Ask questions to Sony Pictures Entertainment insider "paidgeek"

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by Joe Cain

Paid, in your experience have you encountered a sup-par BD feature presentation you would say resulted from an overabundance of extras and bonus material?

I can't say I have come across one, but in all honesty, I don't get to watch as much of the other studios titles as I would like. With BD50, there is really no reason not to have an optimum picture and still have room for a couple hours of HD added value.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by ckenisell

paid, any thoughts on this?

The "workload" is dynamic, so yes there is enough capacity at any given time, provided that everyone does not put an order into the kitchen at once.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by mhafner

That is incorrect. The best possible 2K or 1080p is derived from > 2K sources by digital decimation. Direct scanning to 2K or 1080p with a sensor with 2K or 1080p resolution is NOT optimal.

What can I say... If you are correct, then my eyes are just lying to me...I hate it when that happens...

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by mhafner

So we are getting basically the master made in the 90s from very outdated equipment compared to what we have now, EE and telecine noise included?

The film was scanned as opposed to telecined from a 65mm IP. Do you know of a post facility that can handle that format and get a better result?

[Alan Gordon]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

Alan,

Most (all?) of the titles you mentioned as un-released are not ours, so any reasoning I give you as to why they are un-released to date is speculation.

I was trying not to just pick on Sony! I did mention several Sony titles though. "Rise: Blood Hunter" was released by Sony last October on DVD with no Blu-ray release. "Southland Tales" and "The Final Season" have been announced for release on DVD by Sony with no announcement for Blu-ray as well as "My Boys: Season One" is announced as coming to DVD with no Blu-ray announcements made. There are a couple of other Sony titles that weren't released D&D with DVD either that I can think of that I didn't mention, but I was really just using a few titles as examples. While the above titles are certainly not blockbusters, and I understand the reluctance to offer TV season sets at this early point in Blu-ray's life, I'm more curious as to whether or not studios (and since this is your thread, Sony in particular) might see more of a commitment to release more of the smaller releases now that the war is over? I'm also curious if we'll see more of commitment to release more TV season sets D&D?

Originally Posted by paidgeek

Honestly, it does not serve the retailers, studios, or even the consumers for us to attempt a flood of titles all at once, because that is not generally the way people buy them and there is only so much retail space to sell and market them.

Thank goodness for that too as my wallet has more than enough trouble keeping up with titles as it is, and Universal and Paramount's switch will make it even harder, but as more and more consumers move into Blu-ray, I think a lot of them will get spoiled like us and simply boycott the DVD releases and wait for a title to be released on Blu-ray... which is a double-edge sword in that it gives the studios less of a reason to go back and double-dip on Blu-ray.

Originally Posted by paidgeek

If you read some of my earlier posts, you will also note that some of our best catalog titles have not performed that well at retail while many new titles have done better than expected. Have a look at some of the sales numbers for the Blu-ray titles on the market and I suspect you will quickly be able to answer your own question....

I know, I just read your post regarding "A Few Good Men" and "Seven Years In Tibet" being low sellers yesterday. A big surprise too considering both films have been available in BOGOs before. While I have no interest in SYIT, I picked up AFGM on a BOGO a while back as I haven't seen it before and heard good things about the transfer, and while I haven't seen the film yet, I did check out the PQ and rank it among some of the best catalog titles released by Sony. Good job... shame it has to go mostly unnoticed.

BTW, thanks for your reply!

~Alan

[Teazle]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

With BD50, there is really no reason not to have an optimum picture and still have room for a couple hours of HD added value.

Paid, would you say the same holds for optimum sound quality as well as picture?

For example, I noticed that Across the Universe has a 24/48 audio track, rather than the high resolution 24/96 found on the Dave Matthews Band BD. Across the Universe being a music-heavy title, was there (to your knowledge) a disc space issue such that extras were preferred over higher sampling rate audio?

If so, might it be an option in future to stream video extras to profile 2.0 players (humbly suggested in my post #429 above), thereby freeing disc space and still delivering the extras "as & when"?

[patrick99]

Originally Posted by patrick99

Paidgeek, perhaps Jane Austen Book Club presents a better occasion for asking about SPE's current bitrate practices than Across the Universe, since I seem to be a voice in the wilderness on that one.

I very seldom agree with Peter Bracke's PQ evaluations, but I do in this case:

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/1261...nbookclub.html

"Detail and depth to the image are simply mediocre, at least for a new release. The image never boasts the kind of visible fine texture of the best high-def."

To avoid any possiblity of misunderstanding, I don't agree with Bracke's comments about colors; I asssume that this is simply a choice as to how the director and DP wanted the movie to look. Also, this encode does look much better than those cases where studios have used the same low bitrate encode on both formats. Nevertheless, I do agree with Bracke that detail and sharpness often seemed lacking.

Is the problem here the source material? It seemed to me while watching that a higher bitrate might have helped.

Does SPE have a rule or practice or policy against using bitrates above about 30?

Thanks again for your valued participation here.

Originally Posted by paidgeek

Sony Pictures does not have any policy of holding back bit rates. They are calculated based on all of the typical criteria including making foreign versions of the title.

JABC is another title that translated to Blu-ray very well in my opinion. The master was exceptionally good and I am very happy to have this title represent HD and Blu-ray.

Originally Posted by paidgeek

I think the answer to your question is yes and yes. When we release a North America only version of a title that we have rights to in other markets, we consider all of the project configurations for all markets before setting the video parameters. This is done to insure that we can use the same video encode to service every market. The actual adjustment to hold another 1 or to audio streams will not affect picture quality if we are already encoding at high bit rates, (over 20 Mbps), so accounting for all versions is just good practice.

Originally Posted by paidgeek

I can't say I have come across one, but in all honesty, I don't get to watch as much of the other studios titles as I would like. With BD50, there is really no reason not to have an optimum picture and still have room for a couple hours of HD added value.

Paidgeek, am I correct then in concluding that SPE has made a judgment that bitrates in the 20's are sufficient?

Thanks again for being here.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by Teazle

Paid, would you say the same holds for optimum sound quality as well as picture?

For example, I noticed that Across the Universe has a 24/48 audio track, rather than the high resolution 24/96 found on the Dave Matthews Band BD. Across the Universe being a music-heavy title, was there (to your knowledge) a disc space issue such that extras were preferred over higher sampling rate audio?

If so, might it be an option in future to stream video extras to profile 2.0 players (humbly suggested in my post #429 above), thereby freeing disc space and still delivering the extras "as & when"?

The reason you don't get films with 24/96 is that they are not mastered at that sample rate. 48K is it as far as our titles are concerned. If 96K was an option, we might experiment with it, but keep in mind that for double the disc consumption, you will get a very limited improvement in sound quality. Increases in sample rate allow for proportional increases in frequency range and a reduction in filter sharpness, but for distribution, 48k is all that I need as a consumer.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by patrick99

Paidgeek, am I correct then in concluding that SPE has made a judgment that bitrates in the 20's are sufficient?

Thanks again for being here.

Judgement in bold sounds makes it seem like any response I give is about to be cast in concrete and transmitted throughout the universe.

But yes, average bitrates in the 20's are sufficient for the codecs currently in use. We can go for 30 something when a project permits, but the quality / bit rate curve flattens to nothing up there. What I would really like it 100 or 200 Mbps for a max rate as this would have real benefits on occasion.

[cjamescook]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

If you read some of my earlier posts, you will also note that some of our best catalog titles have not performed that well at retail while many new titles have done better than expected. Have a look at some of the sales numbers for the Blu-ray titles on the market and I suspect you will quickly be able to answer your own question....

If you will permit me the luxury of offering an opinion:
Most likely the marketing model is switching, as probably could be predicted. Early adopters of Blu-ray have been, well, early technology adopters, and more importantly, film aficionados. Both groups would certainly be interested in purchasing classic back catalog titles, particularly those that show off BD capabilities in scenery and details as well as restoration.

I propose that for BD to move past the initial rush to increased sales means to move to a wider market. Who is this wider market? Those with more disposable cash or more inclined to make more everyday entertainment purchases. Who is that? Teenagers and twenty year olds with their larger amounts of disposable cash. What are they interested in buying? What they watch, which is certainly not 1950s Ray Harryhausen B&W flicks (sorry). They want the latest releases.

Is there a way of testing this premise? Sure, looks at your sales of A-class and B-class releases. If the sales of a B-class (or C-class?) current flicks are significantly higher than the sales of A-class back catalog titles (and the difference continues to grow), this would support this theory.

(By the way, not to confuse things, but I still remember and like your past comment that "Seinfeld is just as funny in HD [as in SD].")

Cheers!
-Jim

[patrick99]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

Judgement in bold sounds makes it seem like any response I give is about to be cast in concrete and transmitted throughout the universe.

But yes, average bitrates in the 20's are sufficient for the codecs currently in use. We can go for 30 something when a project permits, but the quality / bit rate curve flattens to nothing up there. What I would really like it 100 or 200 Mbps for a max rate as this would have real benefits on occasion.

Thanks for the response.

I wasn't looking for something cast in concrete, just a description of current thinking, which of course is always subject to change.

To my eyes, bitrates in the 30's do make a visible difference, based on recent Fox and Disney releases. My recollection is that Fifth Element Remastered also had bitrates in the 30's and I believed that this was a good part of what made that title so pleasing visually.

Is there no possibility of using a second disc for special features more often? The only case I can recall where SPE has done this is SM3.

[cjamescook]

Originally Posted by Alan Gordon

...I just read your post regarding "A Few Good Men" and "Seven Years In Tibet" being low sellers yesterday. A big surprise too considering both films have been available in BOGOs before. While I have no interest in SYIT, ...
~Alan

I was unfamiliar with Seven Years In Tibet, but picked it up at a BOGO purely on the recommendations of folks here (probably Penton). See? This forum does have some influence.

I also pre-ordered A Passage to India though that was because I had seen it theatrically. As I recall, a reviewer at the time of it original release noted the gorgious cinematography by Director David Lean (who was in his 70s) really showed up the (much) younger usual directors.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by patrick99

Thanks for the response.

I wasn't looking for something cast in concrete, just a description of current thinking, which of course is always subject to change.

To my eyes, bitrates in the 30's do make a visible difference, based on recent Fox and Disney releases. My recollection is that Fifth Element Remastered also had bitrates in the 30's and I believed that this was a good part of what made that title so pleasing visually.

Is there no possibility of using a second disc for special features more often? The only case I can recall where SPE has done this is SM3.

There is always a possibility, but it will depend on many factors.

I am glad you are a Blu-ray fan, because with HD-DVD, the ceiling is 30.

[cjamescook]

Sir Geek-

Not to beat this film title to death, but concerning Across the Universe:

- I'm sure picture quality is wonderful

- I would like to (politely) note that I would have loved to see earlier cuts of this film. Penton (and probably Hollywood) indicated it went through a number of edits. I'm not sure how many of the edits were for reduced running time as they were for content, but as this is I would classify as an "art film", I would have loved to see and understand the earlier edits.

In this case, while seamless edits might have been put to good use, if the edits were many and small, it might have been a good idea to offer the viewer the option of choosing seamless vs. pauses (and hit continue) at each edit point.

So, to end this with a question, is there a reason you can share why seamless edits of discarded material (or even bonus tracks) were not offered? Reviews have noted only one or two minor deleted bonus scenes, but I thought there would be much more.

Thanks in advance,
-Jim

[FourToedStatue]

The low performing catalog titles is an unfortunate situation. Did the same thing happen when DVD was first introduced? Would increasing the price of catalog titles work as a solution? I'd rather pay a premium for the old titles than see Sony and other studios lessen their output (even temporarily)

[jason_grumpy]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

I asked about this when it first came up and there was some sort of rationale for the change. I honestly can't remember what it was.

Would you mind running a poll to see if there is a strong preference overall for the old system? That may have greater impact on making a change back, than me bringing it up alone.

I don't mind at all paid. I'll set up the poll when I get home from work.

Thank you in advance for your attention to this.

[Objectivity]

Originally Posted by paidgeek

But yes, average bitrates in the 20's are sufficient for the codecs currently in use. We can go for 30 something when a project permits, but the quality / bit rate curve flattens to nothing up there. What I would really like it 100 or 200 Mbps for a max rate as this would have real benefits on occasion.

Could you share what you think those occasions might be? I'm curious.

Also, since things seem to be getting a bit nitpicky and defensive, I just wanted to say thank you for all you do here.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by mhafner

That is incorrect. The best possible 2K or 1080p is derived from > 2K sources by digital decimation. Direct scanning to 2K or 1080p with a sensor with 2K or 1080p resolution is NOT optimal.

On reflection, my earlier response is unnecessarily sarcastic.

For a digital system where a filter is included, I agree that oversampling produces the optimum result, the higher the sampling frequency the better, so long as sample accuracy does not suffer.

What I take issue with in your post is the theory that a 1080p image that is displayed at 1080p where no filter was present in the signal processing chain will produce a less accurate result than using oversampling/filtering. When you have a digital system with a single pixel of information being carried from capture to display, then filter theory does not apply because... wait for it... there are no filters.

It does make sense to archive at the highest possible resolution since you don't know how future systems with associated filtering requirements will use the archive.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by Objectivity

Could you share what you think those occasions might be? I'm curious.

Also, since things seem to be getting a bit nitpicky and defensive, I just wanted to say thank you for all you do here.

If a title is a bit too demanding for BD25, but there is not much added value to fill a BD50, there is no reason not to let the dogs run...

Thanks for your comments. I appreciate the dialog in these threads, we get a chance to make better products for having the feedback.

[paidgeek]

Originally Posted by JackBauer24

The low performing catalog titles is an unfortunate situation. Did the same thing happen when DVD was first introduced? Would increasing the price of catalog titles work as a solution? I'd rather pay a premium for the old titles than see Sony and other studios lessen their output (even temporarily)

I don't remember what happened on initial catalog DVD sales and I was deeply entrenched in the technical end of that business at the time. It was a different world though because consumers had a different perception about pricing/value and the leap to a disc format had many advantages over VHS.