Back to the Future Trilogy 4K UHD (1985-1990)

[The Edge]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

Those of us who grew up in the 80s and remember how bad the home-viewing experience was during the VHS era, are easily pleased.

...I’m actually proud of that.

I don’t remember the home-viewing on VHS experience being bad, aside from the fact that it was VHS. Please elaborate on what you’re talking about.

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by The Edge

I don’t remember the VHS experience being bad, aside from the fact that it was VHS. Please elaborate on what you’re talking about.

Compared to Blu-ray?

...are you being serious?

[The Edge]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

Compared to Blu-ray?

...are you being serious?

Yes. Was the color timing off? Were there such things as DNR or EE back then? When you were watching the tape in the 80’s were you complaining about how bad the transfer was? I’m only asking because I don’t remember what it was like on the format. I don’t even remember seeing any flaws on the transfer. I haven’t touched a VHS since I went to DVDs, not that I was bitter about the VHS experience to begin with.

[The Edge]

Basically speaking, did Universal screw up the VHS transfer back then too?

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by The Edge

Yes. Was the color timing off? Were there such things as DNR or EE back then? When you were watching the tape in the 80’s were you complaining about how bad the transfer was? I’m only asking because I don’t remember what it was like on the format. I don’t even remember seeing any flaws on the transfer. I haven’t touched a VHS since I went to DVDs, not that I was bitter about the VHS experience to begin with.

Are you actually suggesting that PQ in the HD era is not dramatically better than the VHS era?

...regardless of things like dnr, ee etc.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

Those of us who grew up in the 80s and remember how bad the home-viewing experience was during the VHS era, are easily pleased.

We understand just how spoiled the HD generation viewers really are.

...I’m actually proud of that.

Speak for yourself. I was born in 1980 so VHS was all I knew for many years, and as it was so rubbish I've been searching for the latest and greatest thing ever since. I'm the diametric opposite of easily pleased but then I seem to be the odd one out as there are so many of you "proud" types saying the exact same thing, wearing "Ah remember the olden days" like a badge of honour. Well, I remember the olden days of home video too...and they were shit.

[Ray Jackson]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Speak for yourself. I was born in 1980 so VHS was all I knew for many years, and as it was so rubbish I've been searching for the latest and greatest thing ever since. I'm the diametric opposite of easily pleased but then I seem to be the odd one out as there are so many of you "proud" types saying the exact same thing, wearing "Ah remember the olden days" like a badge of honour. Well, I remember the olden days of home video too...and they were shit.

That’s EXACTLY my point.

Which is why I don’t get easily frustrated with current HD transfers.

...because even the bad ones are dramatically superior to the ones I grew up watching.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

That’s EXACTLY my point.

Which is why I don’t get easily frustrated with current HD transfers.

...because even the bad ones are dramatically superior to the ones I grew up watching.

I know what your point is. My point is that this "eh, it's good enough" attitude just gives the studios license to put out mediocrity on a consistent basis, when the whole point of something being on the best of the best of the best format like 4K UHD is that it, y'know, is the best it can be (within the confines of the creative intent). If it's still got shortcomings like the twin devils of DNR and EE, which can be easily avoided as long as the people doing the mastering have any semblance of taste, or poor compression which can be easily avoided if using an authoring house that doesn't phone it in, then it rightly deserves to be called out, not lauded just because it's the best it ever looked vs a janky old tape format that literally degraded before my eyes every time I watched it.

[steel_breeze]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Speak for yourself. I was born in 1980 so VHS was all I knew for many years, and as it was so rubbish I've been searching for the latest and greatest thing ever since. I'm the diametric opposite of easily pleased but then I seem to be the odd one out as there are so many of you "proud" types saying the exact same thing, wearing "Ah remember the olden days" like a badge of honour. Well, I remember the olden days of home video too...and they were shit.

That's interesting; I relate! But I feel like I'm forever chasing the euphoria of the LaserDisc days. And here's what I mean by that: not that Blu-ray and UHD aren't wayyyyyy better than standard-def LaserDisc (they are), but I'm forever searching -- and sometimes finding -- the equivalent awesomeness on my current home theater's 92-inch projection screen of the "wow" I used to feel watching letterboxed LaserDisc movies back in '93 on my li'l 32-inch CRT television. Man, that setup was a REVELATION after the pan-n-scan awfulness of VHS. I felt like: "this is IT; I actually OWN these friggin' movies"

NOTE: This post is intended to be tongue-n-cheek. Obviously, the experiences we can now enjoy are RIDICULOUSLY better than those olde timey LaserDisc days. It's a "feeling" I was trying to capture; not a technical reality.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by steel_breeze

I feel like I'm forever chasing the euphoria of the LaserDisc days. And here's what I mean by that: not that Blu-ray and UHD aren't wayyyyyy better than standard-def LaserDisc (they are), but I'm forever searching -- and sometimes finding -- the equivalent awesomeness on my current home theater's 92-inch projection screen of the "wow" I used to feel watching letterboxed LaserDisc movies back in '93 on my li'l 32-inch CRT television. Man, that setup was a REVELATION after the pan-n-scan awfulness of VHS. I felt like: "this is IT; I actually OWN these friggin' movies"

NOTE: This post is intended to be tongue-n-cheek. Obviously, the experiences we can now enjoy are RIDICULOUSLY better than those olde timey LaserDisc days. It's a "feeling" I was trying to capture; not a technical reality.

That's the thing though, I'm one of those weirdos who puts most nostalgic feelings aside when watching whatever latest transfer of whatever movie. If people think that I'm in some way ungrateful for everything we have now then I can assure them that's not the case, but when I'm on (up to) the 8th distinct format for whatever movie - and probably the last physical media release on 4K UHD, even the BDA's own spec actually admits this! - then I will not be shamed for taking an interest in having it look as good as it can be, rather than taking a permanent stance of being thankful for mediocrity.

That said, I do actually have my own tolerances for some stuff and I've happily sat through some discs that would make other people hurl

[The Edge]

Originally Posted by Ray Jackson

Are you actually suggesting that PQ in the HD era is not dramatically better than the VHS era?

...regardless of things like dnr, ee etc.

No, I was asking (and I will ask again) did Universal screw up the VHS transfer too?

[Poya]

Originally Posted by The Edge

No, I was asking (and I will ask again) did Universal screw up the VHS transfer too?

At this point, who knows?

[motorheadache95]

I just feel like the standards were a bit different back then, even just 10 years ago. During the DVD era the Lowry process was considered the gold standard, and even going into Blu-Ray the idea was still making movies look as "clean" as possible, or the so-called "window effect" that reviewers used to talk about. I remember the BttF Blu-Ray set getting fairly high-marks at the time, and I'm sure it looked pretty good on people's 40-50" plasma and LCD TV's back in 2010. But even then I remember more and more people wising up to DNR and pointing out that the transfers were too filtered, especially Part III if I remember correctly.

Anyway, going back to Gale, he says he saw it projected. I wonder if they literally projected the Blu-Ray, or the screening he went to was the remaster before they transferred it to Blu-Ray with the additional processing.

[motorheadache95]

Originally Posted by The Edge

No, I was asking (and I will ask again) did Universal screw up the VHS transfer too?

I don't recall any problems with BttF on VHS. I can't speak for enthusiasts, but back then I don't really think many people thought of it that way. Basically having a good VHS "transfer" was having a tape in good shape that wasn't too old and played without the picture and sound degrading and fuzzing in and out. When I was younger, a huge "upgrade" was replacing a cruddy recording of a movie off of TV (probably on slow-speed and taped over other content a few times) to a new factory-made VHS copy.

[Noremac Mij]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I know what your point is. My point is that this "eh, it's good enough" attitude just gives the studios license to put out mediocrity on a consistent basis, when the whole point of something being on the best of the best of the best format like 4K UHD is that it, y'know, is the best it can be (within the confines of the creative intent). If it's still got shortcomings like the twin devils of DNR and EE, which can be easily avoided as long as the people doing the mastering have any semblance of taste, or poor compression which can be easily avoided if using an authoring house that doesn't phone it in, then it rightly deserves to be called out, not lauded just because it's the best it ever looked vs a janky old tape format that literally degraded before my eyes every time I watched it.

Colours trump everything. If they get that right, then I would gladly take NR over EE or sharpening. Those are the true evils of home video. Softer picture doesn’t bother me at all. If anything, it makes it more like a film theatrical experience. Grain is practically invisible in a medium sized auditorium. And projected film has a rather soft look to it.

[Noremac Mij]

Originally Posted by The Edge

No, I was asking (and I will ask again) did Universal screw up the VHS transfer too?

No, the old analog MCA transfers from the early 90s were fantastic.

[Moe UK]

The VHS days were different though no? Born in 77 I was a avid renter of VHS from the mid 80s through to getting my PS2. The best way to put it was, there wasn't really anything to compare it to, A TV with stereo speakers or an external hifi that you could hook it up to and a VHS player where the best you could get. If you wanted the best you went to a cinema, by the mid 90s I started going to Video games and AV consumer shows and the first time I went in a tiny dark room set up with a projector and a Lucasfilm demo laserdisc I suddenly realised what home cinema was.

Now more then ever studios need to get it perfect, those of us that are buying discs are dwindling in numbers, they are no longer catering to Joe Public excessive DNR puts of the very people you are trying to sell to. Getting colour, framing, video and audio perfect should now be the absolute minimum for a studio. Good enough isn't good enough for me to part with my money.

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

I watched a broadcast black and white TV on a 13" screen. When I got a VHS and color set, I was thrilled.

But I always embraced advancements. It's not "boy I always knew how shitty it was before" so much as "when I saw something better, I knew it and wanted it".

Nowadays, I'm cringe a little when I go back to watch something that I only have the DVD for, but when I am watching it, it's LOADS better than VHS. But I know that now more than I knew it then.

None of that is any excuse for them screwin' the pooch on upgrading a film to 4K UHD, especially a classic like BttF.

I have no problems at all calling them out when they don't do their best on something like this. They may sell tons of big 4K screens to any yahoo that goes to the Best Buy on Black Friday, but we're the ones keeping this still-niche market going. They KNOW that we're keeping them on their toes and should fully expect us to take them to task when they fall down.

[nick4Knight]

The VHS days? Hell that was about the movies themselves only where my joy came. In that light it's easy to be nostalgic. I wasn't ever thinking about how good is this transfer. Am I missing the image... etc. Having rented most what I watched I'm sure it was pan and scan for a lot of blockbuster copies. I recall many of my own VHS with the widescreen banner up top. But I didn't ever specifically seek it out or know it's importance at the time. I never got Laserdisc so that could explain why DVD was the first time being bit with the enthusiast bug but I knew the quality wasn't quite there to invest in it and better would come along.

[MEB]

Well, if these 4K discs are coming in October, then probably on October 20. Back To The Future Day is Oct 21 but that’s a Wednesday.

Mark