4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

I'm going on record that I will buy a UHD OLED 65" HDR flat display in 2016 and I believe I will not have to pay more than $4000.00 for it. I hope and believe that Panasonic, Samsung, and Sony will offer OLED alternatives to LG by then and I believe the UHD Alliance will have standards in place and decals on the Displays by the time I am ready to buy.

Good man. Occasionally I get down to your neck of the woods while visiting the Beckman (http://bfmicrosite.com/revolutionizingscience/index.php ) Laser Institute at UCI in Irvine. So, after you’ve got that 65 incher up and running, maybe I can sneak on by during lunchtime for a look-see.

Or maybe you can at least post a pic for community members to enjoy?

Originally Posted by raygendreau

If you see one with your own eyes, you will want one....eventually. (OLED but not LG specifically).

Since 2012, I’ve been using a small-ish (~ 25”) OLED monitor (RGB 10-bit) regularly while at work. Costing substantially over twice as much as your price point of the LG….although, of course, the purchase was made by my department rather than coming out of my own personal pocket.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland

Done

So anyone (other than an independent observer ) whose posted on the last several pages of this thread regarding the topic of online authentication for Ultra HD Blu-ray and doesn’t take the time to vote in the poll, for which they’ve now been handed the opportunity on a silver platter to do so by Wendell….should be ashamed of themselves.

In fact , I consider it worse than when I hear people at work bi*ch about local politicians, Congress, the President, etc.….and don’t devote the time and energy to get out and vote on Election Day.

[I KEEL YOU]

Originally Posted by Dreamliner330

local > cloud

Nintendo online for original Wii: Dead
Target Ticket: Dead

Services only last as long as money is flowing in.

Except in this case, the more likely scenario is them ditching physical media all together if the sales fail, instead of the scenario you're probably hoping for (them removing DRM off UHD blu ray).

[ouflak]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

On line authentication may apply to BD as well as UBD going forward:

https://wikileaks.org/sony/docs/05/d...dline.pptx.pdf

https://wikileaks.org/sony/docs/05/d...40402.pptx.pdf

I will never go through any online 'authentication' to watch one of my own legally purchased movies (which is all of them in my case). I'll just stream the thing from their website and they can go authenticate themselves.

[Dex Robinson]

Originally Posted by ouflak

I will never go through any online 'authentication' to watch one of my own legally purchased movies (which is all of them in my case). I'll just stream the thing from their website and they can go authenticate themselves.

I believe online authentication would essentially remove the "soft middle ground" between disc buyers and streamers...and push most people towards streaming.

The people who will tolerate this kind of DRM are the hardest of hardcore videophiles who feel the need to have the best no matter what kind of hoops they have to jump through.

Like many of you, I'm a guy who REALLY likes discs and I enjoy the quality and pride of ownership. But I have little tolerance for excessive complication or rules that place restrictions on my collection. For me, I'd look at this kind of system and say, "Ya' know, if I have to have my home theater hooked up the net anyway, why pay $$29.95 for a disc when I can stream it for a couple of bucks?" I pay a premium for ownership. I buy a lot of $25.00 Blu-rays that aren't really worth $25.00 in entertainment value . But I pay more as the premium for a lifetime of ownership and access.

Online DRM will push the soft middle ground away from buying...and will likely push them away en masse.

Again begging the question: How many buyers can UHD BD (or plain BD) afford to lose?

[Coenskubrick]

Absolutely. Ownership is vital. This kind of thing pisses me off. Next thing you know books will have retinal scanners that make sure the reader is authenticated with an online account or it will not open.

I for one am not buying into it. If my discs are not mine to (practically at least, if not technically legally) do with what I choose, I won't buy them.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

On line authentication may apply to BD as well as UBD going forward:

https://wikileaks.org/sony/docs/05/d...dline.pptx.pdf

https://wikileaks.org/sony/docs/05/d...40402.pptx.pdf

I said earlier about how I thought the DB function and how it's all gonna work is possibly the biggest issue that's holding completion of UHD BD back at this point. People predictably weighed in with comments akin to "I don't care about that, I don't see why it's important" which is missing the point completely: it seems to be VERY important to the content providers, which is why they're taking the time to iron it all out (though they do entertain the possibility that it won't be ready for launch which is what the "sunrise" refers to, i.e. introducing it later).

The cynic in me thinks that they're pushing so hard for this DB system so that they can hide online authentication for UHD BD in plain sight, e.g. in order to use the DB feature you'll need to register your player and other devices you want to download to, then download a key or whatever and carry on from there, so if they can get the public used to doing that as a matter of course with the DB copies then they won't think twice about having to do it for the discs as well*.



*present company excepted

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I said earlier about how I thought the DB function and how it's all gonna work is possibly the biggest issue that's holding completion of UHD BD back at this point. People predictably weighed in with comments akin to "I don't care about that, I don't see why it's important" which is missing the point completely: it seems to be VERY important to the content providers, which is why they're taking the time to iron it all out (though they do entertain the possibility that it won't be ready for launch which is what the "sunrise" refers to, i.e. introducing it later).

The cynic in me thinks that they're pushing so hard for this DB system so that they can hide online authentication for UHD BD in plain sight, e.g. in order to use the DB feature you'll need to register your player and other devices you want to download to, then download a key or whatever and carry on from there, so if they can get the public used to doing that as a matter of course with the DB copies then they won't think twice about having to do it for the discs as well*.



*present company excepted

Most of the Digital Bridge proposals discussed in 2014 have been Sonycentric. Here is a Fox proposal, also from 2014 covering it.

EDIT: wikileaks link removed

So, looking at the poll, several of you not interested in UBD if it requires on line authentication. What are your plans if authentication is required for new release BDs? Are you going to stop buying BDs as well?

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Most of the Digital Bridge proposals discussed in 2014 have been Sonycentric. Here is a Fox proposal, also from 2014 covering it.

https://wikileaks.org/sony/docs/05/d...40207.pptx.pdf

So, looking at the poll, several of you not interested in UBD if it requires on line authentication. What are your plans if authentication is required for new release BDs? Are you going to stop buying BDs as well?

I really don't see how it could be done for Blu-ray - I don't see how it would be feasible all things considered. But, yes, I wouldn't buy any disc that required such. Fortunately, they cannot impose this BS on my current discs and catalog collection.

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

So, looking at the poll, several of you not interested in UBD if it requires on line authentication. What are your plans if authentication is required for new release BDs? Are you going to stop buying BDs as well?

If it comes down to it, I would stop buying any that have such a requirement.

But I don't see how they can really implement that now so long into the format's life. While most if not all BD players connect to the internet for various reasons and purposes (i.e. BD Live features, which have practically been abandoned in most cases... using services like Netflix, etc.), presumably the players will need some kind of specifc feature built into them to do whatever kind of specific authentication would be needed.

Given the variety of players on the market from different manufacturers, I would think this would be very difficult to do and make sure that it works on all players (or at least those made within the past 5 years or so... I'll go ahead and make an exception for some first and second gen players that had issues anyway as BD-J was rolled out). If it requires people to get a new compatible player, then it will not only have the combined downsides of both physical and digital media (like UHD BD theorectically would if online authentication is required), but would also have all of the downsides of adopting a completely new format, with absolutely NONE of the upsides (no improved quality, etc.).

Frankly the one thing that makes me somewhat hopeful that UHD BD won't require online authentication just to watch the disc is the issue of having different players from different manufacturers all working collectively for the same kind of authetnication handshake needed for the discs to work. But to try and add that to players that weren't necessarilydesigned for it up front, like existing BD players? That's even less likely IMO.

[raygendreau]

I doubt that the digital bridge functionality could be applied to existing BD players, so Digital Bridge on BD would only be accessible on UBD players.

The question is, when the Digital Bridge/DRM/authentication is settled; will they still be releasing BDs without DB. They probably will.

In the age of UBD, combo packs will include BD/UBD/possibly 3BD. No more digital paper inserts with access codes for UV, since digital access through Digital Bridge will be on the UBD.

I don't think authorization is a big deal, given the advantages of DB in exporting content to mobile devices and media servers in the UBD player or external.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

I doubt that the digital bridge functionality could be applied to existing BD players, so Digital Bridge on BD would only be accessible on UBD players.

The question is, when the Digital Bridge/DRM/authentication is settled; will they still be releasing BDs without DB. They probably will.

In the age of UBD, combo packs will include BD/UBD/possibly 3BD. No more digital paper inserts with access codes for UV, since digital access through Digital Bridge will be on the UBD.

I don't think authorization is a big deal, given the advantages of DB in exporting content to mobile devices and media servers in the UBD player or external.

So... you're ready to strike that Faustian Bargain with the studios for a little "convenience" and the ability to watch Lawrence of Arabia on a 5" screen?

Okay then.

[AintNoSin]

DRM/authentication is obviously a pipe dream of the legal teams involved in this process, which is how it finds its way into the specs. However, when the rubber meets the proverbial road, the engineers come back and point out that this is going to be an absolutely nightmare to coordinate between all the media companies and electronics makers, how ridiculously complicated and probably expensive it will be, and the people in charge will say, "Never mind."

[Dynamo of Eternia]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

I doubt that the digital bridge functionality could be applied to existing BD players, so Digital Bridge on BD would only be accessible on UBD players.

The question is, when the Digital Bridge/DRM/authentication is settled; will they still be releasing BDs without DB. They probably will.

In the age of UBD, combo packs will include BD/UBD/possibly 3BD. No more digital paper inserts with access codes for UV, since digital access through Digital Bridge will be on the UBD.

I don't think authorization is a big deal, given the advantages of DB in exporting content to mobile devices and media servers in the UBD player or external.

I'm only against online authentication if it is required for me to pop the disc into the machine and watch the movie directly from the disc.


If this works in such a way where I have to authenticate onlne in order to make a convenient digital copy stored on a hard drive connected to my player (so that constant disc swapping isn't needed to swap between movies), while at the same time allowing the movie to be viewed directly from the disc, itself, without any need to authenticate (therefore working both as a copy I can easily pop into any compatible player to watch, and also as a fail-safe in the event that the ability to authenticate for a digital copy ever goes away... or in other words exactly as existing DVDs and BDs currently work), then I have no problem with it.

But if there is absolutely no way what-so-ever for me to watch the movie that is on the disc that I purchased without authenticating online.... then that is something that I have a huge problem with and will not support.

[raygendreau]

I think the advantages of the Digital Bridge may cause manufacturers to begin marketing BD players with that functionality if UBD players begin gathering dust on retailer shelves. There were many members expressing their satisfaction with HD that had no intention to adopt UHD, so it could happen.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

So... you're ready to strike that Faustian Bargain with the studios for a little "convenience" and the ability to watch Lawrence of Arabia on a 5" screen?

Okay then.

Would I strike that bargain to watch it on a 5" screen? No. But on my 4K TV? Yes. I don't care if the Devil himself drops the disc off.

[raygendreau]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

So... you're ready to strike that Faustian Bargain with the studios for a little "convenience" and the ability to watch Lawrence of Arabia on a 5" screen?

Okay then.

Convenience is important, and for the masses (the 95%) it outweighs quality.

Originally Posted by Dynamo of Eternia

I'm only against online authentication if it is required for me to pop the disc into the machine and watch the movie directly from the disc.


If this works in such a way where I have to authenticate onlne in order to make a convenient digital copy stored on a hard drive connected to my player (so that constant disc swapping isn't needed to swap between movies), while at the same time allowing the movie to be viewed directly from the disc, itself, without any need to authenticate (therefore working both as a copy I can easily pop into any compatible player to watch, and also as a fail-safe in the event that the ability to authenticate for a digital copy ever goes away... or in other words exactly as existing DVDs and BDs currently work), then I have no problem with it.

But if there is absolutely no way what-so-ever for me to watch the movie that is on the disc that I purchased without authenticating online.... then that is something that I have a huge problem with and will not support.

I believe authentication will be required only if/when you want to use the Digital Bridge to export content. Settings for the UBD player will probably have a DB off option. If DB is set to off or there is no internet connection to the player, the UBD or BD will not require authentication to play.

[FilmFreakosaurus]

Originally Posted by raygendreau

Convenience is important, and for the masses (the 95%) it outweighs quality.



I believe authentication will be required only if/when you want to use the Digital Bridge to export content. Settings for the UBD player will probably have a DB off option. If DB is set to off or there is no internet connection to the player, the UBD or BD will not require authentication to play.

I hope you're right and that disc authorization is kept to in-disc keys as before.

[octagon]

Originally Posted by FilmFreakosaurus

So... you're ready to strike that Faustian Bargain with the studios for a little "convenience" and the ability to watch Lawrence of Arabia on a 5" screen?

Okay then.

We're not talking about Faustian Bargains here. Faust had to give up something that was his. In this case we might - repeat might - be faced with 'giving up' something that isn't ours to begin with: namely, the 'right' to do whatever we want with the next copy of Lawrence of Arabia we purchase.

Don't get me wrong, I'm as big a control freak as the next guy. I hope studios will continue to sell what are essentially transferable lifetime licenses. But I don't feel entitled to such a license.

[NY Yankees 23 2]

I'm hoping it all fails! Blu-ray is just fine for the home. Why buy a new TV, new disc player, and I'm sure, at least $50 for movie discs for a single format? I'm still watching ESPN in 720p? $5000, give or take for a new system when blu-rays haven't even been widely used for 8 years is nuts.

When I can watch TV or even play video games (not happening) in 4K, then I will move on and ONLY when the movies are reasonably priced the way blu-rays are now, which IMO, are still overpriced considering how long they've been around.