4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[rdodolak]

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

A reason for concern?

http://www.twice.com/news/blu-raydvd....uf4xAMFS.dpuf

Ouch, I guess the studios will never learn.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

A reason for concern?



http://www.twice.com/news/blu-raydvd....uf4xAMFS.dpuf

I'm not sure whether they're talking about actually downscaling films finished at 4K, or whether they mean downscaling the original footage (whether it be digital acquisition or film scanned at 4K+) when working on the movie in post. Because, as I'm sure most of you know, a great many movies are still finished at 2K (notice how it's mainly Sony flicks that are 4K?) so the question of how to deal with all of these hundreds (thousands?) of titles that were finished at 2K will need to be addressed at some point.

To be honest, I know how good 4K upscaling can be, so if it's done competently and then encoded with whatever enhanced specs 4K BD ends up with (wider colour gamut, higher bit-depth etc) then 2K-upscaled movies will still have the potential to look better than a standard Blu-ray with regards to things like colour and dynamic range and possibly detail too, if the original BD was filtered or poorly scaled to begin with.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Smith

It would be a necessary addition. 3D to 2D is a downgrade no matter what the resolution is

Each to their own. While I LOVES me some 3D, I've seen how good 4K can be (and that's just with HD-level bit-depth and colour sampling, never mind UHD) and it's astonishing, with richness and detail and depth so staggering it's like looking through a window anyway.

It does beg the question though: when a 3D movie also gets a 4K finish (that'd be Sony again) do I stick with the HD 3D or the 4K 2D? Ah, I'll just get both.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by harpolini

I wonder what the disc size will be?

should be the sam3e size

I bet with proper software I would be able to play them.

maybe but there might also need HW (such as a new video card)

But theoretically, wouldn't a 4K disc say for a 2 hour movie comes roughly 300gb for MPEG2, 800GB at Prores, and god knows how much RAW.[/QUOTE]

1) when compressing it can be any #

2) at uncompressed 4k would need 4x the GB that of 2k, but the difference should not be anywhere near as big when compressed. Adding more info (such as resolution) means that there will be more places where the encoder can compress with less loss. It is the reason why 3D at 1.5x 2D looks better.

[emgesp]

Only 100GB's? Doesn't the bitrate need to improve by a factor of 4x higher for artifact free 4K, or is the new H.265 codec that efficient?

I don't know guys this seems like SACD/DVD-Audio for video. Niche product that not a lot of companies will get on board with.

[bailey1987]

Is there any word on BD Live 2.0, what are the chances of a more advanced platform?

[Wickerman1972]

They're doing this too soon. 100 gb discs is not enough. That isn't even enough for 24 hertz at 4K let alone 60 hertz.

And ya think lots of blu ray transfers were bad? Ya ain't seen nothing yet. I expect a lot of these studios that lazily and cheaply and shortsightedly did their scans and masters in 2K rather than 4K to use those same 2K masters and artificially upscale them to 4K.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Carlanga

I disagree w both you :P
THe average buyer in WM, will go out of their way to buy a Funai or whatever random invented brand 40" 720 30hz tv that consumes 5X as much power w shitty panel display for $75 on BF this year… Maybe in 10 yrs you will see good quality tvs on WM BF

Crazy Wal-Mart Black Friday fight for TV - YouTube

not sure how you are disagreeing with me. I used the 500$ example because that is what the OP said and , like I said BB because we had the 2004 sales on that site, the point was simple,

even though inflation dictates we should be getting less for our money, with every passing year we get more for it
and if you compare
Walmart in 2008
http://bfads.net/Black-Friday/Walmart/2008?page=5
Sansui 19'' Class LCD HDTV w/ Digital Tuner $178.00
Emerson 32" LCD HDTV w/ Digital Tuner, BLC320EM9 $388.00
Samsung 32'' 720p LCD HDTV $498.00
Polaroid 42" LCD 1080p HDTV $598.00
Samsung 42" Class Plasma HDTV, PN42A410 $698.00
Samsung 50" Plasma HDTV $798.00
Samsung 40" Class 1080p LCD HDTV, LN40A500T $798.00
Samsung 46'' 1080p LCD HDTV $1,098.00

to 2013 http://bfads.net/Black-Friday/Walmart/2013?page=21

Element 23" 720p 60Hz LED HDTV $75.00
Funai 32" 720p 60Hz LED HDTV $98.00
Element 40" 1080p 60Hz LED HDTV $178.00
Samsung 32" 720p 60Hz LED HDTV (UN32EH4003) $227.00
Emerson 50" 1080p 60Hz LED HDTV $288.00
Samsung 32" 1080p 120Hz LED Smart HDTV (32EH5300) $297.00
Samsung 40" 1080p 120Hz LED Smart HDTV (UN40EH5300) $397.00
Samsung 51" 720p 600Hz Plasma HDTV (PN51F4500) $427.00
Samsung 46" Class LED 1080p 60Hz HDTV (UN46EH5300) $497.00
Vizio 60" 1080p 120Hz LED Smart HDTV $688.00
Samsung 55" 1080p 240Hz LED HDTV (UN55FH6200) $727.00
Vizio 70" 1080p 120Hz LED HDTV $998.00

(I took the the time to order by price) for any price range or even just "cheapest" you see the exact same thing you have a much better (feature and size wise ) TV.

will the guy looking for the cheapest TV at WM on BF get a 4k TV in 2015? I doubt it, but like you said with "Maybe in 10 yrs you will see good quality tvs on WM BF" at some point that might be a 4kTV

what ever someone buys ( from best or expensive to cheapest) it is constantly getting better and so what seams expensive and big today one day it won't be that way.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by DetroitSportsFan

A reason for concern?



http://www.twice.com/news/blu-raydvd....uf4xAMFS.dpuf

I call BS

[Jimmy Smith]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Each to their own. While I LOVES me some 3D, I've seen how good 4K can be (and that's just with HD-level bit-depth and colour sampling, never mind UHD) and it's astonishing, with richness and detail and depth so staggering it's like looking through a window anyway.

It does beg the question though: when a 3D movie also gets a 4K finish (that'd be Sony again) do I stick with the HD 3D or the 4K 2D? Ah, I'll just get both.

Hopefully the new format will launch 3D capable so we won't need to choose

[Bluyoda]

It's inevitable. That's for sure.

Better colour, highter bit depth, and so on is all good, but it's mainly about money, because many released BDs haven't even been properly optimized for BD, in terms of new masters, high bitrate, efficient and advanced encodes, let alone lossless audio.
Hell, Disney, and probably a few others, are still releasing BDs with lossy audio tracks in 2014!!!!
But it's the typical way.
With standard BD, many already had to repurchase most of their equipment to experience 3-D. (Luckily, I myself couldn't care less about it.)
Now, will that going to be implemented from the get-go this time, or will it again be an afterthought?
They should really get it right this time, but then it still depends on the major studios to do their homework, and we know how that has been-->Universal, Warner, Disney....all of them.

Let alone the countless films that were rendered in 2K, mostly the VFX heavy movies, from Star Wars over Lord of the Rings, to Transformers.

It's going to be great for old 60/70mm films, IMAX, and modern 4K or higher movies though.

I would be lying if I said I am not interested, but I am going to take a good look at the developments first, and it will be years before I would consider to upgrade.

I love great PQ, and BD has had problems from the beginning, and that mainly was due to the limited colour bit depth, which causes bandings, and perhaps a few other minor issues, but overall BD can look outstanding, and it sometimes does.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Yeah, 4k will be the standard for the next 500 years. Who needs advancement?

I await the bore fest that is 'the law of diminishing returns' lecture now!

agree

[Teazle]

I keep telling myself I won't upgrade every available title, but practically speaking I might not be able to resist.

One thing about these small file sizes though. When I saw Expendables 3, sitting in the 4th row, I could see some digital noise in a couple places, & in wide shots I thought detail could've been better. That was at 138gb for a 2-hr movie of only c. 6 million pixels (due to letterboxing). I wonder if I'll really be able to sit as close as I'd like w/ the new format.

For the audio, I seriously expect every friggin' title to have 24-bit. It'd be nice if they included DSD support (for music) too but once again they prob. won't bother.


Re: Expendables 3: Early scene in cargo aircraft, closeups, noise visible in grey background. Any worse & you'd call it macroblocking I think. My best guess: artifact caused by bit starvation in the encode. (Not the only explanation tho'.)

[Steedeel]

Originally Posted by Teazle

I keep telling myself I won't upgrade every available title, but practically speaking I might not be able to resist.

One thing about these small file sizes though. When I saw Expendables 3, sitting in the 4th row, I could see some digital noise in a couple places, & in wide shots I thought detail could've been better. That was at 138gb for a 2-hr movie of only c. 6 million pixels (due to letterboxing). I wonder if I'll really be able to sit as close as I'd like w/ the new format.

For the audio, I seriously expect every friggin' title to have 24-bit. It'd be nice if they included DSD support (for music) too but once again they prob. won't bother.


Re: Expendables 3: Early scene in cargo aircraft, closeups, noise visible in grey background. Any worse & you'd call it macroblocking I think. My best guess: artifact caused by bit starvation in the encode. (Not the only explanation tho'.)

Isn't that just an inevitable downside of shooting digital though? I'm no expert but on many blurays that were shot digitally I see the occasional macro blocking and strange patterns. Give me film any day!

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by Steedeel

Isn't that just an inevitable downside of shooting digital though? I'm no expert but on many blurays that were shot digitally I see the occasional macro blocking and strange patterns. Give me film any day!

I don't believe so, no. AFAIK macroblocking is usu. a compression artifact not present in the source files. But I bet someone will correct me on this.

I don't think it's at all inherent to digital film.

[Tompa]

Can't wait for the DNR'd 4K releases.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by AudioWarrior

Why not roll-up OLED displays? It'd be like buying poster, except more interesting!

Originally Posted by AudioWarrior

The only way they're going to fit speakers in those, is by using membrane speaker technology! Either that, or read subtitles....

not necessarily, you are too busy focusing on the panel part of the display, It will most likely need a rigid part to it for
1) electronics (TV tuner, display driver ....)
2) connections (hook up your player, plug for electricity....)
3) transportation (something fir the screen to be rolled around to make sure there are no creases and damage)
4)installation (no issues with some tape or tacks in a poster but most likely not as good for a TV)

and the speakers could be in that rigid part(s)

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Teazle

I call BS

same here, but I love the way the author starts with the BD rep but does not clearly define where the "source" or who is questioning this.

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

same here, but I love the way the author starts with the BD rep but does not clearly define where the "source" or who is questioning this.

Hell I didn't even bother to click the link. Downrezzing the masters due to limited storage space? Like Disney and Warner Bros. can't afford the hard drives? Please.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Teazle

I don't believe so, no. AFAIK macroblocking is usu. a compression artifact not present in the source files. But I bet someone will correct me on this.

I don't think it's at all inherent to digital film.

depends on the cameras (not all of them can save uncompressed raw format and some use interpolation for higher resolution) and the people making the film (most cameras offer a selection of formats).