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[threefiftyrocket]

Originally Posted by SpaceDog

I'm not sure if there is an official announcement, but as all special features have been listed "on DVD" and we know 2 of the DVDs are the Appendices, it seems to stand to reason that the films are spread across 2 BDs.

Hopefully someone here can answer this, because I've regurgitated the information that was relayed to me, but I don't think I've ever actually seen "official" documentation and word on this. Regarding the Special Features to the EE of LotR, I know that the documentaries were recorded a lot with handheld Digital Video cameras, but I've always been told they were filmed in SD so regardless of whether they are put on BD, they will never be upgraded to HD. Is there any truth to this? So many people keep complaining about the Appendices were not put on BD, but if they can't be upgraded to HD, isn't it BETTER for them to be on DVD so our players can upscale? Thanks if anyone can answer!

[Bobby Henderson]

It's impossible to take material originally videotaped and post-produced in SD and somehow inflate it into HD. If it's originally SD all its ever going to be is SD. Artificially re-sampling the video up to HD proportions is never going to add more detail than was already present in the original SD footage.

It's been a long time since I've looked at the extras on the 2-disc theatrical and 4-disc DVD releases (I have both versions of all 3 movies on DVD). If my memory is correct the only extras that really have any potential of being redone in HD is the movie trailers.

If we're lucky the movie trailers will be included on the Blu-ray discs redone in HD. I guess there is some potential for that since the trailers were on the theatrical cut DVDs and not the 4-disc extended editions. So even if WB does merely regurge the EE extras DVDs there's still a shot at getting the trailers in HD.

WB is pushing out this LOTR extended edition release as a preemptive double dip. With the Hobbit movies due to arrive in theaters in a year or two that would put off any ultimate mega super duper LOTR box set with any substantially new material until those new movies are arriving on home video.

[MerrickG]

Originally Posted by threefiftyrocket

So many people keep complaining about the Appendices were not put on BD, but if they can't be upgraded to HD, isn't it BETTER for them to be on DVD so our players can upscale?

I dont know where you heard all this, but here are the answers:

Something upscaled to HD in studio will usually look better than your player encoding it. Im sure there are rare exceptions, but that is the general rule. It also depends on your player.

Also it doesnt matter one way or the other whether the SD material is on a bluray or dvd, it will be upscaled either way.

I am not in favor of Warner just giving us the two appendices dvds that came with the original 4 disc sets, I would MUCH rather them be placed on a single bluray for each film. Does it really make a difference? No. But just reusing the same 2 dvds from the previous set just comes across as cheap.

Having said that, despite how others (SpaceDog) feel I would MUCH rather them include all the extras from the previous sets than not including them at all. Even if it means just throwing in the previous dvds. Not including them at all would be a bigger slap in the face to fans.

The real thing I want are new HD transfers and the films spread out across two films. That will make me real happy.

[MerrickG]

I also think that Warner would be doing society a favor by spreading the films over two discs. Making people get up off their butts after two hours can help create less Biggest Loser contestants.

[Indyjones]

Ok, so what's the deal with the studios reverting back to lossy sound on catalog titles now? First Universal skimps out and gives us lossy on Uncle Buck. Now it seems that Fox has given Robots the same treatment. I don't get it and what's puzzling even more is that Fox is now doing it. I just hope The Sandlot didn't get the same treatment.

[DetroitSportsFan]

Originally Posted by Indyjones

I just hope The Sandlot didn't get the same treatment.

A member over in the Hot Deals section said he found it early and indeed it also has a lossy soundtrack.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Indyjones

Ok, so what's the deal with the studios reverting back to lossy sound on catalog titles now? First Universal skimps out and gives us lossy on Uncle Buck. Now it seems that Fox has given Robots the same treatment. I don't get it and what's puzzling even more is that Fox is now doing it. I just hope The Sandlot didn't get the same treatment.

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

A member over in the Hot Deals section said he found it early and indeed it also has a lossy soundtrack.

I warned people it was a start of a trend, and now it's rampant.

[JediFonger]

yup i'm mad too! wth is going on?

Originally Posted by Indyjones

Ok, so what's the deal with the studios reverting back to lossy sound on catalog titles now? First Universal skimps out and gives us lossy on Uncle Buck. Now it seems that Fox has given Robots the same treatment. I don't get it and what's puzzling even more is that Fox is now doing it. I just hope The Sandlot didn't get the same treatment.

[Indyjones]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

I warned people it was a start of a trend, and now it's rampant.

WTH??? And the studios wonder why catalog titles don't sell. I want both Uncle Buck and The Sandlot, but what do you do? Give in and get'em? The way I see it, if you do that, you're basically telling the studios that it's perfectly ok and you're willing to pay what amounts to an overpriced DVD with a blu-ray stamp on it. If I want a DVD, I'll go buy a DVD. We're 5+ years into the format and now studios are starting to half-a** their releases. I don't care how huge the title is. When it comes to blu's - no lossless = no sale for me.

[coolmilo]

Originally Posted by Indyjones

WTH??? And the studios wonder why catalog titles don't sell. I want both Uncle Buck and The Sandlot, but what do you do? Give in and get'em? The way I see it, if you do that, you're basically telling the studios that it's perfectly ok and you're willing to pay what amounts to an overpriced DVD with a blu-ray stamp on it. If I want a DVD, I'll go buy a DVD. We're 5+ years into the format and now studios are starting to half-a** their releases. I don't care how huge the title is. When it comes to blu's - no lossless = no sale for me.

No lossless = I'll stream and skip Blu-ray all together.

[wallendo]

Originally Posted by Indyjones

WTH??? And the studios wonder why catalog titles don't sell. I want both Uncle Buck and The Sandlot, but what do you do? Give in and get'em? The way I see it, if you do that, you're basically telling the studios that it's perfectly ok and you're willing to pay what amounts to an overpriced DVD with a blu-ray stamp on it. If I want a DVD, I'll go buy a DVD. We're 5+ years into the format and now studios are starting to half-a** their releases. I don't care how huge the title is. When it comes to blu's - no lossless = no sale for me.

If your intent is to send the studios a message, not buying the product may send the wrong message - the studio is likely to assume that "catalog titles don't sell well". On the other hand, I understand your point about the message sent when buying an "inferior" product.

The real problem we face, is that the population of this board doesn't represent the general blu-ray population. I suspect the overwhelming majority of blu-ray users are listening to their BD's through their TV speakers.

I wonder if DTS has stopped subsidizing DTS HD MA?

[threefiftyrocket]

Originally Posted by wallendo

If your intent is to send the studios a message, not buying the product may send the wrong message - the studio is likely to assume that "catalog titles don't sell well". On the other hand, I understand your point about the message sent when buying an "inferior" product.

The real problem we face, is that the population of this board doesn't represent the general blu-ray population. I suspect the overwhelming majority of blu-ray users are listening to their BD's through their TV speakers.

I wonder if DTS has stopped subsidizing DTS HD MA?

This +1

I've got a buddy that I've TRIED to get on this board several times, and he just has no interest. He's got a REALLY nice setup, Pioneer Kuro, Onkyo head unit, and Infinity speakers, sounds really really nice. I've TRIED and TRIED to explain HD audio to him though, and I don't think he quite gets it. Fancies himself a videophile but nothing in the audio department. He's a good smart guy too, knows a lot about electronics and stuff, so it just goes to show that the average BD consumer is not as picky about audio as they are video...

[abintra]

Is it more expensive or time consuming, or whatever really, to studios to use a lossless track versus a lossy one?

Not that I'm looking to justify the decision but I'm curious why studios would even consider cutting a corner like that. Aren't they spending the time and money archiving and creating HD masters for the long term anyway?

[threefiftyrocket]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

I warned people it was a start of a trend, and now it's rampant.

Yeah, I noticed after I bought Bambi that it is Hi Res audio and not Master Audio... a DISNEY title... granted... a 70 year old movie, the audio that it has, I don't know if there would be any difference, but still... At least its HD audio and not just crappy old DD or DTS... THAT would have SEVERELY upset me...

I won't buy these crappy lossy audio releases... I bought a few before I really understood HD audio, and I won't continue to do it. If studios don't believe I deserve the best product and put effort into it, they don't deserve my money. I would rather spend a bit more on a catalog and get a quality product than spend more money on something I already have on DVD only to say, "I shoulda just stuck with my DVD."

[nathan_393]

Originally Posted by threefiftyrocket

Yeah, I noticed after I bought Bambi that it is Hi Res audio and not Master Audio... a DISNEY title... granted... a 70 year old movie, the audio that it has, I don't know if there would be any difference, but still... At least its HD audio and not just crappy old DD or DTS... THAT would have SEVERELY upset me...

I won't buy these crappy lossy audio releases... I bought a few before I really understood HD audio, and I won't continue to do it. If studios don't believe I deserve the best product and put effort into it, they don't deserve my money. I would rather spend a bit more on a catalog and get a quality product than spend more money on something I already have on DVD only to say, "I shoulda just stuck with my DVD."

Yeah, there definitely would have been in an improvement if Bambi was lossless.

This whole thing is just disturbing. It's sad, and irritating. What's the point of Blu if they're not going to be Lossless? Unfrigginbelievable.

Somebody at the Bits needs to start telling their contacts to stop being idiots about this and just do it right.

[DarkDune]

Anyone from The Digital Bits -- or other people with knowledge of this video processing tech, and its place in the future of the industry -- care to comment on this post?

I only "bump" as it got a little lost in the discussion on the events in Japan.

Originally Posted by DarkDune

Hey Digital Bits,

As you may recall, I've been a long-time reader of The Digital Bits (won the Blues Brothers DVD from your contest WAAY back), and I recently encountered a technology that literally astounded me. Long story short, our Pioneer ELITE VSX-37TX A/V Receiver bit the dust -- again -- so I opted to pick up a new 2010 VSX-33 Pioneer ELITE A/V Receiver to not only replace it, but to allow us to finally enjoy Dolby TrueHD, and DTS Master Audio tracks on Blu. To my utter surprise, the Pioneer ELITE VSX-33 also included video processing on the HDMI connection from Marvell Qdeo, and WOW!

We have a 10bit Sony Display (Bravia KDL-40XBR4) that purports to allow you to really see a difference when Deep Color is used, but not even Blu is output in Deep Color! Well, the VSX-33 also -- I discovered -- outputs the processed HDMI video in 36bit (12bit*3) Deep Color, and I can literally SEE the difference. Basically, anywhere on Blu that even a hint of "banding" showed up, the Marvell Qdeo video processing changed it seemlessly to acceptable gradations that I hardly notice anymore.

HERE IS MY QUESTION
My question to you is have you ever used equipment with this video processing tech, and if you didn't realize what it was doing, are you also not impressed? I am not kidding when I say that this technology has allowed me to REALLY enjoy Blu again, as I no longer suffer from the previously, occasional cringe from "banding" -- even on Blu.

I think you -- or your colleagues -- should write up an article on the Marvell Qdeo technology, as I am thinking it is going to improve the picture for a lot of people, over many video delivery technologies.

Here is their extended technology brief:

The World As You See It
Marvell Qdeo Extended Technology Brief

I knew nothing of their company before picking up the VSX-33, but it really surprised me as to what it can do to improve the video quality even on Blu. DVDs are spectacular too

Kindest Regards,

DarkDune
Fan of The Digital Bits, and Fan of Marvell Qdeo!

[Indyjones]

Originally Posted by wallendo

If your intent is to send the studios a message, not buying the product may send the wrong message - the studio is likely to assume that "catalog titles don't sell well". On the other hand, I understand your point about the message sent when buying an "inferior" product.

I'm not trying to send a message to the studios, I just simply won't buy blu's that have lossy audio. I admit, I do have a few blu's with lossy audio, but I got them early in the game and they were gifts. I won't shell out my own money on inferior product. I even skipped out on Grindhouse and bought the individual releases.

Sadly, the only company we can count on as far as quality is concerned is Criterion. I'll gladly pay $30+ for one of their releases over a $10 title with a half-assed transfer.

[threefiftyrocket]

Originally Posted by nathan_393

Yeah, there definitely would have been in an improvement if Bambi was lossless.

This whole thing is just disturbing. It's sad, and irritating. What's the point of Blu if they're not going to be Lossless? Unfrigginbelievable.

Somebody at the Bits needs to start telling their contacts to stop being idiots about this and just do it right.

That's what I was thinking, but didn't know considering the age of the source... I know something newer would totally have an effect. I was just SHOCKED that DISNEY... DISNEY... did this, they even used PCM before they started using lossless codecs and then they skimp on that release... Disney isnt quite criterion but they still put out top quality releases pretty consistently (they have had a few duds but that is VERY few).

But yes, it is irritating that studios are going back to laziness and putting out inferior products just like they did when blu ray first came out, like WB and their DD audio crap. I don't care how good the movie is, if I look at the back and it doesn't say TrueHD, DTS HD MA, or PCM, I won't buy it. Bambi was the exception b/c my wife really wanted it...

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by indyjones

sadly, the only company we can count on as far as quality is concerned is criterion. I'll gladly pay $30+ for one of there releases over a $10 title with a half-assed transfer.

+1.

[Indyjones]

Originally Posted by threefiftyrocket

Yeah, I noticed after I bought Bambi that it is Hi Res audio and not Master Audio... a DISNEY title... granted... a 70 year old movie, the audio that it has, I don't know if there would be any difference, but still... At least its HD audio and not just crappy old DD or DTS... THAT would have SEVERELY upset me...

I didn't even notice that about Bambi.