this point they have no way to win this, NONE. They harder they fight, the more they kill the market for a new hi-def format. This will screw all the other CE companies, anger the studios and play everything into Microsoft's hands. I have to say that the one who is really interested in quality for the consumer is the Blu-ray side. Both the Microsoft and Toshiba vision of hi-def and home theater is half-assed. Sometimes I wonder if this is what Toshiba had in mind all along.

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11-01-2007, 05:56 PM	#2
MatrixS2000 Power Member Member since:Mar 2007 Location:Toronto, Canada 4K collection:48 Blu-ray collection:305 Trading Score:6	That is already the case with HD DVD. How many other CEs are building HD DVD players that are not rebranded Toshibas?

11-01-2007, 05:57 PM	#3
U_MAD? New Member Member since:Nov 2007	Correct. It's a last effort to control the market.

11-01-2007, 05:58 PM	#4
BluFox Active Member Member since:Jan 2007	Does anybody else own patents in HD-DVD laser disc technology (not software) other than Toshiba?? (I know Warner own patents in both HD-DUD and BD)

11-01-2007, 05:59 PM	#5
thrlride Banned Member since:Oct 2007	The only way another manufacturer is going to support HD-DVD with a more expensive player is if it is a good name brand. Just because apex sells a $30 dvd player doesn't mean yamaha doesn't sell a $400 one. The percentage will favor the cheaper player though I'm sure.

11-01-2007, 06:05 PM	#7
Deane Johnson Active Member Member since:Nov 2006 Location:Omaha, NE	I think we can all agree that HD-DVD will fold. With this in mind, think about the internal strife at Toshiba right now. Someone internally made the decision to develop and market HD-DVD Someone internally made the decision not to merge with Blu-ray and avoid a war Someone internally made a decision to rush players to market with defective firmware Someone internally made the decision to market players below cost Someone internally made the decision to blow $150 million on bribes Someone internally made the decision to lower the price even further below cost on players, effectively gutting the market for anyone else to jump in Someone internally made the decision to keep the format war going when it's obviously lost, and at great cost. Would you want to be that person at this point? You'd certainly want one of those big corporate golden parachutes about now.

11-01-2007, 06:59 PM	#16
Living Near Shamu Blu-ray Samurai Member since:Oct 2007 Location:Austin, TX Trading Score:42	Sorry for the ignorance, but what is a DUD? as in HD-DUD?

11-01-2007, 08:03 PM	#18
GoldenRedux Power Member Member since:Sep 2006 Blu-ray reviews:1	CED

11-01-2007, 08:07 PM	#19
Longshot Senior Member Member since:Apr 2006 Blu-ray reviews:2	If POShiba had been selling these units as they originally projected there would not be this slash and burn sale. Make no mistake POSihba knows they are in danger of loosing Warner Bros to Bd exclusively. They are doing whatever they can to put as many players in consumers hands to plead with WB's not to leave. It is absolutley a strategy of desperation.

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