HDR Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

They have done a good job of keeping HDMI 2.1 under wraps and I don't know if it will be announced in 2 days or 2 months.

Perhaps the 4K content protection stripper or HDCP 2.2 ‘downgrader/converter’ leading to the subsequent lawsuit….
https://www.scribd.com/doc/294553836...Bl59aWBgg69Air and settlement has added a degree of complexity and delay to the whole process.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by BluLobsta

Watched Star Trek Beyond last night in 4K HDR but it seemed a bit dark to me.

Originally Posted by Stanton

I think the problem is with the movie (ST:B).
We have different TVs (both HDR capable)....

I’ll defer to others on this as I’m not familiar with the look of the Star Trek Beyond Ultra HD Blu-ray because I haven’t watched it yet on one, much less multiple TVs to make an informed assessment. I’d imagine PeterTHX is probably well versed with that title. One thing to consider is something I’ve alluded to before,,,

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

currently, probably the greatest handicap of the Ultra HD Blu-ray spec for colorists when mastering a movie is the lack of specification for a diffuse white luminance level thusly causing an inconsistent quality HDR 10 product...

^ in essence, which can lead to mastering content which ends up looking too dark (or, for that matter, too bright) to consumers at home.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Eh, it seems like most of these HDR thingies came with the promise of backwards compatibility but in reality it gets left behind as the complications of just getting the HDR part up and running are enough to contend with.

Oh backwards compatibility to 709 is possible (I think the BBC response/explanation to the ARRIS group and others wrt hue shifts and such proved that). No fault to HLG, it was a standards acceptance thing, hopefully acceptance of it will evolve in the future for the sake of those with seasoned TVs.

I’m back from our morning bike ride, sitting down now to watch Arsenal v. Tottenham match and I’m already seeing on the pregame show that half the field is sun bleached and the other half is in shadows.

HLG HDR can’t come soon enough for me.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I’ll defer to others on this as I’m not familiar with the look of the Star Trek Beyond Ultra HD Blu-ray because I haven’t watched it yet on one, much less multiple TVs to make an informed assessment. I’d imagine PeterTHX is probably well versed with that title. One thing to consider is something I’ve alluded to before,,,

^ in essence, which can lead to mastering content which ends up looking too dark (or, for that matter, too bright) to consumers at home.

I reckon that's something which hasn't bothered too many folks with properly spec'ed HDR TVs thus far, but that lack of a consistent white level from title to title is shown up badly by the SDR conversion. You probably don't keep up with all the respective threads for individual titles (all that bike riding's gotta tire a man out), as I've previously mentioned how Star Trek '09 had horribly dim highlights when viewed at what had become my 'standard' SDR settings; white literally looked grey. But when I watched Ghostbusters II at the same settings, it was waaaaay too bright and blown out, nuking loads of detail which was clearly visible on the SDR Blu-ray.

And yet, this doesn't seem to be an issue with any newer movies I've seen thus far, as I get a very consistent SDR conversion from title to title which is why I was so effusive with praise towards UHD Blu at the start. But with older movies that get retrofitted into UHD - even the relatively recent 2009 Trek - am I right in thinking that because they simply don't feature the same kind of dynamic range at source that the white level luminance is open to much more interpretation when mastering to HDR?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I reckon that's something which hasn't bothered too many folks with properly spec'ed HDR TVs thus far...

Then I reckon if viewers have always been happy ….I’m happy . I’m not one to quibble over consumer satisfaction.

Certainly easier than trying to find out what client monitor (on the far right) -




each and every grading suite has used to produce each and every Ultra HD Blu-ray movie in order to be certain that what you’re getting is actually close to what the Director intended.

[puddy77]

YouTube just unveiled their HDR support: https://youtube.googleblog.com/2016/...t-for-hdr.html Also, two of the first HDR videos on there are also streaming in 8k. I think that's new too.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by puddy77

in 8k

In terms of spatial detail, you just can’t beat 8K acquisition and display…..

[GunZenBomZ]

Oh look 8k stuff..

[DanBa]

"Starting today, you can watch YouTube videos in HDR on supported devices, such as HDR TVs with the new Chromecast Ultra, and soon on all 2016 Samsung SUHD and UHD TVs."
https://youtube.googleblog.com/2016/...t-for-hdr.html

Apparently, today

VP9-PQ (VP9 profile 2) HDR file stored on YouTube cloud >> Internet >> VP9-PQ compliant Chromecast Ultra > uncompressed HDR10 video stream >> HDMI 2.0a >> HDR10-compliant TV

and soon VP9-PQ and hopefully VP9-HLG should be implemented on all 2016 Samsung SUHD and UHD TVs.


"Starting today, any creator can upload HDR videos to YouTube".
https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/7126552

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by GunZenBomZ

Oh look 8k stuff..

In some respects ^, some center in the real world being more authentically cutting-edge than the entertainment world as depicted in the TV show Pure Genius….. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5500906/).
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5500906/...r/rm4179689728

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by DanBa

“If it's missing, we assume the content was mastered on a Sony BVM-X300 display”.

Like the one shown on the far left in the pic of the TV suite of post 605.

[zmarty]

I will start uploading my HDR videos first thing tonight. I actually tried uploading some a couple of weeks ago but YouTube was rejecting them then.

[davcole]

Originally Posted by puddy77

YouTube just unveiled their HDR support: https://youtube.googleblog.com/2016/...t-for-hdr.html Also, two of the first HDR videos on there are also streaming in 8k. I think that's new too.

Outstanding!

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Perhaps the 4K content protection stripper or HDCP 2.2 ‘downgrader/converter’ leading to the subsequent lawsuit….
https://www.scribd.com/doc/294553836...Bl59aWBgg69Air and settlement has added a degree of complexity and delay to the whole process.

I am hoping that doesn't mean another version of HDCP.

Originally Posted by puddy77

YouTube just unveiled their HDR support: https://youtube.googleblog.com/2016/...t-for-hdr.html

Impressive, and what they allow for HDR uploading is very versatile.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by zmarty

I will start uploading my HDR videos first thing tonight. I actually tried uploading some a couple of weeks ago but YouTube was rejecting them then.

An aspiring contributor to the higher dynamic range revolution.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

I am hoping that doesn't mean another version of HDCP.

Indeed, as the next version of the HDMI specification will usher in even closer studio-quality content to consumer devices.

Hollywood doesn’t like that HDCP 2.2 was cracked and despite HDMI and HDCP technologies belonging to separate organizations, in reality, at the end of the day, they are closely linked together…..https://www.cnet.com/news/hdcp-2-2-w...-need-to-know/

[bailey1987]

I just need a HDR monitor now. Apparently the YouTube videos will only work in HDR if you have a Chromecast Ultra, so be advised.

[DanBa]

About HDR TVs with the new Chromecast Ultra from "Starting today, you can watch YouTube videos in HDR on supported devices, such as HDR TVs with the new Chromecast Ultra, and soon on all 2016 Samsung SUHD and UHD TVs.":
https://youtube.googleblog.com/2016/...t-for-hdr.html

The VP9-PQ YouTube HDR is not the CTA / BDA HDR10:
. the codec of royalty-free VP9-PQ is the royalty-free 10-bit VP9
. the codec of HDR10 is the royalty-paid 10-bit HEVC H.265.

However, as far as I understand, the attributes of the uncompressed video streams of VP9-PQ & HDR10 from a media player like the Chromecast Ultra to a compatible HDR TV are exactly the same:
. same color primaries Rec.2020
. same transfer function SMPTE ST 2084 PQ
. same static metadata
. same interface HDMI 2.0a


Starting today

VP9-PQ file stored on YouTube cloud >> Internet >> VP9-PQ compliant Chromecast Ultra > uncompressed "HDR10" video stream >> HDMI 2.0a >> HDR10 compliant TV

and soon

VP9-PQ file stored on YouTube cloud >> Internet >> VP9-PQ compliant TV

VP9-HLG file stored on YouTube cloud >> Internet >> VP9-HLG compliant TV

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

In some respects ^, some center in the real world being more authentically cutting-edge than the entertainment world as depicted in the TV show Pure Genius….. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5500906/).
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5500906/...r/rm4179689728

Or, for those folks who couldn’t care less about real world actively practicing surgeons ( https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...la#post2024141)
and prefer their surgeons more mystical (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1211837/...?ref_=tt_ov_vi)
,well, that’s o.k. too as we can do a referral for that also, here…..
http://www.dolby.com/us/en/movie-fin...MV006569340000

[Penton-Man]

Addendum to the last sentence ^ above, now that I have the time to complete the thought in writing….

Some digital intermediate colorists like Mike working with cinematographers

digital intermediate

at Dolby Vision capable grading facilities rocking Dolby Vision projectors are beginning to document their HDR grading credits on their resumes, thusly giving readers the opportunity to determine exactly how much experience they have accumulated working in this relatively new format with finished projects…..
http://www.technicolor.com/en/mike-sowa?location=938

And as an elaboration to the YouTube in the paragraph above, due to the foresight of cinematographer Daryn Okada (multi-year past president of the American Society of Cinematographers), the dynamic range /WCG parameter for Dolphin Tale 2 was protected at the highest level all throughout shooting and thru post for the possibility of a future HDR release. Key learning point: even if aspiring filmmakers have no plans for an immediate HDR release of their movies, best to protect it for future versions.