4K Movies Releases

[Steedeel]

No? Why?

[vargo]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

No? Why?

Im sure they have lofty ambitions but ultimately what Red do is irrelevant in the consumer market. They're not going to put players and content into millions of homes.

[Steedeel]

Right. So they are more on the technical side? I have heard of the red cameras and seen a lot of transfers on bluray that originated from them. I must of got my wires crossed. Thanks for your reply.

[vargo]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Right. So they are more on the technical side? I have heard of the red cameras and seen a lot of transfers on bluray that originated from them. I must of got my wires crossed. Thanks for your reply.

These things will be sold to small theatres, production companies, obviously lots of people who are shooting 4k and want to be able to screen it.

You're not going to have one under your TV unless you are one of these people. Even if they have ambitions to enter the consumer market...., its not going to happen. In 10 years time if you've got a 4k player under your TV it'll be using HEVC.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by vargo

These things will be sold to small theatres, production companies, obviously lots of people who are shooting 4k and want to be able to screen it...

Varg,
We’ll have to wait and see as those Red marketing boys are a crazy lot but, “the 4k Content Distribution Network” implies to me at least the potential for -

a company being able to send a commercial 4K movie over the internet and have it be played back in your home (by a REDRAY device) in 2013 and *presumably* look very good…which, no denying, proprietary codec or not, is a significant technological advancement at this point in time.

Especially given all the naysayers (pick your website) complaining that 4K tvs are great and all but there’s no good native 4K content available….along with those numerous negative prognostications that there won’t be any native 4K content available/viewable in your home for a long, long time.

[ZoetMB]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

This is what I like.

Given today’s bombshell 4K news…
http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthr...=1#post1091349

Jarred says you’ll hear more about REDRAY on November 30.
And what’s the significance of November 30th...an unassuming lad might ask?

Well , it be 2 days after Sony’s planned official event fully introducing the F5 and F55 cameras.

I love the strategy of these marketing guys in the 4K biz.

Anything RED does is extraordinarily expensive and usually announced years before they can actually ship. Maybe it's different this time because they're saying, "Expect the official REDRAY and 4k Content Distribution network announcement along with pre-orders to happen in a couple weeks," although that's still only a preorder and an announcement.

[vargo]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Varg,
We’ll have to wait and see as those Red marketing boys are a crazy lot but, “the 4k Content Distribution Network” implies to me at least the potential for -

a company being able to send a commercial 4K movie over the internet and have it be played back in your home (by a REDRAY device) in 2013 and *presumably* look very good…which, no denying, proprietary codec or not, is a significant technological advancement at this point in time.

Especially given all the naysayers (pick your website) complaining that 4K tvs are great and all but there’s no good native 4K content available….along with those numerous negative prognostications that there won’t be any native 4K content available/viewable in your home for a long, long time.

Like I said, they can put thousands of units into the hands of filmmakers etc. Thats fine, more power to them. And they can have a partnership with an 'innovative' player in the streaming business.... innovative is another way of saying not a big player.

The mainstream is not defined by thousands of units. Mainstream is millions of units, Hollywood content, $200 hardware etc.

The question was whether this was going to be another format war and the answer is no.

Don't even get me started on their codec...

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by vargo

Like I said, they can put thousands of units into the hands of filmmakers etc. Thats fine, more power to them. And they can have a partnership with an 'innovative' player in the streaming business.... innovative is another way of saying not a big player.

The mainstream is not defined by thousands of units. Mainstream is millions of units, Hollywood content, $200 hardware etc.

The question was whether this was going to be another format war and the answer is no...

I know that . I thought it apparent I’d moved past the ‘format war’ trepidation (on the last page, in fact) and was trying to show the ‘good’ (as it relates to viewing 4K) in the recent news/announcement.

Obviously, this is not a viable threat to dominate or even compete for ‘the consumer mainstream’ in regards to 4K viewing. But, onto yet another 4K related matter, it should be interesting to see if the upcoming RED 4K laser projector can compete (or perhaps dominate?) the consumer front projector demographic…at least in the mid/high end range.

Disclaimer: Varg, I also realize that front projector owners don’t constitute the ‘mainstream’ home theater folks in total numbers but, I think it holds some importance to those who have an interest in front projector set-ups for their home theater.

Gotta go vote now....one of the GREATEST rights of our democracy.
Luckily, I don’t live in a state challenged by voter suppression tactics.

[Flatnate]

You know, I know I have read on the RED forum that there will be a pro oriented model and a consumer/prosumer oriented model. Now I can't find that page over there that I saw all of this. If anyone has any links or details on the difference between the two units let us know!

[Dubstar]

I honestly don't understand how the market and specifically Sony can keep the 4K interest at pace when they can't even keep their own website up to date. They deleted 'Argo' 'Skyfall' 'The Dark Knight Rises' - wtf?? Even 'Samsara' and I think 'The Master' had 4K DCP's created - but largely the majority of DCP releases from the studios are predominently 2K only.

[Livelong420]

I wish Red would put a ONE in this film makers hands.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Flatnate

You know, I know I have read on the RED forum that there will be a pro oriented model and a consumer/prosumer oriented model. Now I can't find that page over there that I saw all of this. If anyone has any links or details on the difference between the two units let us know!

Well, I’d like to help you out but that link I posted to the REDRAY news was actually passed onto me from a friend.

I used to follow their forum somewhat regularly when they launched the Red One, not since then though. But that’s not saying much as the only forum of the home/professional video genre I’ve read for the past months since my surgeries has been Blu-ray.com. Perhaps someone else has the links you desire. In the meantime, I'll email my bud to ask him if he knows the thread(s) you're referring to.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Dubstar

I honestly don't understand how the market and specifically Sony can keep the 4K interest at pace when they can't even keep their own website up to date. They deleted 'Argo' 'Skyfall' 'The Dark Knight Rises' - wtf?? Even 'Samsara' and I think 'The Master' had 4K DCP's created - but largely the majority of DCP releases from the studios are predominently 2K only.

Staffers.

In the past, I’ve had to give a shout-out myself as to incorrect master format (4K or 2K) information they’ve submitted to IMBD -
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...te#post3914079
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...te#post3918829

You see, The Karate Kid (2010) ^ was originally listed on IMBD as a Digital Intermediate (2K) (master format)…which was wrong, and bad enough, but it was even worse given the fact that not only did it go through a 4K DI but, it was the first film to go through the digital intermediate process at Colorworks, entirely in 4K.

Dub, don’t be surprised if this type of thing happens more often given the lay-offs…since I hear things are pretty tight , especially when you’re so hurting for cash that you’re compelled to put up your N.Y.C. Headquarters (‘The Tower’ on Madison Ave.) for sale….http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Building_(New_York))

P.S.
I notice in the second link listed above, I said “the post I made on the last page”, when in fact, now, the post is on the same page. That may appear confusing to first time readers. In retrospect, the discrepancy arises because there were some interim vitriolic posts bashing an outside forum or member of an outside forum and one of the mods decided to delete them because I think we’re better than that.

[Dubstar]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Staffers.

In the past, I’ve had to give a shout-out myself as to incorrect master format (4K or 2K) information they’ve submitted to IMBD -
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...te#post3914079
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...te#post3918829

You see, The Karate Kid (2010) ^ was originally listed on IMBD as a Digital Intermediate (2K) (master format)…which was wrong, and bad enough, but it was even worse given the fact that not only did it go through a 4K DI but, it was the first film to go through the digital intermediate process at Colorworks, entirely in 4K.

Dub, don’t be surprised if this type of thing happens more often given the lay-offs…since I hear things are pretty tight , especially when you’re so hurting for cash that you’re compelled to put up your N.Y.C. Headquarters (‘The Tower’ on Madison Ave.) for sale….http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_Building_(New_York))

P.S.
I notice in the second link listed above, I said “the post I made on the last page”, when in fact, now, the post is on the same page. That may appear confusing to first time readers. In retrospect, the discrepancy arises because there were some interim vitriolic posts bashing an outside forum or member of an outside forum and one of the mods decided to delete them because I think we’re better than that.

ouch... I've been to the store in the building.

I've learned that info from imdb is never 100% accurate.

[Tok]

This whole notion that 4K is needed in the home environment is spin from the CE makers wanting to enthusiasts to upgrade yet again.

This is out of the same playbook when HD sets were starting to take off yet we didn't have much native content to view yet. Upconversion makes it 'HD-like'... No it doesn't. Garbage in... Garbage out.

4K is going to have to live on upconversion for a longer term. And even we did have a native 4K source look at how long it took BD to finally establish itself... 5 to 6 years. 4K content is NOT 'just around the corner' thats the hype that CE makers are pushing to justify huge 'premiums' on sets that in the end are just going to be doing the old line doubling algorithms.

4K for the home is hype... nothing more. Those of us that run 100-in+ setups are still and will always be a very small minority of enthusiasts.

4K+ is needed for the commercial theater environment... (1920x1080)/2K is more than adequate for the home environment.

[Dubstar]

Originally Posted by CraigW

This whole notion that 4K is needed in the home environment is spin from the CE makers wanting to enthusiasts to upgrade yet again.

This is out of the same playbook when HD sets were starting to take off yet we didn't have much native content to view yet. Upconversion makes it 'HD-like'... No it doesn't. Garbage in... Garbage out.

4K is going to have to live on upconversion for a longer term. And even we did have a native 4K source look at how long it took BD to finally establish itself... 5 to 6 years. 4K content is NOT 'just around the corner' thats the hype that CE makers are pushing to justify huge 'premiums' on sets that in the end are just going to be doing the old line doubling algorithms.

4K for the home is hype... nothing more. Those of us that run 100-in+ setups are still and will always be a very small minority of enthusiasts.

4K+ is needed for the commercial theater environment... (1920x1080)/2K is more than adequate for the home environment.

I agree with you there, but the industry on both the studio side AND the exhibitor side have been slow as molasses in releasing DCP's at 4K.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Dubstar

ouch... I've been to the store in the building.
I've learned that info from imdb is never 100% accurate.

I figure you know but, just to provide semantic clarity to other readers….

Perhaps in other instances, but you can’t place the blame on imdb for this > (The Karate Kid (2010) one. In their defense, with regards to things like detailed Tech specs, I think they often just publish what they are given from the respective source. They figure that’s *official* ,ergo…accurate , because it’s coming from the horse’s mouth so to speak.

Another example of a comparatively little-known-about film which was not the fault of imdb, i.e. originally they didn’t include “Super 35 (source format) (some shots)” in the specs….
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...un#post4925884
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ne#post5969801

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Dubstar

I agree with you there, but the industry on both the studio side AND the exhibitor side have been slow as molasses in releasing DCP's at 4K.

I haven’t been tracking recently, but in the past, not including restorations, the data indicates one 4K DCP (feature film) per month.

I would venture a guess that it is at least that much, if not more, currently.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Flatnate

You know, I know I have read on the RED forum that there will be a pro oriented model and a consumer/prosumer oriented model. Now I can't find that page over there that I saw all of this. If anyone has any links or details on the difference between the two units let us know!

This morning I was emailed this (which I haven’t read, but he tells me that Spears (Stacey) has posted on page 9) -

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthr...-REDray-Player

I’m not sure if that ^ is what you desire and I can’t vouch as to its ultimate accuracy in regards to the baked end product(s) but, I was assured that the RED product-related posts made by the Red Team, i.e. Jarred Land, Stuart English and Jim (Jannard) were true and accurate, at least at the time of publication…and, for all I know , may also be accurate at this point in time but, of course, best to wait for final details on Nov. 30th, especially if you’re a potential buyer.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by vargo

...Don't even get me started on their codec...

REDcode RGB…REDcode RGB…REDcode RGB…REDcode RGB

I assume? what you’re implying is that their codec will work well with a low noise digital source (i.e. Red Epic acquisition) but will be quite challenged by a noisey/grainy source like with some older films or low-end digital cameras used for principal photography.

And therefore that L00M
http://vimeo.com/48532874 )

was cherry-picked for the demo at the last NAB ???
http://vimeo.com/42950606