HDR Discussion Thread

[gkolb]

Originally Posted by TheSweetieMan

Yeah, Samsung is a mess right now with their flasgship panels. Genuinely surprised they won't commit to OLED at all. But that's probably another discussion entirely.

Thanks again for the insight. I should've figured the contrast levels help LG with the color volume of their OLEDs. Corresponds to Teoh's comments about how even in sdr content, it provides suitable dynamic range.

Personally, this is all the more reason why Dolby Vision should've been the HDR mandate. Every title is graded at 4,000-nits anyway. It provides smoother color gradation; so for higher-end LCD panels, like your Z9 for instance, you may not need the dynamic metadata as much, but the addition of 12-bit color to compliment the smooth color that Sony already produces, would be nice. And then for consumers with panels that struggle to hit 1,000-nits, you get the dynamic metadata to at least translate the images across the screen, from start to finish, the way it was at least meant to be viewed when graded.

SweetieMan,

You keep referring to 4000 nits like that's the brightest pixel in the movie, when 4000 is just the max of the container. There's nothing that says a movie in a 4000 nit container will ever hit 2000 nit highlight, much less higher. Someone analyzed Goodfellas and said it's brightest highlight hit 237 nits (or so).

Or am I wrong? Cause I've seen this discussion a number of times here in the HDR thread.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by TheSweetieMan

And if the main benefit of that is for animated film, fair enough. I'm not going to deny the fact that there isn't an audience for those films within this format, because there is.

But, being more partial to not only live action films, but films that use a more realistic color palette, I guess I'm not overly concerned with it after all.

Given the inherent colorful nature of animated films in general, they can benefit the most, but although not to the same constant high degree, non-animated content can also gain some noticeable benefit if the filmmaker so chooses. In the BT. 2100 color volume container note the spreading coverage during real life footage of the classic cars as graded on a Dolby Pulsar (4,000 nits peak luminance).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt_ZEIgQC-0#t=7m58s

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by TheSweetieMan

Because based on more info I gather and research through actual filmmakers, colorists, and cinematographers, they don't seem to be as gung-ho about peak brightness, and HDR altogether, as you think Samsung tells you they are.

Samsung aside, those in the know are -
http://shanemario.com/archives/406

P.S.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/shanemarioruggieri/

[TheSweetieMan]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Given the inherent colorful nature of animated films in general, they can benefit the most, but although not to the same constant high degree, non-animated content can also gain some noticeable benefit if the filmmaker so chooses. In the BT. 2100 color volume container note the spreading coverage during real life footage of the classic cars as graded on a Dolby Pulsar (4,000 nits peak luminance).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mt_ZEIgQC-0#t=7m58s

That makes a lot of sense. The director of 'Coco' actually just came out tonight, on Twitter, and said the film is meant to be seen in Dolby. Hopefully it does well enough, to where he can use his pull, to get Dolby Vision included on its home release.

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Samsung aside, those in the know are -
http://shanemario.com/archives/406

P.S.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/shanemarioruggieri/

That article is extremely insightful, and helpful. Thank you.

One thing you'll learn quick about me, is that I'm not afraid to have my mind/opinions changed, based on useful information and feedback. My ego isn't swollen enough--nor do I feel I possess enough knowledge on these subjects--to act like I know enough to have a definitive outlook on this format.

Cheers.

[puddy77]

Press release from a market analysis firm about expecting strong growth for HDR in the display market.

HDR TV Shipments Will Grow to 47.9 Million in 2021, IHS Markit Says

High dynamic range (HDR) is the strongest-developing feature in television sets, according to a new report from IHS Markit (Nasdaq: INFO), a world leader in critical information, analytics and solutions.

In its TV Design and Features Tracker - Q3 2017, IHS Markit forecasts that HDR TV shipments will grow from 12.2 million in 2017 to 47.9 million in 2021, with a further 88.6 million HDR-ready sets — with HDR decoding but no HDR display capability — shipping in 2021.

“HDR is the biggest improvement coming to TV viewing,” said Paul Gray, associate director for consumer devices at IHS Markit. “It has been conclusively demonstrated to have the biggest impact with viewers, and what’s more, the effect works regardless of screen size or resolution.”

[Penton-Man]

For those of you with supportive TVs and thinking about purchasing a new HDR capable cam (the FDR-AX700, HXR-NX80 and PXW-Z90) to treat themselves for the Holiday season, or perhaps putting it on their wish list that goes to their better half (to give ideas about what you’d like for Christmas), but were reluctant because you thought there was a steep learning curve or you needed a colorist to then make decent looking HDR images out of the in-camera footage….not to worry, it’s not that difficult to get your toe in the game, a how to in 4 min. –

Sony Z150 & FS5 Instant HDR Workflow - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

a new HDR capable cam

Would have significantly helped the picture quality of the action in the shadows with this footage….

Can U Kick it - 4 to 5 years old coaching course - YouTube

[dvsbreaker]

Anyone notice any difference with 4k streaming vs the actual 4k disc?

[ray0414]

Originally Posted by dvsbreaker

Anyone notice any difference with 4k streaming vs the actual 4k disc?

Of course. If you compare the same show/movie, the higher bit rate of the disc usually gets you cleaner blacks. As well as a slightly sharper image which can help texture and pop and improved dimension of objects in the TV. Though most people find native 4k through streaming to be "good enough".

[RockyIII]

Originally Posted by dvsbreaker

Anyone notice any difference with 4k streaming vs the actual 4k disc?

Definetely yes

[Penton-Man]

To PaulGo – I’m feeling esp. good today for my friends (as well as I presume you are, with yours) who are residents of the suburbs of Northern Virginia and Albemarle County (University of Virginia, Charlottesville)

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

HDR capable

Educating the next generation of filmmakers….
“Following breakfast, the day begins with instruction on Lighting & Camera with ASC instructors, and ends with an ARRI presentation on HDR”

https://theasc.com/news/asc-internat...o-paulo-brazil

[Penton-Man]

Yehya gives Thor: Ragnarok two thumbs up

Talkin' About the Movie with Yehya – Thor: Ragnarok - YouTube

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by HeatEquation

track record speaks for itself.

starting from way back to 2008 - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...de#post1432708 (I even remember her name )

and bringing the heads-up ^ to fruition in 2011 - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...ls#post4453123

[HeatEquation]

Originally Posted by the_sextein

RP over at AVS has his review up if anyone is interested.
http://www.avsforum.com/westworld-se...tra-hd-review/

Another case of the HDR10 and DV being 100% identical. Although for those who experience elevated blacks in DV, I'm sure the HDR10 will be the superior version.

[Staying Salty]

Originally Posted by HeatEquation

Another case of the HDR10 and DV being 100% identical. Although for those who experience elevated blacks in DV, I'm sure the HDR10 will be the superior version.

If pushed to make a decision on which presentation I preferred I would give the nod to DV.

[TheSweetieMan]

>Ralph Potts' own words: "I don't have a TV optimized for viewing Dolby Vision."

HeatEquation still says the HDR10 and DV grade are identical.

>Any user that owns an OLED and provides their thoughts on HDR10/DV

HeatEquation says it doesn't count, because OLEDs don't have the peak brightness to accurately display HDR10 content.

You're a borderline troll, dude. You honestly should be banned. Especially since a moderator already told you to stop comparing these formats in threads like this one, and to take it to this thread: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=276605

[HeatEquation]

Confirmed by both Samsung and Microsoft Xbox support, full support for HDR10+ on the Xbox One X is currently in the works.



Not surprising, since Xbox partnered with Samsung recently.

DV continues to get absolutely smashed.

[the_sextein]

Originally Posted by HeatEquation

Another case of the HDR10 and DV being 100% identical. Although for those who experience elevated blacks in DV, I'm sure the HDR10 will be the superior version.

Yeah I noticed that as well. I only own two movies that have DV and both of them look identical regardless of weather you use HDR10 or DV. Personally, I am still waiting on Sony to update my firmware so it doesn't matter to me either way at the moment. I thought this might be the first title that made me really want it but it's not. I think Sony is waiting to see how Samsung's HDR+ works out and how the public thinks of it before jumping in bed with Dolby since DV costs money and HDR+ does not. I have a feeling that HDR+ is going to look very similar to DV and cost the publishers nothing.

Anyway, back on the topic of Westworld... I think the HDR10 looks very nice. Colors are bold and brights are very strong. The shine of a flashlight, the wide shots with the sun in all of it's glory. Fleshtones look natural and outfits really pop. I think an 88 is pretty good for a TV show. Some super high end stand alone movies look better but this is the best looking and sounding TV series I own. I do think Deadwood could give it a run for it's money if it were ever released on 4K with HDR.

[HeatEquation]

Originally Posted by the_sextein

Yeah I noticed that as well. I only own two movies that have DV and both of them look identical regardless of weather you use HDR10 or DV.

Agreed. This fact has been well established by virtually everyone. The exception being when DV gives you elevated blacks. Then HDR10 is the preferred version.