3DS/Vita/Switch PSA: Plug in Your Cartridges

[Nunab18]

https://www.timeextension.com/news/2...void-data-loss

In a post on social media by Does it Play?, it is pointed out that Switch actually uses XtraROM, which is described as "a fancy term for factory-programmed MLC NAND flash."

The screenshotted report goes on to explain that the Switch is designed to "refresh" the data on the game card periodically to ensure that it remains readable and in good order. So even though these games aren't "written to" when you save your in-game data, some low-level re-writing takes place nonetheless.

It therefore stands to reason that, if you don't plug a game into your console for a while, the data may become unreadable. The post speculates that between five and ten years is a good benchmark for this, which presents the obvious problem: if you have sealed games you're hoping will increase in value over time, these could potentially become unplayable at some point.

This has been making the rounds lately, just wanted to pass it on!

[emailking]

So DS cartridges are ok?

Vita and 3DS are 14 years old, wouldn't we have heard of this happening in the wild by now?

[dyne]

Originally Posted by emailking

So DS cartridges are ok?

Vita and 3DS are 14 years old, wouldn't we have heard of this happening in the wild by now?

I think it’s a lot like the Wii U NAND issue reported last year where it was initially stated doom and gloom that all Wii U’s would be inoperable if not powered on. And yet here we are now and you hardly hear about it. Like most things it’s possible and maybe even likely but the actual amount that will see issue will be pretty small.

[Nunab18]

Originally Posted by emailking

So DS cartridges are ok?

Vita and 3DS are 14 years old, wouldn't we have heard of this happening in the wild by now?

There are reports of it occurring now, from my understanding. The amount of time for a cartridge to become corrupted is apparently significant, which is why we are only now starting to see issues. The recommendation that I've seen is just to plug in your carts every few years to refresh them.

This will likely also be an issue in the future for this current generation of consoles with NVME. From my understanding NVME tend to start losing data between 1-5 years with no power.

Edit: to answer your question better, DS cartridges are not effected the same way as 3DS/Vita/Switch from the articles I've read.

[bhampton]

All my Vita games and DS games that I have on carts I also now have from the online shops and I can back them up.

This is interesting info though .... I don't believe it but it's interesting. If any of my carts get this alleged cart rot I will report back.

[navydavey]

I'm not entirely convinced by these sorts of reports.

Could this be a problem, of course. I have a substantial VITA collection, a few of which are sealed until I get to them, but these sorts of reports come with each form of physical media.

I have CDs dating back over 40 years which still work perfectly fine, DVDs in excess of 20 years and even the original batteries in my Pokemon Blue and Metal Gear Solid gameboy games still work perfectly since launch.

All physical media formats have similar doom and gloom reports, not to say that the concerns aren't legitimate, but I'll only worry when I put in a VITA game and it doesn't work.

I'm more concerned about the VITA system itself not working than the cartridges.

[CWCprime]

I'm not sure I believe this either, but if it is true it just goes to further undermine the myth and cult surrounding physical games. Who can say what will happen first, my cartridge dying or the game being delisted/inaccessible? At this point for me, it's a matter of convenience which digital has in spades over physical.

[Nunab18]

Originally Posted by CWCprime

I'm not sure I believe this either, but if it is true it just goes to further undermine the myth and cult surrounding physical games. Who can say what will happen first, my cartridge dying or the game being delisted/inaccessible? At this point for me, it's a matter of convenience which digital has in spades over physical.

Yep, who knows how widespread this problem could possibly be, I just wanted to put it out there for folks here to be aware of. As a physical media first guy, your argument is valid from a point of view, for sure. If your house burns down, you'll lose all your physical media, but not your digital stuff. However, with physical media, provided you take care of it and there are no manufacturing defects... most of it should probably last your lifetime or close to it.

Should these reports be true, you'd be responsible for taking an extra maintenance step, but its something you can do yourself to maintain your library, whereas you have zero control of your digital library ultimately... unless you're emulating

[emailking]

Do you just need to plug it in with the power turned on, or do you need to boot up the game? Makes a big difference in terms of how long I have to spend on this task.

What about GBC or GBA cartidges, do we know if those are affected?

[Akibiyori]

Originally Posted by emailking

What about GBC or GBA cartidges, do we know if those are affected?

I believe those are safe like other old-style cartridges, it’s only these later types of media that have the issue.

Can’t say if you need to boot the games up for sure but since a system like the Switch detects them on insertion it seems like it would get some power in the process.

[Nunab18]

Originally Posted by emailking

Do you just need to plug it in with the power turned on, or do you need to boot up the game? Makes a big difference in terms of how long I have to spend on this task.

What about GBC or GBA cartidges, do we know if those are affected?

I've been told that you need to boot. Also, talking to some folks with more knowledge than myself, it appears 3DS is definitely the one to be on top of out of the ones I brought up previously (3DS/Vita/Switch).

[ChadFL]

Sounds more like a very rare to never potential issue being pushed around with clickbaity articles. I recall the same stuff being said about virtually every disc or cartridge based console games of the past. And yet, I can't recall ever having any issues, nor do I know anyone who has, despite having and playing countless games a few decades old. They'll take the most unlikely events and make it sound everyone's stuff won't work.

[jimidini]

Originally Posted by navydavey

I'm not entirely convinced by these sorts of reports.

Could this be a problem, of course. I have a substantial VITA collection, a few of which are sealed until I get to them, but these sorts of reports come with each form of physical media.

I have CDs dating back over 40 years which still work perfectly fine, DVDs in excess of 20 years and even the original batteries in my Pokemon Blue and Metal Gear Solid gameboy games still work perfectly since launch.

Agreed, so do I.
The Wii U "issue" for example comes from a pirate-site. I don't trust these. Highly likely that the Wii U was hacked and that can mean that the user simply bricked his own console.

Mine were off and disconnected for over a year, still working just fine.

There are also people saying there would be "disc rot" for disc media, but that's entirely bullshit. Some Laserdiscs actually went bad, but not because the "discs rotted" or some other BS. It was because a specific bad glue was used.

What goes bad is burned CDs and burned DVDs (problem for the funny thieves), but these have literally nothing to do with commercially PRESSED CDs or PRESSED DVDs. They call it optical media for a reason. The data is literally punched into the plastic. It's like saying stones with drawings chiseled into them could go bad. No, they can't.

But of course you should store them properly.

If you store them at high humidity, they will go bad. Everything will go bad that way. Cover prints will also go bad when the sun shines on them every day for years.

[emailking]

Originally Posted by Nunab18

I've been told that you need to boot. Also, talking to some folks with more knowledge than myself, it appears 3DS is definitely the one to be on top of out of the ones I brought up previously (3DS/Vita/Switch).

What about just DS?

[emailking]

Originally Posted by jimidini

There are also people saying there would be "disc rot" for disc media, but that's entirely bullshit. Some Laserdiscs actually went bad, but not because the "discs rotted" or some other BS. It was because a specific bad glue was used.

What goes bad is burned CDs and burned DVDs (problem for the funny thieves), but these have literally nothing to do with commercially PRESSED CDs or PRESSED DVDs. They call it optical media for a reason. The data is literally punched into the plastic. It's like saying stones with drawings chiseled into them could go bad. No, they can't.

Yeah this is off. Pressed DVDs and blu-rays can go bad. I have one, John Tucker Must Die. Most of those blu-rays have some issue playing. Just look at the thread on that. There's tons of other reports of disc rot happening with pressed discs on this site. There's a whole thread on it where you can report your discs not playing anymore, lol.

[Nunab18]

Originally Posted by emailking

What about just DS?

From my understanding, DS is OK, it uses a different type of memory.

[jimidini]

Originally Posted by emailking

Yeah this is off. Pressed DVDs and blu-rays can go bad. I have one, John Tucker Must Die. Most of those blu-rays have some issue playing. Just look at the thread on that. There's tons of other reports of disc rot happening with pressed discs on this site. There's a whole thread on it where you can report your discs not playing anymore, lol.

There are trillions of DVDs and Blu-.rays.
If only 1 fails for you, that sounds like a one off manufacturing issue. May be the glue for dual layer just like with Laserdiscs.
if many fail, then maybe someone isn't storing them properly.

Bad:
- direct sunlight
- too cold
- too hot
- humidity
- not even inside their case

If they all failed just like that for no reason, you would have more than one thread on this site and 50% of everyone's collection would be unplayable. Used sales of DVDs + Blu-rays would get rated "not working" etc. But that's clearly not the case.

Also think about it. DVDs + Blu-rays are also used for video games.
If I remember correctly last year thousands of sealed copies of the PS2 hidden gem "Rule of Rose" were found in Italy, stored in some warehouse, and then finally sold, which brought the price down quite a bit. IF DVDs just failed like that, all of these copies would have been dead, but that's not the case. The whole used video game market would be gone, but that's also not the case.

And some people really treat their games + movies like crap. I'm always wondering how people manage to get scratches into blu-rays when I bought another used scratched up blu-ray. That's why I'm almost never buying used blu-rays.

[emailking]

You said pressed discs couldn't go bad, emphasized it. Now you're saying they can. Lots of early Lionsgate blu-rays have this issue. My John Tucker is stored the same way the other few around it are and it's the only one with an issue I've found. That one's failing for a lot of other people too.

[jimidini]

Originally Posted by emailking

You said pressed discs couldn't go bad, emphasized it. Now you're saying they can.

The original claim was that they would "just go bad".

When you put LPs on top of your fully powered on oil heating for months or years, they will also "go bad" and that's not surprising. It's obvious. But that's not LPs going bad by themselves. You would have caused that by improper storage.

Claiming that these two would be the same is disingenuous.

You can also take my post and say "well you claimed that stones don't go bad, but when I use this jackhammer on the stones, they do.", which would be correct, but would ignore the point. I can use sand paper on DVDs and destroy them that way. I can also use a scissor and cut them into pieces. Doesn't mean that DVDs just split into pieces by themselves.

Lots of early Lionsgate blu-rays have this issue. My John Tucker is stored the same way the other few around it are and it's the only one with an issue I've found.

That also points towards it being a batch issue. Batch issues happen. Also see laserdiscs. If all DVDs or Blurays would "just go bad", your whole collection would be toast. You admit yourself that this is not the case.

w/ laserdiscs there are as far as I know 2 manufacturing issues.
One is bad glue used when glueing the 2 disc sides together. Second is air bubbles being left inside the disc itself.

[emailking]

Originally Posted by jimidini

Claiming that these two would be the same is disingenuous.

Man I didn't do that. You brought up storage conditions. Regardless, I am saying a properly stored pressed blu-ray can have disc rot. It happens. It happened to me.