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Old 08-12-2017, 08:26 AM   #1
Poya Poya is offline
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Disney Disney and their Downfall into Creative Bankruptcy

In 1923, a new studio was formed by a man named Walt Disney. There is a lot to be said about this bit of context but that would take too much of the thread for me to make my point, so I'll just abridge it. His studio was seen as a haven for groundbreaking animation techniques, such as the first sound cartoon to growing even more ambitious, which lead him to creating the first full-length animated feature, which you all know as Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs. Afterwards, he's had his ups and downs all the way to his death. After his passing, the studio was like a chicken without a head, stumbling around aimlessly without any direction. Around this time, a new division was formed called Touchstone Pictures, which would release more adult fare while keeping the family friendly Disney image. They had their hits, such as Splash and Who Framed Roger Rabbit, which helped Disney quite a bit. A few years later, they would acquire Miramax, which specialized in groundbreaking films that changed the indie scene, more specifically with Pulp Fiction.

However, in 1989, they entered into a renaissance that began with The Little Mermaid and it its arguable peak with the first animated Best Picture nominee, Beauty and the Beast. However, as then-CEO Michael Eisner became even more controlling towards the company and his many infamous bonehead decisions, the renaissance was coming to a close and Disney was becoming a walking punchline, with many bombs, such as Home on the Range, which is believed to have killed off the idea of 2D animation being relevant in the cinemas ever again. Eisner finally left, with Robert Iger replacing him. Iger's influence to what Disney has become can't be understated. He is responsible for Disney's acquisitions of Pixar, Marvel, and Lucasfilm, along with a second renaissance that arguably began with Bolt or later on, and a slew of remakes of the films from their canon, starting with Alice in Wonderland, ushering in a new age of success for the company. Along with chairman Alan Horn and president Sean Bailey, Disney has been releasing films that have made billions each year.

With all that out of the way, what is the problem? Well, the lack of genuine original content is a serious problem. The remakes, in particular, are very distressing. Now, I have no problem with remakes. I'm a huge fan of 1982's The Thing and 1983's Scarface, and both are remakes of classic, beloved films (coincidently enough, both have Howard Hawks involved in some capacity), so a remake can be a great film on its own, but it also needs to be its own film as well. To be fair, Disney's remakes have attempted to add new additions to them but they end up becoming overwhelmed by how similar they are to their source. Especially this year's Beauty and the Beast, which nearly quotes the original film line by line. These remakes have been absolutely successful and have garnered billions altogether, so no use in complaining, huh? Next, we have remakes of Peter Pan, Dumbo, Snow White, Mulan, The Little Mermaid, and many more. Is it because they weren't that good so they wanted to redo them to correct whatever mistakes they made? Probably but the real answer shouldn't come as a surprise.

Their Marvel and Star Wars films have also been concerning to me, especially with their "producer-driven" approach to the films, Kevin Feige and Kathleen Kennedy as the heads of the respective divisions. Many directors have challenged this approach and have ended up leaving, only to be quickly be replaced by directors who will conform to whatever the studio head wants the film to be like. But the result are films that feel similar to the last film, not too much of a problem for Star Wars but has been a persistent problem for the Marvel Cinematic Universe, which is their most common criticism, even by those who like the films. There have been defenses for this practice, as this is the only way to have a connected universe for these respective franchises, but I disagree. If done right, you can have a franchise that has films that neatly connect with each other while also letting the director make the film he/she wants to make and have them stand on their own without having to watch the other films. For example, the controversial DC Extended Universe isn't perfect in this regard but they have been keeping a "director-driven" approach to their cinematic universe, and even if you don't like the films, at least each one from a different filmmaker has a different tone and feel than the last, especially Wonder Woman, which perfectly fits with the established universe while also being a great, stand-alone film.

Of course, there is the other defense of that they are releasing original content through their Disney Animated Canon with films like Zootopia and Moana and through Pixar, such as Inside Out. I'll concede that there is a point to be made there, as these films aren't based on any existing property, but the fact that they are released through the Disney Animated Canon and Pixar, both arguably brands in their own right, do they actually count? Now, granted, just because they're released from these divisions doesn't mean they are guaranteed hits. Just ask the majority of the 2000s Disney films and The Good Dinosaur. But at the same time, would they have done as well if they were released through a smaller animation company? This is obviously up for debate but I wanted to bring this up for the sake of argument.

But you're probably saying that it's pointless for me to complain. Disney is a company and it's their job to make money. Yes, that is absolutely true. They wouldn't exist if they didn't make money to make more content. That's how business works and it's naïve to suggest otherwise. They can keep making blockbusters, I don't mind that, regardless of my opinions of them. It just would be nice if they would release more smaller affair here and there. They had two divisions that would allow for more risky ventures and creative films. Unfortunately, Miramax has been sold off to another company (though, in Disney's defense, it was a sinking ship due to internal conflict) and Touchstone is practically dead. After Iger came on board, he had a strong stance on delivering content that was less risky and more profitable and Touchstone hasn't exactly fulfilled those qualifications. The only think keeping them going was though releasing DreamWorks films, though now that founder Steven Spielberg has decided to bring his company to his old home back at Universal, Touchstone basically belly-flopped, with their final film at the moment being the box office bomb The Light Between Oceans. Of course, Disney has been releasing smaller films though their ESPN division, like the underrated Queen of Katwe, but that bombed due to lack of good promotion and a terrible release date.

As pointed out at the interview I posted, it seems that Disney is afraid of investing in more content that doesn't conform to their brand, such as John Carter and The Lone Ranger, but those flopped for a variety of different reasons than not being "Disney". perhaps they shouldn't have shilled out that much to make them? Perhaps they could've been of better quality? I don't know but there are other reasons. Why not vary the slate? What if Warner Brothers made gangster films throughout their years? What if Universal only made horror films? They need to trust the audience to accept these type of films. They had a good run when Touchstone was releasing films of varying genres and content. Is it really a good idea to turn back on that for the sake of profit?

Now, I fully understand that there is a fanbase for these films and they are genuinely adored by the general public, and that is absolutely fine. This is an entirely subjective essay. I don't expect everyone to agree with me. I just want a middle ground for Disney. I mean, Universal has their big franchises and even they release smaller, riskier films because they want to give variety to their filmography. Heck, one of them, Get Out, was insanely profitable and critically acclaimed. I'm not saying smaller films mean automatic greatness. As much as I say how A24 is my favorite studio right now, they've made a few films I wasn't too crazy about, but at least I can respect that they tried. If other studios can achieve this, why is Disney reluctant to do so? They're already making an insane amount of money through their parks, films, and merchandises. Not even the fledging ESPN can bring them down. All I want is a creative return to form from Disney.

Last edited by Poya; 08-12-2017 at 08:57 AM.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:33 AM   #2
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:51 AM   #3
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If you personally dont like their direction, fine. But to call it a downfall or creative bankruptcy is pretty laughable. Most people would agree they are still churning out plenty of great, creative films.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:54 AM   #4
Poya Poya is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cinemaphile View Post
If you personally dont like their direction, fine. But to call it a downfall or creative bankruptcy is pretty laughable. Most people would agree they are still churning out plenty of great, creative films.
This is a subjective essay and whether they are great and creative is in the eye of the beholder. You see them as that, that is ok. I chose the title to reflect my opinion on what is going on. You don't have to agree but it's how I feel. I never said they were bad; just uncreative, and that's just me.
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Old 08-12-2017, 08:58 AM   #5
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Mr Walt Disney would be disgusted with the current direction

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Old 08-12-2017, 09:06 AM   #6
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Poya, there is one huge factor you are forgetting:

People love, cherish and hold superior the films from their childhood and youth. Period.

There is a reason people say old people are senile for saying "back in my day, blah blah blah was better." If you do that you are disrespecting the younger generations who grew up with Lucas' Star Wars prequels and the newer Disney movies that you think suck. To younger generations watching them now, these will be special movies for them. Period.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:07 AM   #7
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Good write up. Usually I stop reading TLDR posts after one paragraph, but I finished it this time. Because agree or disagree, it is worth a discussion, it could be a serious issue for the industry as a whole.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:12 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toddly6666 View Post
Poya, there is one huge factor you are forgetting:

People love, cherish and hold superior the films from their childhood and youth. Period.

There is a reason people say old people are senile for saying "back in my day, blah blah blah was better." If you do that you are disrespecting the younger generations who grew up with Lucas' Star Wars prequels and the newer Disney movies that you think suck. To younger generations watching them now, these will be special movies for them. Period.
Exactly why they should not be remade. It's not like the original childhood films are lost, they are still there. Once in a while on the deserving one is fine, but when it becomes the only way to make money then it's an issue.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:26 AM   #9
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Honestly, the thing that really bothers me about Disney is the xeroxed live action remake phase.

It started out quite promising with "Cinderella", a live action remake that was quite an improvement over the really bland animated original, but then "The Jungle Book" happened...

[Show spoiler]Maleficent doesn't count, as that's a totally different thing altogether. It honestly has way more in common with Alice in Wonderland than the Disney remakesploitation nonsense.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:33 AM   #10
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Best aspect of contemporary Disney, imo, is their intermittent hits in the animation division, such as Moana, Tangled, and a few others that would've gone down as classics in their purple period of the 90's. I'm just waiting for them to get this current 'remake a classic' fad out of their system. Fair play, if people are flocking to see these films, then that's awesome. I'll watch them, too, but I'm not on tenterhooks waiting for them to drop. The Lucasfilm and Marvel side of things is a sprawling, multi-faceted mess (in a good way) that I won't pretend to understand.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:39 AM   #11
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TOTALLY different product and overall feel from when I was a little boy 30 years ago. It was all magic and fantasy then.
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Old 08-12-2017, 09:56 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aiman04 View Post
Exactly why they should not be remade. It's not like the original childhood films are lost, they are still there. Once in a while on the deserving one is fine, but when it becomes the only way to make money then it's an issue.
As the original post said, many younger generations never saw the originals so remakes are special to them: Scarface, Titanic, Last of the Mohicans, The Nutty Professor, and even most Disney movies (cartoon and live-action) are remakes of previous films. Remakes dont bug younger generations, just us old farts who wanna be film snobs.

Last edited by toddly6666; 08-12-2017 at 10:00 AM.
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Old 08-12-2017, 10:22 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toddly6666 View Post
As the original post said, many younger generations never saw the originals so remakes are special to them: Scarface, Titanic, Last of the Mohicans, The Nutty Professor, and even most Disney movies (cartoon and live-action) are remakes of previous films. Remakes dont bug younger generations, just us old farts who wanna be film snobs.
The issue is not the quality of the remakes, some can even be good. They don't bug me that much. But the OP wasn't talking about that. Disney is actually using nostalgia to get the older generations to theaters, thinking how much they like the original when they were younger they will bring their kids too. In doing this strategy almost constantly they're suppressing creative ouputs from the filmmakers.
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Old 08-12-2017, 10:31 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeneD5 View Post
TOTALLY different product and overall feel from when I was a little boy 30 years ago. It was all magic and fantasy then.
We were both lucky, it was all Condorman, The Shaggy DA and Candleshoe when I was growing up. Beloved classics, their like never to be seen again.
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Old 08-12-2017, 10:38 AM   #15
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I think Brave is one of their best ever.
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Old 08-12-2017, 10:47 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aiman04 View Post
The issue is not the quality of the remakes, some can even be good. They don't bug me that much. But the OP wasn't talking about that. Disney is actually using nostalgia to get the older generations to theaters, thinking how much they like the original when they were younger they will bring their kids too. In doing this strategy almost constantly they're suppressing creative ouputs from the filmmakers.
Indeed. The Pandering Awakens is evidence of that, specially when they had an original story from the creator himself that they chose not to adapt.
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:18 AM   #17
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That's all very well, but no matter how much words we put into it, in the end we have only ourselves to blame for the current road Disney is walking.

Not meant in a negative way, btw. They give us great stuff, constantly.
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:24 AM   #18
Ernest Rister Ernest Rister is offline
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Disney's been a brand since the 20's. Disney's been a brand coming up on 100 years. If you don't understand that, you don't understand Disney.
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Old 08-12-2017, 11:27 AM   #19
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It's hard to blame Disney for the creativity bereft Marvel/Star Wars/Live-Action Remake product lines when all three continue to make money hand over fist. It rests upon the filmgoing audience to decide they want something more and stop going to those movies in droves.
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Old 08-12-2017, 12:09 PM   #20
Ernest Rister Ernest Rister is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kidglov3s View Post
It's hard to blame Disney for the creativity bereft Marvel/Star Wars/Live-Action Remake product lines when all three continue to make money hand over fist. It rests upon the filmgoing audience to decide they want something more and stop going to those movies in droves.
The studio makes original IP, people just don't go see them. They keep making them anyway.

By the way, just out of curiosity, if the OP considers LucasFilm, Marvel, and Pixar films to be Disney films, does he or she also consider Miramax films to be Disney films? Disney's Tarantino films seem to have a fan base, don't they. When the OP watches ESPN, does he think, "Disney's doing a great job with Monday Night Football!" When someone's watching ABC, Lifetime, the History Channel, or streaming something on Hulu, do they say, "Man, that was a great Disney TV show! Disney' Hulu's sure is convenient!"

Somehow I doubt it.

Disney is a corporate umbrella underwhich reside a large number of divisions, which now include holdings in books, music, technology, film, tv, gaming, even real estate. "Disney films" are the films produced by the Walt Disney Animation Studio and the Walt Disney Studio. Pixar's upcoming Coco is not a Disney film, it's a Pixar film. Disney, like a bank, agrees to fund Pixar for a return on the investment. Pixar makes the movie, Bob Iger and Alan Horn do not. They're busy. If you buy a 4k TV on your Discover Card, and the TV sucks, do you look at the TV and say, "Discover is making some really bad televisions!"? Of course you don't.

Some of the content Disney funds falls within their brand as a distributor, but not all of it. Disney Movies Anywhere excludes a whole bunch of titles, even including some films made by Walt himself. If their distributed titles work within the Disney brand, sure, they'll be used in that way on their upcoming streaming service and various other platforms...why not? But that's sales and distribution. If you didn't like The Force Awakens or Rogue One, blame Kennedy. If you didn't like Cars 3, blame John Lasseter. If you didn't like Ant-Man, blame Kevin Feige. If you didn't like The Finest Hours, Pirates 5, the BFG, Queen of Katwe, McFarland USA, then blame Alan Horn.
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