HDR Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by puddy77

Who is that?

That be she…always swimming ….https://twitter.com/flyingmonkey820

[Penton-Man]

I hope some of you folks took advantage of the heads-up (as attendance was free and open to all) I offered last June to this webcast…..https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post12380835

Truth be told, there are also some dynamically creative prolific inventors that work out of Samsung who know a thing or two about HDR metadata, like Li ……

[PaulGo]

Originally Posted by gt14199

Is buying a 4K player worth it if my 4K tv doesn't have HDR?

I would wait to buy a 4K player. Currently the 4K Blu-ray players are very expensive and if your set does not have HDR the difference in picture quality that you would see would be minimal. When you buy a 4K TV there may be enhancements in the HDR standard that you want the player to have. Also in a year or two as HDR player become more mainstream the prices for the player will be a lot less (and also for the 4K Blu-ray discs).

[Penton-Man]

Posting from last May (before publication of ITU-R BT. 2100)…..
https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...a#post12182673

I purposely said “pretty much” with regards to system gamma in order to spare folks the involved fractional math and....because there is a background and surround
lighting caveat with regards to HLG HDR viewing flexibility - see NOTE 5f on page 7 of the BT. 2100 document .

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by puddy77

...Any info from the event?

Nothing that you probably don’t already know except perhaps that in terms of devices for getting things done in this HDR age, Leader product was demoed at a table showing PQ, HLG and S-Log3 imagery side by side by side, sort of…..

and that there were hints from a VP at HBO that the next milestone tech (beyond that of Dolby Atmos currently) for Game of Thrones would probably be HDR.

[Penton-Man]

Gamer developer dudes and dudettes, (introductory level) Reminder

[puddy77]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

…and that there were hints from a VP at HBO that the next milestone tech (beyond that of Dolby Atmos currently) for Game of Thrones would probably be HDR.

HDR for Game of Thrones?! That is definitely something to look forward to. I'm assuming that would be for the eventual release on UBD, and not broadcast.

Thanks Penton!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

background and surround
lighting

Some videophiles not know the difference?....then study some of Fairchild’s old work.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by puddy77

...Thanks Penton!

Shucks, you make mees blush.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Some videophiles not know the difference?....then study some of Fairchild’s old work.

For the definitions of background and surround lighting (they differ)….there may still be an old pdf online from his tutorial at the IS&T/SID 12th Color Imaging Conference back in the day.

[SolidRaider]

Anyone know how to turn off HDR on the Sony Tvs? When I try to change it says feature currently unavailable.

[PaulGo]

Originally Posted by SolidRaider

Anyone know how to turn off HDR on the Sony Tvs? When I try to change it says feature currently unavailable.

On my Sony 850c the HDR function only comes on when playing HDR content. I can select it manually if the TV does not detect the HDR signal but I do not see any way of disabling auto-detect. (This applies to demo HDR content which is on a USB stick, I do not have a UHD Blu-ray player).

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I hope some of you folks took advantage of the heads-up (as attendance was free and open to all) I offered last June to this webcast…..https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post12380835

Truth be told, there are also some dynamically creative prolific inventors that work out of Samsung who know a thing or two about HDR metadata, like Li ……
https://www.linkedin.com/in/li-tao-95b6998

Per 1st paragraph above, Liaison thought for the day.
From last week’s webcast, last phrase of next to the last bullet point….

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by PaulGo

On my.....

Good to see you back Paul.
You (Potomac) remind me of beer, hard shelled crabs and golfing at Congressional Country Club.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Liaison thought for the day...

however (especially for those considering TVs having peak luminance specs markedly less than that of the currently most popular HDR mastering monitors)….be patient, as dynamic metadata is out of scope of Ultra HD Forum Phase A Revision 1.1 Guidelines…..http://ultrahdforum.org/resources/ph...s-description/

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I hope some of you folks took advantage of the heads-up (as attendance was free and open to all) I offered last June to this webcast…..https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post12380835....

Question (from a listener): What are practical examples of where dynamic metadata is beneficial?

Answer (from the speaker), slightly paraphrased for clarity:
“For example, I think there are a lot of HDR streaming material available now on the internet from several providers and the devices at home ranges somewhere from 1000 nits, even some peaks out at 1500 nits to 600 nits to 300 nits to….. of course, the currently predominately SDR TV at 100 nits or 200 nits also would be using the same piece of content. And there are presentations ( ex. Dolby Vision) actually utilize a mapping algorithm using these dynamic metadata in 2094 to transform the image, to optimize the image. So in the previous example if there is any detailed creature lurking in the background of the horror movie you will see them whether you are watching it on your SDR TV or if you have a 500 nit display or a 1000 nit display and you will observe the creative intent. Of course Dolby Vision is not the only dynamic metadata system; other 2094 systems can do the same thing.”

Aside - For the sake of equal promotion to other “systems” besides that of Dolby Vision used as an example in the above answer, just to inform readers of other vendors and the fact that they are not sitting on their hands doing nothing when there is a marked discrepancy in peak luminance between the monitors used for creating content in the mastering suite and some consumer TVs, this is a tiny snippet of the Samsung SEI message to be proposed for carriage of such futuristic metadata with peoples’ favorite HDR codec -

where….
targeted_system_display_maximum_luminance specifies the nominal maximum display luminance of the targeted system display, in units of 0.0001 candelas per square metre. The value of targeted_system_display_maximum_luminance shall be in the range of 0 to 10000, inclusive.

targeted_system_display_actual_peak_luminance_flag equal to 1 indicates that the normalized actual peak luminance of the targeted system display is present.

num_rows_targeted_system_display_actual_peak_lumin ance specifies the number of rows in the targeted_system_display_actual_peak_luminance array. The value of num_rows_targeted_system_display_actual_peak_lumin ance shall be in the range of 2 to 25, inclusive.

num_cols_targeted_system_display_actual_peak_lumin ance specifies the number of columns in the targeted_system_display_actual_peak_luminance array. The value of num_cols_targeted_system_display_actual_peak_lumin ance shall be in the range of 2 to 25, inclusive.

targeted_system_display_actual_peak_luminance[ i ][ j ] specifies the normalized actual peak luminance of the targeted system display. The value of targeted_system_display_actual_peak_luminance[ i ][ j ] shall be in the range of 0 to 1, inclusive and in multiples of 1/15.

[DanBa]

Are SMPTE 2094 -10 dynamic metadata proposed by Dolby exactly the same as Dolby Vision dynamic metadata, or just a subset?
Thanks!

[DanBa]

Apparently, VP9 Profile 2 supports HLG HDR.

We should have:
. HLG HDR in VP9 Profile 2 (and likely the upcoming AV1) aimed at streaming
http://www.streamingmedia.com/Articl...ts-111296.aspx
. HLG HDR in HEVC aimed at TV broadcast.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by DanBa

Are SMPTE 2094 -10 dynamic metadata proposed by Dolby exactly the same as Dolby Vision dynamic metadata, or just a subset?
Thanks!

Hi Dan, good question. Probably best left for an official response from the likes of Pat (Griffis). Meanwhile, I can tell you that for further investigation, if you’re so inclined, Part 10 (which is Application #1 from Dolby) has just been placed (literally, just a few days ago) in the SMPTE store, its publication being ahead of the other Applications (20, 30 and 40) in the approval process.

[Penton-Man]

Other than the value geared toward optimizing for the creative intent of the filmmaker, addressing another value of dynamic metadata on the production end and with commercial tools (Dolby) that have been available to studios for awhile now…..and not mentioned or realized in past articles like this -> http://www.redsharknews.com/technolo...n-dolby-vision nor, I doubt on any hobbyist websites/forums is that a good reason to use the Dolby Vision mastering process is also to save money on storage/archiving in the long term. Yeah, y’all read that right….I said save money.

For you see, that instead of Sony doing multiple graded versions (masters) of their movies at differing nits levels and archiving alllllllll those immmmmages from different versions for later distribution, on the other hand,

with the DV mastering process one needs only store a single 4000 nit HDR master (ex. Chappie) and multiple sets of dynamic metadata at differing nits levels to produce other lesser peak luminance masters if/when needed <- that later data size being MUCH smaller than that required for the storing of thousands of images from multiple luminance versions.