AppleTV and projector

[OneQuestionMan]

I will be posting in the projector forum too but I figure some of you folks can help. I don’t have the correct jargon so not sure any of this will make sense.

Anybody here use a projector with their AppleTV?

Long story short - I need to give up my 4K TV for the foreseeable future. I’ve been offered the loan of a new projector as an alternative.

I got briefly test the same model last night to see how it looked. The conditions were not ideal as I didn’t have a screen or a blockout blind. The Mandolorian didn’t look as good as on my HD TV but it was like a being at the cinema - only better than my local as the projection was going out of focus at big movements in screen. I watched a few minutes of other movies and some old movies to see how black & white looks - and they were as good.

The Last Jedi - the lightsabre duel looked good but image was not as good as The Mandolorian.

Rogue One - image was good but not as good as Mando or Last Jedi. Diego Luna’s (and just Diego Luna) costume looked murky and his hair was blotchy.

Mr. Smith Goes to Washington - looked very nice but like Mando, not as good as on my TV

3:10 to Yuma (original) - looked okay. Haven’t watched it on my TV yet so need to compare it tomorrow but I would say just a little better than DVD quality. Not at all as good as on a HD TV.

Blackboard Jungle - looked terrible. On my iPhone and on a HD TV it clean and sharp but on the projector it was it was grainy and murky.

I didn’t have the sense to take photographs and I know that there is a limit to the help and advice they can be given.

It is a HD projector. The brand name is gone out of my head but I will find out. With the right screen or even with new paint on the wall should HD movies look as as they do on a HD TV or iPhone?

The Mandolorian looked the best by far and the image quality in each movie looked so different and Blackboard Junge looked so bad that I’m assuming there was more to it all than the colour of the wall or the light coming in the window (Mando looked good in spite of those). And more to it than adjusting brightness or contrast on the projectorr - if those settings were an issue wouldn’t the B&W movies have all looked equally as bad since they are all they all look equally as good on a HD TV and iPhone? So whatever improvements there would be if I got a screen and blind is not going to magically make Blackboard Jungle look as good as on a HD TV.

Anybody able to give me advice on this?

Cheers

[Fiffy]

It's hard to comment without knowing the projector model you saw. Generally speaking, being able to darken the room is very important for a projector. And if you can darken it, lots of bright surfaces in the room can be a problem because reflected light can bounce around in the room and prevent blacks from being dark on the screen. If you have a smooth white wall that can be acceptable as a projection surface, otherwise you really need a screen.

There are big quality differences between different projectors, particularly in terms of contrast, black levels and maximum brightness. Cheap projectors can look significantly worse than "good" ones. Generally, a projector will not achieve the contrast ratios and black levels that a good TV can, so the picture will usually not "pop" as much. If you are used to HDR, you may miss that too (consumer grade projectors today cannot adequately display HDR).

All that said, a projector provides a much more "cinematic" experience. I do pretty much all my movie watching on my projector, including from my ATV.

I don't have an explanation why your movies seemed to look worse than the Mandalorian. It should not be that way. Flaws in the picture and grain can be more visible on a projector simply because of the size of the image relative to the viewing distance. For the same reason, things that look sharp on a phone or smaller TV may not look so great when the image is much larger. But modern movies like the Star Wars sequels should look good.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

I will be posting in the projector forum too but I figure some of you folks can help. I don’t have the correct jargon so not sure any of this will make sense.

Anybody here use a projector with their AppleTV?

Long story short - I need to give up my 4K TV for the foreseeable future. I’ve been offered the loan of a new projector as an alternative.

I got briefly test the same model last night to see how it looked. The conditions were not ideal as I didn’t have a screen or a blockout blind. The Mandolorian didn’t look as good as on my HD TV but it was like a being at the cinema - only better than my local as the projection was going out of focus at big movements in screen. I watched a few minutes of other movies and some old movies to see how black & white looks - and they were as good.

The Last Jedi - the lightsabre duel looked good but image was not as good as The Mandolorian.

Rogue One - image was good but not as good as Mando or Last Jedi. Diego Luna’s (and just Diego Luna) costume looked murky and his hair was blotchy.

Mr. Smith Goes to Washington - looked very nice but like Mando, not as good as on my TV

3:10 to Yuma (original) - looked okay. Haven’t watched it on my TV yet so need to compare it tomorrow but I would say just a little better than DVD quality. Not at all as good as on a HD TV.

Blackboard Jungle - looked terrible. On my iPhone and on a HD TV it clean and sharp but on the projector it was it was grainy and murky.

I didn’t have the sense to take photographs and I know that there is a limit to the help and advice they can be given.

It is a HD projector. The brand name is gone out of my head but I will find out. With the right screen or even with new paint on the wall should HD movies look as as they do on a HD TV or iPhone?

The Mandolorian looked the best by far and the image quality in each movie looked so different and Blackboard Junge looked so bad that I’m assuming there was more to it all than the colour of the wall or the light coming in the window (Mando looked good in spite of those). And more to it than adjusting brightness or contrast on the projectorr - if those settings were an issue wouldn’t the B&W movies have all looked equally as bad since they are all they all look equally as good on a HD TV and iPhone? So whatever improvements there would be if I got a screen and blind is not going to magically make Blackboard Jungle look as good as on a HD TV.

Anybody able to give me advice on this?

Cheers

It’s such a waste having a projector and running a Apple TV through it. The only content that will do it justice are 4K discs and Blu-ray.

Things will look decent on a tv but as you have discovered, it’s a different story on such a large projector screen.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It’s such a waste having a projector and running a Apple TV through it. The only content that will do it justice are 4K discs and Blu-ray.

Things will look decent on a tv but as you have discovered, it’s a different story on such a large projector screen.

Nonsense.

[D00mM4r1n3]

I've always been happy with just projecting the largest image possible on a wall painted white. "Quantity over quality" Look into DIY videos on Youtube for making your own screen or get some screen paint if you don't want to spend a fortune.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

It’s such a waste having a projector and running a Apple TV through it. The only content that will do it justice are 4K discs and Blu-ray.

Things will look decent on a tv but as you have discovered, it’s a different story on such a large projector screen.

I’m truly, madly, deeply not interested in the “discs are better than digital” malarkey.

I do not care which is better. It is irrelevant to me.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

It's hard to comment without knowing the projector model you saw. Generally speaking, being able to darken the room is very important for a projector. And if you can darken it, lots of bright surfaces in the room can be a problem because reflected light can bounce around in the room and prevent blacks from being dark on the screen. If you have a smooth white wall that can be acceptable as a projection surface, otherwise you really need a screen.

There are big quality differences between different projectors, particularly in terms of contrast, black levels and maximum brightness. Cheap projectors can look significantly worse than "good" ones. Generally, a projector will not achieve the contrast ratios and black levels that a good TV can, so the picture will usually not "pop" as much. If you are used to HDR, you may miss that too (consumer grade projectors today cannot adequately display HDR).

All that said, a projector provides a much more "cinematic" experience. I do pretty much all my movie watching on my projector, including from my ATV.

I don't have an explanation why your movies seemed to look worse than the Mandalorian. It should not be that way. Flaws in the picture and grain can be more visible on a projector simply because of the size of the image relative to the viewing distance. For the same reason, things that look sharp on a phone or smaller TV may not look so great when the image is much larger. But modern movies like the Star Wars sequels should look good.

Thank you for the input.

The projector is a Vanyko Performance V600 - the one I was offered is the same.
The projected image was around 65 inches. I am going to take it as it is really only option for a TV. Plus it will fun to watch on it.

And it was unreasonable of me to expect advice with out at least a few photos for people to see.

I will be painting the room during the week. I have a can of “brilliant white” vinyl matt paint it I will also look into screens**. Once I set up properly I will post a few photos of how the movies look.

Cheers

** Any advice on screen though? Or what to look for?

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by D00mM4r1n3

I've always been happy with just projecting the largest image possible on a wall painted white. "Quantity over quality" Look into DIY videos on Youtube for making your own screen or get some screen paint if you don't want to spend a fortune.

The room is due a paint and I can do that wall white but as I type I’m wondering how movies like Star Wars will, especially A New Hope with all the white costumes.

Isn’t screen paint an expensive option? €100 a can here.

edit - Or are you saying that the paint is inexpensive by comparison to a worthwhile screen?

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

Thank you for the input.

The projector is a Vanyko Performance V600 - the one I was offered is the same.

Well, this is a mini projector, not an actual home theater projector (which costs easily 10 times as much). I couldn't find the Lumens (total light output) on the manufacturer's web site, but I doubt that the projector is able to throw a large image with adequate brightness (and certainly not a 300" screen, as claimed by the manufacturer). Can't say anything about contrast and color accuracy, but don't expect too much.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Well, this is a mini projector, not an actual home theater projector (which costs easily 10 times as much). I couldn't find the Lumens (total light output) on the manufacturer's web site, but I doubt that the projector is able to throw a large image with adequate brightness (and certainly not a 300" screen, as claimed by the manufacturer). Can't say anything about contrast and color accuracy, but don't expect too much.

6800 lumens according to Amazon. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Performance.../dp/B07TWRMJHR

Yes, it is not high end (I should have mentioned that) but it has a lot of positive reviews and there I limit to how good it can look - but that doesn’t explain the difference in quality between 3:10 to Yuma and Blackboard Jungle.

Anyway, as I said it was foolish of me to start the thread without photos. I’ll get those once I the room painted and the projector going.

Cheers

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

I’m truly, madly, deeply not interested in the “discs are better than digital” malarkey.

I do not care which is better. It is irrelevant to me.

It’s not about that. It’s about your comments regarding the picture quality. You would be better off just buying another tv. Project a flawed image and you are obviously going to get a flawed result. TVs paper over the cracks more.

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Nonsense.

It really isn’t, it’s just common sense.

[Socko]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

Anybody here use a projector with their AppleTV?

Yes, but I'm lousy comparison material.
My opinion never counts on here it seems

I do have an AppleTV 4k, but my projector is a 1080p projector.
I'm projecting on a 100" screen, but I don't get 4k or HDR/DV

That said, I wouldn't trade in my 100" 1080p for 50" 4k/HDR/DV
Especially after watching episode 1 of season 2 of the Mandalorian.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Socko

Yes, but I'm lousy comparison material.
My opinion never counts on here it seems

I do have an AppleTV 4k, but my projector is a 1080p projector.
I'm projecting on a 100" screen, but I don't get 4k or HDR/DV

That said, I wouldn't trade in my 100" 1080p for 50" 4k/HDR/DV
Especially after watching episode 1 of season 2 of the Mandalorian.

I welcome all advice and opinion on the issues.

Any idea why two black & white movies with the same picture quality on an iPhone and HD TV (via AppleTV) would have radically different qualities in the projector?

It cannot be the wall, light from outside or the capabilities of the projector because then both movies would be bad. And switched between the two a second time to ensure it wasn’t the WiFi.

As I said above I’ll post photos when I get the room set up so please check back in a week or two.

I would very much enjoy a 100 screen but I got around 65 (might be 70 if I can place a bit further back and that is bigger than my 4K was.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

6800 lumens according to Amazon. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Performance.../dp/B07TWRMJHR

No way a small LED projector has 6800 Lumens. They have probably mixed up Lumens and Lux.

[lgans316]

Be prepared to be disappointed with your new HD projector.

Just get a capable 4K HDR TV or a capable 4K HDR projector which can output enough lumens for a good 4K HDR experience.

With HD content, most HD projectors do a decent job but black levels is where most of them fails. Only few of them can do deep blacks (JVC, Sony and Epson). Even this is not close enough to capable TVs but close enough especially in a light controlled room and the right screen.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

No way a small LED projector has 6800 Lumens. They have probably mixed up Lumens and Lux.

The technobabble goes above my head. I got that number from the title of the product page on Amazon.

I went through a few reviews and it is apparently 5000 lux and 4500 lumens.

I have no idea what it means.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by lgans316

Be prepared to be disappointed with your new HD projector.

Just get a capable 4K HDR TV or a capable 4K HDR projector which can output enough lumens for a good 4K HDR experience.

With HD content, most HD projectors do a decent job but black levels is where most of them fails. Only few of them can do deep blacks (JVC, Sony and Epson). Even this is not close enough to capable TVs but close enough especially in a light controlled room and the right screen.

I was not disappointed the one I tested and the one I am getting is the same. Quite the opposite - I was very impressed. My post is just about the differing results in some movies that don’t have differing results on a HD TV.

And I was curious whether in better conditions can a projector match a HD TV.

[Fiffy]

Originally Posted by OneQuestionMan

The technobabble goes above my head. I got that number from the title of the product page on Amazon.

I went through a few reviews and it is apparently 5000 lux and 4500 lumens.

I have no idea what it means.

Lux is essentially a measure of brightness per surface area. With a projector, the number increases if you reduce the image size while keeping the same total light output, so the manufacturer can inflate the number by moving the projector close to the screen and projecting a very small image. Lumen is a measure of the total light output, which gives you an estimate how large an image a projector can throw with adequate brightness.

I don't believe that a mini projector has 4500 Lumens either. Probably less than half of that. Good full size home theater projectors are typically between about 2500 and 4000 Lumens.

[OneQuestionMan]

Originally Posted by Fiffy

Lux is essentially a measure of brightness per surface area. With a projector, the number increases if you reduce the image size while keeping the same total light output, so the manufacturer can inflate the number by moving the projector close to the screen and projecting a very small image. Lumen is a measure of the total light output, which gives you an estimate how large an image a projector can throw with adequate brightness.

I don't believe that a mini projector has 4500 Lumens either. Probably less than half of that. Good full size home theater projectors are typically between about 2500 and 4000 Lumens.

It is all Greek to me, boss. I could take the projector apart and put it back together with very little effort - but I’ll be damned if I know how it works.

So fair play to you for understanding it and good fortune for me that folks here can help with those black & white movies once I’m up and running.