Halloween 4K UHD (1978)

[crutzulee]

Originally Posted by JCRW82

Agreed, Atmos isn't really going to be a big difference maker for a movie like Halloween. The only things I can see used in the Atmos realm would be effects like crickets, thunderstorm noises and maybe some sections where the synth score takes over (and that will be tricky to accomplish unless they have all 16 multitrack stems available that were used to create the 1999 surround mix). This movie is really a front channel driven presentation and nothing wrong with that in this case.

Saying that it would be difficult to produce an immersive mix and saying that movie like Halloween would not benefit from one are two very different things.

I get that the unfiltered mono is the holy grail here but we are far away from the early days of remastering mono and stereo tracks to surround. In the beginning, there was a lot of whizz bang whilly nilly arbitrary placement of sound (with dialogue bleeding through to the rears) and don't get me started with early processors and their ridiculous DSP modes!

But we are a long way from there. Horror movie like Halloween can benefit the most from judicious remastering to a more immersive experience. Michael's flatulence aside, you gave some of the best examples in your post.

The problem with this title in past efforts has been because of a heavy handed approach and instances of missing or replaced foly effects.

A revisiting of the original tracks with a more subtle hand can produce, IMHO, a BETTER experience than the original mono. In not just talking rain, lightning and crickets coming from all points within your room. Proper use of the height channels can have an amazing "wall of sound" effect on a movies score when properly blended with the front LCR channels. There's no point debating it. Once you've heard what I'm speaking about on a properly calibrated system, you'd be a convert.

Am I holding out much hope for such a transformation here? Not really.. not when they can't even give you guys the unfiltered mono you so fervently clamour for... but it IS possible, and one can hold out hope.

[KubrickKurasawa]

NEW Atmos track guys Brittany makes that look.


Maybe it will be the one to change my mind about Atmos

[JackForrester]

Originally Posted by bobbyh64

I’ve always loved the part where Tommy looks out the window and sees The Shape carrying Annie’s body while we hear those sound effects from Forbidden Planet on the TV. It’s creepy and almost seems like it was audio that was designed specifically for that shot. It just goes so well with the visuals.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mujd...ature=youtu.be

I get goosebumps every time. Just terrific.

Weren't they watching The Thing tho?

[JCRW82]

Originally Posted by crutzulee

Saying that it would be difficult to produce an immersive mix and saying that movie like Halloween would not benefit from one are two very different things.

I get that the unfiltered mono is the holy grail here but we are far away from the early days of remastering mono and stereo tracks to surround. In the beginning, there was a lot of whizz bang whilly nilly arbitrary placement of sound (with dialogue bleeding through to the rears) and don't get me started with early processors and their ridiculous DSP modes!

But we are a long way from there. Horror movie like Halloween can benefit the most from judicious remastering to a more immersive experience. Michael's flatulence aside, you gave some of the best examples in your post.

The problem with this title in past efforts has been because of a heavy handed approach and instances of missing or replaced foly effects.

A revisiting of the original tracks with a more subtle hand can produce, IMHO, a BETTER experience than the original mono. In not just talking rain, lightning and crickets coming from all points within your room. Proper use of the height channels can have an amazing "wall of sound" effect on a movies score when properly blended with the front LCR channels. There's no point debating it. Once you've heard what I'm speaking about on a properly calibrated system, you'd be a convert.

Am I holding out much hope for such a transformation here? Not really.. not when they can't even give you guys the unfiltered mono you so fervently clamour for... but it IS possible, and one can hold out hope.

I don't disagree with anything you have written. But you raise the main issue as to why Halloween is not going to benefit from the new Atmos Mix. They are using the exact same stems that were created in 1999 and have been used in every surround mix for this movie released from that point on. If they want to do justice to the Atmos Mix they need to go back to the original multitracks and 35mm Mag tapes and perform the work starting from scratch. That is way too costly and time consuming for Shout Factory to even consider and that is why they are going back to the processed files made by Anchor Bay and Chase Productions. If they were unwilling to pay for 1-2 days labour to run a raw transfer of the 35mm Mono mix then there's no way they are paying for months of labour to restore everything from scratch to create the reference Atmos Mix faithful to the original sources.

[crutzulee]

Originally Posted by JCRW82

I don't disagree with anything you have written. But you raise the main issue as to why Halloween is not going to benefit from the new Atmos Mix. They are using the exact same stems that were created in 1999 and have been used in every surround mix for this movie released from that point on. If they want to do justice to the Atmos Mix they need to go back to the original multitracks and 35mm Mag tapes and perform the work starting from scratch. That is way too costly and time consuming for Shout Factory to even consider and that is why they are going back to the processed files made by Anchor Bay and Chase Productions. If they were unwilling to pay for 1-2 days labour to run a raw transfer of the 35mm Mono mix then there's no way they are paying for months of labour to restore everything from scratch to create the reference Atmos Mix faithful to the original sources.

Has the EXACT wording of what they've said thus far about the ATMOS track confirmed this? While I've assumed this would be the case for the reasons both you and I have mentioned, I was holding out a small amount of hope based on some posts here mentioning a recognition on SHOUTS part of past surround track shortcomings.

[Jay H.]

Originally Posted by JackForrester

I get goosebumps every time. Just terrific.

Weren't they watching The Thing tho?

It was a double feature. The Thing was on earlier in the evening, followed by Forbidden Planet. FP is the movie that was on when Tommy looked out the window.

[JCRW82]

Originally Posted by crutzulee

Has the EXACT wording of what they've said thus far about the ATMOS track confirmed this? While I've assumed this would be the case for the reasons both you and I have mentioned, I was holding out a small amount of hope based on some posts here mentioning a recognition on SHOUTS part of past surround track shortcomings.

There has been zero word mentioned from Shout Factory on any of the audio mixes tied to Halloween, other than a confirmation that they are using the 2014 filtered mono mix. The only information that they have provided regarding Atmos mixes was tied more to Halloween 4 & 5 where they confirmed they are trying to fix issues that were on the Chase Productions remixes. I would speculate that if this is their approach to two of the films, that the same practice will be done for the remainder. The work was already done in 1999 and it was "good enough" for over 20 years, why not go back and polish them up for minimal cost?

[mad_max2000]

Well, we're 2 weeks out from release day. Anyone think we'll see orders shipped early?

Given the current replication issues many studios are seeing, I'm guessing probably not but one can dream!

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by mad_max2000

Well, we're 2 weeks out from release day. Anyone think we'll see orders shipped early?

Given the current replication issues many studios are seeing, I'm guessing probably not but one can dream!

Scream might ship it a week early.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by crutzulee

Saying that it would be difficult to produce an immersive mix and saying that movie like Halloween would not benefit from one are two very different things.

I get that the unfiltered mono is the holy grail here but we are far away from the early days of remastering mono and stereo tracks to surround. In the beginning, there was a lot of whizz bang whilly nilly arbitrary placement of sound (with dialogue bleeding through to the rears) and don't get me started with early processors and their ridiculous DSP modes!

But we are a long way from there. Horror movie like Halloween can benefit the most from judicious remastering to a more immersive experience. Michael's flatulence aside, you gave some of the best examples in your post.

The problem with this title in past efforts has been because of a heavy handed approach and instances of missing or replaced foly effects.

A revisiting of the original tracks with a more subtle hand can produce, IMHO, a BETTER experience than the original mono. In not just talking rain, lightning and crickets coming from all points within your room. Proper use of the height channels can have an amazing "wall of sound" effect on a movies score when properly blended with the front LCR channels. There's no point debating it. Once you've heard what I'm speaking about on a properly calibrated system, you'd be a convert.

Am I holding out much hope for such a transformation here? Not really.. not when they can't even give you guys the unfiltered mono you so fervently clamour for... but it IS possible, and one can hold out hope.

Again with that "BETTER" thing when it comes to remixes. So many people saying the exact same word. You're right that there's no point in debating it because how do we define "BETTER", it's a completely subjective term that means different things to different people. But hey...it's just "BETTER" and that's the fact, Jack!

[mad_max2000]

Originally Posted by DR Herbert West

Scream might ship it a week early.

Fingers crossed! I know they had issues getting "Alone in the Dark" out to people last week so not sure there'll be a similar issue with "Halloween" or if that was just a one-off.

Either way, the wait is killing me and I'm kind of done discussing the audio at this point so just anxious for it to finally get here

[DR Herbert West]

Originally Posted by mad_max2000

just anxious for it to finally get here

Same here.

[KubrickKurasawa]

I guess when Loomie shoots old Boogieman near the end the sound will travel from the front of the soundstage (in as many speakers as you have) to the back speakers in atmos (most likely unbalanced levels). (I SHOT HIMMZZ SIXXX TIMES?!?!?!!?

But in (unfiltered lossless/perfect world) Mono would travel from the center speaker with perfectly balanced levels from the center of your viewing screen with audio to the back of where the the center is directed in the room you are watching this in.

Have fun guys But seriously how is hearing that gun fire from every speaker simultaneously or with some latency added to the other speakers going to sound better than in the Mono. It just doesn't work like that. Now in todays industry with multiple camera's, angles, editing, cutting, etc. Atmos seems more believable in a mix think Bad Boys 3 helicopter finale. But on a low budget 1 camera John Carpenter film how you gonna cut/mix atmos into that single take? Haha touche

[Jope]

my ignore list has more members than AARP at this point.

[dallywhitty]

Exorcist II: The Heretic

[DR Herbert West]

Alligator II: The Mutation

[KubrickKurasawa]

Originally Posted by Jope

my ignore list has more members than AARP at this point.

You are really adding to the conversation. Hint taken.

[Geoff D]

Halloween II: Haddonfield Boogaloo

[KubrickKurasawa]

Originally Posted by DR Herbert West

Alligator II: The Mutation

[mad_max2000]

House II: The Second Story