The Hobbit Trilogy 4K UHD Extended & Theatrical (2012-2014)

[AreaFive]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

You know that digital cameras have inherent sensor noise, right?

Originally Posted by Mierzwiak

Digital Noise Reduction is not a tool used exclusively on movies shot on film.

Very true on both points. I've been a photographer for roughly seven years now. While I focus on stills, not video, I can certainly attest to the fact that noise is present even on digital cameras (particularly when shooting with higher ISO values).

Also, noise reduction is an option in both Lightroom and Photoshop for example, and is a useful tool (when used selectively, as needed) for images whether shot on film or digitally.

[AreaFive]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

The marketing? I own the discs, I love how they look and I can't express that without someone saying their bad or that I'm wrong?

I believe Geoff is perhaps referring to the marketing for digital cameras.

[Avageektwit]

Originally Posted by Mierzwiak

Digital Noise Reduction is not a tool used exclusively on movies shot on film.

Here DNR erased some of the snow, which is a common thing for shots with small, moving objects:
https://caps-a-holic.com/c.php?a=2&x...2&l=0&i=5&go=1

I don't need to look at a screencap for any reference. I own the discs and watching it on a calibrated OLED is a more reliable reference.

[Avageektwit]

Originally Posted by AreaFive

I believe Geoff is perhaps referring to the marketing for digital cameras.

Ok. Well, maybe I am brainwashed....No I'm not.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by AreaFive

I believe Geoff is perhaps referring to the marketing for digital cameras.

No, I meant the 4K spiel w/ref to the LOTR and Hobbit UHDs. The 4K rebuild thing is complete and utter nonsense. Not that people can't enjoy themselves with them, I have, but the gullibility/naïveté of some folks is astounding.

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

The marketing? I own the discs, I love how they look and I can't express that without someone saying their bad or that I'm wrong?

You can express that, just as people who think they're not God's gift to home video are also permitted to express that.

[Mierzwiak]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

I don't need to look at a screencap for any reference. I own the discs and watching it on a calibrated OLED is a more reliable reference.

Of course you don't need to, but switching between the screenshots is the only objective method of seeing the results of DNR and snow erased by it is a clear proof.

Or maybe you remember every single snowflake from Blu-ray so you know that nothing is missing on UHD?

[James Freeman]

I do see more detail in the Hobbit that edge enhancement could not 'reconstruct' ie this rope: Caps
But at the same time there is a lot of missing texture detail.

My explanation is they downscaled the original 4:4:4 2K DI from 2048x858 (digital cinema 2.39:1 resolution) to 1920x800 for the HD blu-ray release, loosing some detail, and of course chroma/color detail is quartered in 4:2:0 encoding too.
For this 4k release they upscaled the original 2k DI to 4k with some DNR and EE, so more luma and chroma resolution is preserved after encoding from the original 2k DI master like with LOTR.

In all honesty, it does look good when I'm not scrutinizing pixels, but I also think they overdone the DNR and EE during the "4k restoration" for me to call this release a reference 2k upscale.

Toss the DNR and EE and you have a beautiful reference 2k upscale form the original Digital Cinema master, how these movies should have been released in the first place.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

I do see more detail in the Hobbit that edge enhancement could not 'reconstruct' ie this rope: Caps
But at the same time there is a lot of missing texture detail.

My explanation is they downscaled the original 4:4:4 2K DI from 2048x858 (digital cinema 2.39:1 resolution) to 1920x800 for the HD blu-ray release, loosing some detail, and of course chroma/color detail is halved in 4:2:0 encoding too.
For this 4k release they upscaled the original 2k DI to 4k with some DNR and EE, so more luma and chroma resolution is preserved after encoding from the original 2k DI master like with LOTR.

In all honesty, it does look good when I'm not scrutinizing pixels, but I also think they overdone the DNR and EE during the "4k restoration" for me to call this release a reference 2k upscale.

Toss the DNR and EE and you have a beautiful reference 2k upscale form the original Digital Cinema master, how these movies should have been released in the first place.

Chroma resolution is quartered in 4:2:0, not halved.

[jerclay]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

The movie is digitally made, there was no DNR applied to this new release

If you think the DNR cannot be applied to a digitally made film, you're in for a big surprise

[James Freeman]

Yep, sorry again.

[panasonicst60]

The pros on this 4k release may outweigh the negative for some when compared to the regular Blu-ray. Some pros for the 4k release are as follows; more details, good hdr, and a great Atmos mix.

Most(I hope) already know this but I'll reiterate it anyways. This without DNR and EE would look extremely good. I normally hate DNR more, but in this case I find the EE being the most offensive. Do know that I have my sharpness on zero

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

The movie is digitally made, there was no DNR applied to this new release

I’m lost for words!

[Pagey123]

Someone do the "Yo dog" meme using DNR as the operative word.

[Avageektwit]

Originally Posted by jerclay

If you think the DNR cannot be applied to a digitally made film, you're in for a big surprise

Still not 2kDIs

[Avageektwit]

Originally Posted by Bourne1886

I’m lost for words!

Good. Because what talking about is that they didn't apply copious DNR application specifically for this release.

[Avageektwit]

Originally Posted by Mierzwiak

Of course you don't need to, but switching between the screenshots is the only objective method of seeing the results of DNR and snow erased by it is a clear proof.

Or maybe you remember every single snowflake from Blu-ray so you know that nothing is missing on UHD?

And you remember every snowflake? That would be beyond ridiculous. Seriously, this debate over these releases is annoying as shit.

[Bourne1886]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

Good. Because what talking about is that they didn't apply copious DNR application specifically for this release.

Pardon? As Geoff said you really do believe the hype! How can you not see it? It’s there.

[jerclay]

Well, no. I don't think I'll want to watch these again. Yes, the HDR is beyond awesome, but man, this DNR and edge ehancement are killing me. I'm not a big fan of 3D, but I just happen to still have the last OLED that has 3D in a proper working condition, so I decided to give my Hobbit 3D discs a spin. And I was actually blown away at how good the 3D looked! It was very striking contrast to what I just saw on a 4K UHD - how good a digitally shot film can look if nobody effs with it. Just how I remember seeing it in 3D in cinemas... So for me, it really boils down to a simple choice - should I stick with the perfect 3D presentation or should I just take the good with the bad of the fairly flawed 4K release - sometimes good, occasionally great (give credit where credit due!), but a lot of times - just like an upscaled videogame.

[Mierzwiak]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

And you remember every snowflake?

I don't have to, that's what screenshots are for, to quickly compare shots and check if there's visible uptick in details, or if maybe something is missing, like that DNR'd, infamous ping pong ball in The Thing.

Seriously, this debate over these releases is annoying as shit.

Right? Imagine giving someone a simple proof and in response that person basically says "FU, my OLED is calibrated". Yup, super annoying.

[panasonicst60]

Originally Posted by Avageektwit

And you remember every snowflake? That would be beyond ridiculous. Seriously, this debate over these releases is annoying as shit.

No, What's annoying as shit is...