but can it not do 48fps without doing a work around, such as the one suggested here?
Nope.
It's not in the UHD spec and even if it was, current TVs wouldn't be able to display it.
Another option is to do the old PAL speed-up, to make a smooth 50p image, but that's no good for US buyers.
I personally think that while technically possible, 3:2 pulldown in a 48fps image would be very distracting. People are more used to seeing it in more juddery 24 to 30 frames a second, but I think it would be potentially very ugly breaking up a smoother 48 with repeated frames. Maybe they've ran tests and that's why we aren't getting HFR.
^ Exactly. I find the 3:2 judder for 24p distracting enough, it'd be even worse for 48.
Basically, however way we slice it they can't fit the 48fps into a UHD-friendly version without bodging it somehow. Doing the equivalent of PAL speed up and then pitch correcting the audio is by far the simplest option but 50Hz still has such poor support in 'NTSC' territories that it could cause more trouble than it's worth.
A simple workaround would be to do something similar to 3:2 pulldown to convert the 48fps films to a 60fps standard.
They can just add a duplicate frame every fourth frame to make it 60fps and most people wouldn't notice.
I hope he's wrong about though and The Hobbit Trilogy is in HFR fake 60fps (fake as in it's actually 48fps in a 60fps container).
Another great boon would be an opened-up aspect ratio (maybe around 1.78:1 - 2.00:1), so we get to see more of the image.
Oh no way doing an abomination 48 to 60 would be horrific. Think of what that means for frames - every 4th frame would shows twice, or they fake an in-between image. Either way the result is disgusting.. Even 24p stuff being forced to 60 it intolerable. I've seen one uhd on 60p. Gemini man. It was just horrific. It was like a TV movie of the week. I watched the 3d version last weekend, and gee it was just more enjoyable. Great depth too.
I can't tolerate what so many streaming services and devices do to 24p material, forcing it to 60p. It is an abomination.
A simple workaround would be to do something similar to 3:2 pulldown to convert the 48fps films to a 60fps standard.
They can just add a duplicate frame every fourth frame to make it 60fps and most people wouldn't notice.
I hope he's wrong about though and The Hobbit Trilogy is in HFR fake 60fps (fake as in it's actually 48fps in a 60fps container).
Another great boon would be an opened-up aspect ratio (maybe around 1.78:1 - 2.00:1), so we get to see more of the image.
How do we tell Warner Bros./WETA to make The Hobbit Trilogy HFR for it’s 4K UHD release?
We can even tell them about this workaround.
That or they will tell us why they will stick to 24fps.
I was curious, but I think Dave Lee Down Under just said that the format doesn't support "that High Framerates", phrasing on his part might a weird.
And I was going to Reference Geoff cause I've saw him post about the 48fps is just not supported by UHD, even though 60fps is.
Another check in the checklist. "Will this have HFR?"
BURBANK, CA, October 8, 2020 – Warner Bros. Home Entertainment announced today that The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy, from Academy Award®-winning filmmaker Peter Jackson, will be available for the first time on 4K UHD on December 1.
From New Line Cinema and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Pictures, the two epic trilogies include the theatrical and extended versions of the six films in 4K UHD with HDR. The Hobbit Trilogy includes The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey, The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug, and The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies. The Lord of the Rings Trilogy includes The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring, The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers, and The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King, which won Academy Awards® for Best Picture, Best Director, and Best Adapted Screenplay. Both trilogies will also include Digital copies of both versions of each film.
Both Trilogies feature the theatrical and extended versions of the six Middle-earth films in 4K resolution with High Dynamic Range (HDR)
Six-film “Middle-earth” Ultimate Collectors’ Edition with new Bonus Content to be released in 4K UHD in Summer 2021
The Lord of the Rings Trilogy Remastered Blu-ray™ to be released in 4K UHD in fourth Quarter 2021 to celebrate 20th anniversary of The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring
4K Ultra HD** showcases 4K resolution with High Dynamic Range (HDR) and a wider color spectrum, offering consumers brighter, deeper, and more lifelike colors for a home entertainment viewing experience like never before.
The 4K remastering process was overseen by Peter Jackson.
In addition, it was also announced that a 4K UHD “Middle-earth” Ultimate Collectors’ Edition featuring the theatrical and extended versions of all six films, along with new bonus content, previously released Blu-ray discs of The Hobbit Trilogy, and remastered Blu-ray discs of The Lord of the Rings Trilogy will be released in the summer of 2021. The Lord of the Rings Trilogy featuring remastered Blu-ray discs of the theatrical and extended versions of the 3 films will also be released in the fourth quarter 2021, to celebrate the 20th anniversary of The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring.
The 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray discs of The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy will feature Dolby VisionTM HDR that dramatically expands the color palette and contrast range and uses dynamic metadata to automatically optimize the picture for every screen, frame by frame. The 4K Ultra HD Blu-ray discs of The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy will also feature a Dolby Atmos® soundtrack remixed specifically for the home theater environment to place and move audio anywhere in the room, including overhead. To experience Dolby Atmos at home, a Dolby Atmos enabled AV receiver and additional speakers are required, or a Dolby Atmos enabled sound bar. Dolby Atmos soundtracks are also fully backward compatible with traditional audio configurations and legacy home entertainment equipment.
The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy will be available on 4K Ultra HD for $89.99 Expected Retail Price.
Fans can also own The Hobbit Trilogy and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy in 4K UHD via purchase from select digital retailers beginning on December 1st.
BASICS
PRODUCT ERP
The Hobbit Trilogy Ultra HD Blu-ray $89.99
The Lord of the Rings Trilogy Ultra HD Blu-ray $89.99
Street Date: December 1st, 2020
Ultra HD Blu-ray Languages: English, French, Spanish (Extended Editions), English, Spanish (Theatrical versions)
Ultra HD Blu-ray Subtitles: English SDH, French, Spanish
Rating: All films rated PG-13 except for The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies – Extended Edition, which is Rated R for violence
DOLBY ATMOS-TrueHD [CC]
The Credits
About Warner Bros. Home Entertainment, Inc.
Warner Bros. Home Entertainment (WBHE) brings together Warner Bros. Entertainment’s home video, digital distribution and interactive entertainment businesses in order to maximize current and next-generation distribution scenarios. An industry leader since its inception, WBHE oversees the global distribution of content through packaged goods (Blu-ray Disc™ and DVD) and digital media in the form of electronic sell-through and video-on-demand via cable, satellite, online and mobile channels, and is a significant developer and publisher for console and online video game titles worldwide. WBHE distributes its product through third party retail partners and licensees.
Sigh... It looks pretty official now, no HFR. I was holding out hope. The whole situation with UHD is just so disappointing to me. Between the lack of 3D, limited frame rate support, and that multi year HDR format war, it's pretty clear that UHD was rushed out and under baked. That wouldn't be so disappointing if it wasn't for the very real possibility that UHD is the last physical format. DVD and Blu-ray weren't perfect either, if UHD was simply another step in the line I could just wait for things to improve. Hopefully as digital releases take over some rights of ownership will develop, because it looks like that's my only hope for seeing this in HFR one day.
Oh no way doing an abomination 48 to 60 would be horrific. Think of what that means for frames - every 4th frame would shows twice, or they fake an in-between image. Either way the result is disgusting.. Even 24p stuff being forced to 60 it intolerable. I've seen one uhd on 60p. Gemini man. It was just horrific. It was like a TV movie of the week. I watched the 3d version last weekend, and gee it was just more enjoyable. Great depth too.
I can't tolerate what so many streaming services and devices do to 24p material, forcing it to 60p. It is an abomination.
Ummm.... Gemini Man isn't an upconvert from 24fps. It was shot in 3D at 120FPS. Please check the facts first.
And looking at that marvellous 4K60 blu-ray, it definetely shows. Awful film, beautiful picture.
Ummm.... Gemini Man isn't an upconvert from 24fps. It was shot in 3D at 120FPS. Please check the facts first.
And looking at that marvellous 4K60 blu-ray, it definetely shows. Awful film, beautiful picture.
Thank you so kindly for providing me with information I already had. Who said it was upconverted? Me? No... The film looked way better at 24p 3d than 60p uhd to me. And a lot of others with the 3d. And yes, 24p nicely scales down from 120p. More to the point I'm of a fan of 60p, or at least that movie in 60p. So having Hobbit mangled into that frame rate would be a tragedy.
Sigh... It looks pretty official now, no HFR. I was holding out hope. The whole situation with UHD is just so disappointing to me. Between the lack of 3D, limited frame rate support, and that multi year HDR format war, it's pretty clear that UHD was rushed out and under baked. That wouldn't be so disappointing if it wasn't for the very real possibility that UHD is the last physical format. DVD and Blu-ray weren't perfect either, if UHD was simply another step in the line I could just wait for things to improve. Hopefully as digital releases take over some rights of ownership will develop, because it looks like that's my only hope for seeing this in HFR one day.
Limited frame rate support? UHD supports 60fps which is a perfectly viable standard. It's not exactly the format's fault it doesn't support the 48 fps Hobbit movies. 48 FPS never took off at all. No other movies were ever shot in 48 FPS. Yes the format has some flaws but this is not one of them.
Even so, the more action-oriented flava of the Hobbitses fits with the more whimsical tone of the story to me, and I love that barrels set piece. They included Tauriel to give female viewers the kick-ass heroine they were denied when Arwen's role in LOTR was scaled back to basically being a wet blanket, although they did undermine the grrl powah angle by giving her that soppy love triangle, yes.
Poor Evangeline Lily took the role with the initial promise of the filmmakers that she would not be in another love triangle, but was sorely disappointed when the studio forced exactly that at the very last minute. The "romance" with Kili is a nonstarter and Legolas isn't much better. Easily one of the worst things about DoS and BotFA. An Unexpected Journey is the best of them for me, as I said before, because it sticks closest in tone and spirit to the source, but DoS and BotFA sideline Bilbo and the dwarves so much to the point that in BotFA Bilbo is almost a glorified cameo in his own film. As such I felt nothing with his parting from the dwarves. I should have been crying almost on the level of when Boromir died in Fellowship or the whole ending of Return, but I was dry as a bone because the studio enforced changes to the films stripped those crucial relationships, that should have been front and center the whole way, of all of the time and development they needed. Such a shame and I feel for Martin Freeman because he was truly phenomenal when he was onscreen, but he tragically got less and less time as the trilogy wore on. And all of the fine actors who played the dwarves were done the dirtiest of all. I am still going to get these for sure because there are some genuinely great moments, the whole Smaug encounter with Bilbo is phenomenal, but I pull no punches when I say that I will be watching these the least. Maybe Unexpected Journey might get a good bit of replay, but compared to the incomparable LOTR? No.
I watched The Hobbit in HFR when it came out and while it was an interesting experience, I find the standard 24fps version far better to watch, so I'm please to see that will be the version we are getting in 4k.
Losing that cinematic movie look and having the soap opera effect just doesn't feel right to me, especially for big blockbuster movies like these.
It is a shame for those few people that really liked it but HFR was DOA, so I don't see them putting money into doing a HFR version. I'm actually still surprised Gemini Man got a HFR release.
I’m worried that it mentions the 2K Blu-ray of The Hobbit Trilogy in the UCE will be previously-released discs rather than new 4K remasters.
I was hoping it would have re-rendered 4K VFX and recomposited in 4K from the 5K camera sources, rather than being 4K upscales of the 2K DI.
The LOTR Trilogy will be new 4K remasters taken from the original 35mm negatives with VFX re-rendered in 4K rather than being 2K DI upscales.
The Hobbitses were never going to be rebuilt in this manner, although no-one has said anything about re-rendering the VFX for LOTR last I heard? There are 6000+ VFX shots across the three Hobbit movies and the cost of redoing those (even with the ease of the theoretical one-button Morph-O-Matic) would be astronomical, or at least well beyond any sane remastering budget allocated to a 4K remaster. Some commentators on the interweb keep harping on and on and on about how they were shot in 5K but they were finished at 2K and as the vast majority of shots contain CG then 2K they will stay.
The inclusion of the original Hobbit discs in the big bastard set is proof positive that no rebuild has been done for those. They've been regraded for HDR of course, but there's no need to issue a new SDR Blu off the back of that when the existing SDR discs already visually convey what Jackson wants them to visually convey.
The Hobbitses were never going to be rebuilt in this manner, although no-one has said anything about re-rendering the VFX for LOTR last I heard? There are 6000+ VFX shots across the three Hobbit movies and the cost of redoing those (even with the ease of the theoretical one-button Morph-O-Matic) would be astronomical, or at least well beyond any sane remastering budget allocated to a 4K remaster. Some commentators on the interweb keep harping on and on and on about how they were shot in 5K but they were finished at 2K and as the vast majority of shots contain CG then 2K they will stay.
The inclusion of the original Hobbit discs in the big bastard set is proof positive that no rebuild has been done for those. They've been regraded for HDR of course, but there's no need to issue a new SDR Blu off the back of that when the existing SDR discs already visually convey what Jackson wants them to visually convey.
They might get re-issued with the same VIDEO transfer but with the original Dolby Atmos mix.
For LOTR, idk, maybe the remastered Blu-ray will be 6.1.
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