Stuttering with Mpeg4 AVC blu-ray discs

[flood658]

Hi all,

I just bought a Sony BDUX10S BD drive for my pc and have been trying to play a few movies using PowerDVD ultra.

The ones encoded with Mpeg4 AVC (H264?) stutter a lot and cause my CPU usage to jump to 100% - ex. Xmen 3, All spiderman, AVPR

I tried Crash, goodfellas and they all work fine (forgot which codecs they were, but were diff) - about 25-40% CPU usage.

I am able to play ALL my HD-DVDs w/o a problem (VC-1 encoded) (w/o HW acceleration) - PE, 300, Bourne, Batman, Beowulf, American gangster etc.

Any suggestions?

I have HW acceleration ON.

My PC specs:

Pentium D 2.8 GHz
2GB RAM
ATI AIW x1900 256 MB
500 GB SATA HDD
Sony BDUX10S BD drive
Software: PowerDVD 7 and 8 ultra - lag with both so waste of money for upgrade to 8

I thought it was my CPU, but I don't understand how every other hi-def discs play fine except for the MPEG4 AVC encoded BD (HD-DVDs play even w/o HW accel! at 40-50% CPU).

Thanks

[WickyWoo]

Did you try disabling acceleration? Might be a compatibility problem.

[syncguy]

AVC is computational intensive in comparison to VC-1. This is one of the drawbacks of AVC. Your problem may or may not relate to this. It could be a driver incompatibility issue. Have you tried Cyberlink Adviser to check system compatibility.

[Obiit]

With your CPU being at 100% i'd say that Hardware Acceleration is not happening. As you say it's turned on in PowerDVD do you have the latest driver for your All-In-Wonder ? Also have you updated PowerDVD 7 Ultra to the latest update?

Bet your a bit miffed at PowerDVD 8 Ultra leaving out HD-DVD support !!

HTH

[JeremyPiven]

Your CPU is not cutting it. You want at least a dual core or quad core.

[rarredoa]

I had the same problem, with a sub-par CPU... AND sub-par video card. I ended up upgrading both, but before i upgraded the videocard, i upgraded the CPU. Unfortunately, i was an early adopter of blu-ray PC's so the software/hardware know-how was practically unheard of which meant that I spent hundreds on trial n' error solutions! Not even on this site did I find enough technical know-how at that time, believe it or not! It wasn't until I had BOTH new cpu and video card did I play around and realize that I only needed the video card upgrade the whole time!

The video card might be the only thing u need to upgrade, but if you decide to upgrade the CPU, make sure u upgrade to at least dual-core cpu, not just for blu-ray, but for other PC applications. I recommend nvidia 8500, 8600 or 8800GT. If U wanna stick to ATI I recommend at least an ATI 2400HD. My understanding is that it has dedicated blu-ray/HD DVD hardware acceleration for ALL the codecs (terrible gaming though), under $100. Hopefully the ATI2400HD MIGHT be the only upgrade u need if u don't wanna change your CPU/motherboard

[flood658]

Originally Posted by WickyWoo

Did you try disabling acceleration? Might be a compatibility problem.

I've tried disabling HW accel, it slows it down a little.

[Q]AVC is computational intensive in comparison to VC-1. This is one of the drawbacks of AVC. Your problem may or may not relate to this. It could be a driver incompatibility issue. Have you tried Cyberlink Adviser to check system compatibility.[/Q]

Adviser showed everything compatible last I checked (except for htpc, but I have anydvd)

[q] With your CPU being at 100% i'd say that Hardware Acceleration is not happening. As you say it's turned on in PowerDVD do you have the latest driver for your All-In-Wonder ? Also have you updated PowerDVD 7 Ultra to the latest update?

Bet your a bit miffed at PowerDVD 8 Ultra leaving out HD-DVD support !! [/q]

I tried upgrading to latest powerDVD 7, but that didn't help so I downgraded back cuz I want HD-DVD playback from my HDD too.
I tried to play all these in PowerDVD 8, so I assume I used all the latest updates. I know it sucks that PDVD 8 has no HD-DVD support, but I can keep 7 and 8 at same time, so not a prob

[q] The video card might be the only thing u need to upgrade [/q]

I though the ATI AIW x1900 was able to decode H264 (same as AVC, right?)

From:

http://ati.amd.com/products/RadeonX1...900/index.html

The All-in-Wonder® X1900 features a brand-new graphics processor and proudly follows closely behind its Radeon counterpart. The X1900 is a one-card solution of great performance for extreme gamers, entertainment enthusiasts, home users and moviemakers alike. ATI's Avivo™ display platform gives incredibly rich video quality from capture through to playback, while PCI Express punches through the AGP bandwidth ceiling. The built-in TV tuner, PVR and programming guide provides now or later program enjoyment, while hardware H.264 decoding gives effortless playback of next-generation HD DVD.

It plays all the current games with max settings except for AA, so I hope it's just some setting I can change for proper decoding of the AVC codec.

I have 8.2 catalyst now, I think new ones are out I'll try updating those over the weekend.

[glogrono]

It's definitelly your graphics card. I had the same exact card and MPEG-2 encoded movies played perfectly, but VC-1 movies would stutter making the movie unwatchable. Get an ATI HD-3450 for $49.99 and it will handle any movie you throw at it. It won't do well on 3-d intensive games though.

[rarredoa]

Originally Posted by glogrono

It's definitelly your graphics card. I had the same exact card and MPEG-2 encoded movies played perfectly, but VC-1 movies would stutter making the movie unwatchable. Get an ATI HD-3450 for $49.99 and it will handle any movie you throw at it. It won't do well on 3-d intensive games though.

ATI HD-3450's only fifty bucks!?... I'm not an ATI guy, so i've been out of the loop... I'm sure this will take care of his problem though... My experience was that AVC's were unwatchable, VC-1's were tolerable, and MPEG-2's were flawless. When Blu-ray was first released i remember most titles were MPEG-2, until I watched X-men III... talk about disappointment!

[Obiit]

Originally Posted by rarredoa

If U wanna stick to ATI I recommend at least an ATI 2400HD. My understanding is that it has dedicated blu-ray/HD DVD hardware acceleration for ALL the codecs (terrible gaming though), under $100. Hopefully the ATI2400HD MIGHT be the only upgrade u need if u don't wanna change your CPU/motherboard

The ATI 2400's have problems with MPEG2 but are ok with MPEG4/AVC. If you do want an ATI on the cheap get a HD-3450 as it's newer that the 2000 series and actually cheaper

Don't change your CPU though until you've had a go with the graphics card, as you may have compatibility issues with newer chips (as a Pentium D 2.8 is an old CPU i am assuming you have an old motherboard as well).

[robestyles]

I had a similar problem running a AMD X2 4200+ with a Nvidia 7600GT. I bought the ATI HD-3450 (34.99 after rebate from NewEgg can't beat that) and it now runs perfect. If your not planning to do any gaming go with the ATI HD-3450 you can't beat the value you get from it for videos.

[flood658]

I submitted this post at 11 AM, but it never showed up... twice.. what's wrong with this forum? It lets me start a thread but not reply.. I'm tired of retyping!
EDIT: I think my post was too long hehe, so had to split them up...sorry for the multiple posts.
---------------------------

Did you try disabling acceleration? Might be a compatibility problem.

I've tried disabling HW accel, it slows it down a little.

AVC is computational intensive in comparison to VC-1. This is one of the drawbacks of AVC. Your problem may or may not relate to this. It could be a driver incompatibility issue. Have you tried Cyberlink Adviser to check system compatibility.

Adviser showed everything compatible last I checked (except for htpc, but I have anydvd)

With your CPU being at 100% i'd say that Hardware Acceleration is not happening. As you say it's turned on in PowerDVD do you have the latest driver for your All-In-Wonder ? Also have you updated PowerDVD 7 Ultra to the latest update?

Bet your a bit miffed at PowerDVD 8 Ultra leaving out HD-DVD support !!

I tried upgrading to latest powerDVD 7, but that didn't help so I downgraded back cuz I want HD-DVD playback from my HDD too.
I tried to play all these in PowerDVD 8, so I assume I used all the latest updates. I know it sucks that PDVD 8 has no HD-DVD support, but I can keep 7 and 8 at same time, so not a prob

[flood658]

The video card might be the only thing u need to upgrade

I thought the ATI AIW x1900 was able to decode H264 (same as AVC, right?)

From:

http://ati.amd.com/products/RadeonX1...900/index.html

The All-in-Wonder(R) X1900 features a brand-new graphics processor and proudly follows closely behind its Radeon counterpart. The X1900 is a one-card solution of great performance for extreme gamers, entertainment enthusiasts, home users and moviemakers alike. ATI's Avivo™ display platform gives incredibly rich video quality from capture through to playback, while PCI Express punches through the AGP bandwidth ceiling. The built-in TV tuner, PVR and programming guide provides now or later program enjoyment, while hardware H.264 decoding gives effortless playback of next-generation HD DVD.

It plays all the current games (except stupid crysis haha) with max settings, 1920 x 1080 except for AA, so I hope it's just some setting I can change for proper decoding of the AVC codec. I use my PC for gaming and it serves me well so theoretically it should be able to handle the HD videos.

I guess if it is some problem with HW acceleration even though the ATI website says my card decodes H264, my blu-ray watching is gonna be a problem.

I have 8.2 catalyst now, I think new ones are out I'll try updating those over the weekend.

I was hoping not to upgrade my PC until the end of this year, which is when I plan on buying a new PC - mostly for newer games that will come out.

[Obiit]

Originally Posted by flood658

I thought the ATI AIW x1900 was able to decode H264 (same as AVC, right?).

Yep that's right BUT some cards are better than others at certain codecs. The 2400 can do H264 fine but not MPEG2 (even though ATI says it can do both).

Looks like the 1900 isn't so hot on H264

The drivers are now at 8.4 so give it a go. To be honest i don't think you will get much improvement as if you look at it your 2 generations of card behind. I'm one and i only bought mine 3 months ago!!

[srjj1]

Firstly a Pentium D 2.8GHz has no where enough power to play a MPEG 4 AVC film with a Direct X9 card (or 8800 or 2900 series cards), as a PD 2.8GHz isn't every good. My Pentium D 3.73GHz had a bit of sluttering when playing a MPEG 4 AVC film and I changed my graphics card to an ATi Radeon HD2400XT, now it works sweet!!! I also got a profit by selling my Radeon X1650, which was useless since I don't play games!!!!!! The Radeon HD2400XT is very good, but go for the XT, as the pro has a low memory bandwith giving problems with 1080i. Watch the CPU usage drop to less 30% (might be higher for you). But..... MPEG 4 AVC is not the problem anymore (thanks to Direct X10 cards with dedicated decoders), the problem is Dolby True HD, it really kills your PC. On my PC with Pentium D 3.73GHz and dedicated hardware decoding (ATi Radeon HD2400XT), the CPU hits 70% when playing True HD films (averages 60%). Since your CPU is slower when playing True HD films you might get minimal sluttering and 90% CPU, so you must get the best hardware decoder out their so go for a really good card, as True HD is really hard to decode on Blu-ray (??not hard on HD DVD though??????). X Men 3 is a easy film to decode, try films like Resident Evil:Extinction with high bitrate MPEG 4 AVC, and Dolby True HD with PiP turned on, and it will have your CPU working hard out. So go for the best card out their, and overlock your CPU to at least 3.2GHz, as your current setup won't work, you need a better graphics card.


Here are the hardest Blu-ray Discs I have played (to decode):

Close Encounters of the Third Kind with Dolby True HD- 60-70%
with DTS HD MA - 30-40%
Resident Evil: Extinction with Dolby True HD- 55-75%


The ATi cards seem to be better for H.264. The reason you find AVC harder than other films, is because AVC is very hard to decode, by CPU alone can decode high bit rate VC-1 (hitting high 30's), but AVC isn't like that it is hard to decode, but by far the best in quality. Why is AVC in HD DVD easier to decode?? HD DVD can only hit a max video bitrate for around 28.99MBps while Blu-ray hits up to 40MBps, which takes a lot out of your CPU. Worst of all TrueHD is even a bigger pain to decode!!!!!!

By the way PowerDVD Ultra has profile 2.0 support now, download it at Cyberlink's website!!!!!

Also the ATi X1K cards aren't that good, reading review not even a Core 2 Duo at 2.13GHz could decode X Men 3 without hitting 99%, so surely a Pentium D 2.8GHz can't do it. However if you are a gamer don't go for 8800 or ATi HD2900 seires as they do not have dedicated Hardware decoding, not sure about wheither the HD 3850 has it, it should have it though. Sell your X1900 card, and buy a cheap HD2400XT/3450, and get a profit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Intel(R) Pentium(R) D 945 @3.73GHz
2048MB DDR2 RAM
ATi Radeon HD2400XT
ASUS BC 1250PT Blu-ray Reader SATA
XBOX 360 HD DVD Drive (external)
PowerDVD Ultra 7.3

AOC 203Vw+ monitor @ HD playback at 720p
DVI connection with HDCP

Stereo analoge speakers (I don't care about audio).

[glogrono]

Originally Posted by srjj1

Firstly a Pentium D 2.8GHz has no where enough power to play a MPEG 4 AVC film with a Direct X9 card (or 8800 or 2900 series cards), as a PD 2.8GHz isn't every good.)

THis is not true. My HTPC is a P4 2.8ghz (Single core), 1gb ram, ATI HD-3450, Vista Ultimate. I run vista in Windows Classic mode cause Aero takes too much ram (although I CAN run Aero with no problem). My computer is super stable and will play any blu ray I've thrown at it in 1080p with out ever stuttering and with amazing picture. The CPU hovers at around 35-40% and ram at about the same, while playing blu rays full screen at 1080p. Playing blu rays doesn't have to do too much with the CPU as long as you have a video card that handles 100% of the decoding.

[Obiit]

Here we go again

Love to have a sticky right at the top of this forum:-

"A high powered CPU is not required for blu-ray playback as long as the graphics card GPU accelerates high definition video codecs correctly." Followed by a how to guide for turning it on in the software players and a list of suitable cards.

Sorry bad day at work and vista deployment suxs as ever

[prerich]

Originally Posted by Obiit

Here we go again

Love to have a sticky right at the top of this forum:-

"A high powered CPU is not required for blu-ray playback as long as the graphics card GPU accelerates high definition video codecs correctly." Followed by a how to guide for turning it on in the software players and a list of suitable cards.

Sorry bad day at work and vista deployment suxs as ever

Sorry to hijack but your job is deploying Vista?!!!!

[JeremyPiven]

Originally Posted by prerich

Sorry to hijack but your job is deploying Vista?!!!!

Lol. Pretty much the equivalent of someone saying their job is to spread herpes.

[Obiit]

Yep or trying too Some bright spark of a college governor thought it would be a good idea........ nuff said

Nice one about Herpes LOL