Sony introduces high-end ZD9 TV series with HDR

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by DJR662

I was under the impression the Z9D had a form of dynamic tone mapping of its own already, because of the way it analyzes the HDR picture and ignores the metadata?

No, that's nonsense peddled by Sony, I still remember the AVS interview with Scott Whatshisface and some dude from Sony who said that. It doesn't "analyse" anything, it just ignores all brightness metadata (though still heeds colour primaries so it can map 709, P3 or 2020 correctly) and sets the highlights to clip wherever the TV maxes out in terms of brightness, though this is presuming that the contrast has been set correctly re: PQ tracking.

This method maintains the correct APL which is why, if set correctly, many Sony HDR TVs don't have the kind of chronic problems with SDR-style brightness inside an HDR container that other TVs have. The knock-on effect is that you progressively lose more and more of the brightest highlights with Sony TVs that have less native luminance than the Zed, but as it kicks out ~1800 nits peak it's not a problem with the vast majority of content - though it loses a lot of colour volume the nearer it gets to that sort of brightness.

But for content up to and including 1000 nits peak then it can show them "1:1" without any mapping at all, thankfully it's got DV to handle any extreme >1000-nit content encoded as such and the Panasonic Optimiser has been very handy for taming exactly those sorts of Light Cannon™ Sony HDR10 grades shown above.

Sony have since developed their own genuine DTM system though, it's been on their higher end sets for a good couple of years already. It still clips a wee bit according to what I remember from Vincent Teoh demonstrating in one Sony TV review or another, this is to maintain that ethos of preserving APL, but overall it seems to work well.

[Auditor55]

Originally Posted by Nothing371

Must feel good to be a Z9D owner in 2020.

I'm still happy with my mini-Z9.

What's a mini-Z9

[Auditor55]

Originally Posted by DJR662

It has felt good for the past 3/4 years and I think it will continue to do so in the foreseeable future.

Why do you believe that?

[Auditor55]

Originally Posted by Filmfan73

With the exception of 3D, I hope Sony makes a model as close as possible to this one(better?). I love the TV, and can't think of another model of any type I could possibly want to take the place of it...if something were to happen to it.

Z9D was a good TV. However when I had mine, the 3D was a no go. The 3D was much better on my Panasonic VT60 Plasma. Also, the viewing angles were very narrow.

[DJR662]

Originally Posted by Auditor55

What's a mini-Z9

The Sony X930E, which basically uses an edge LED version of the Z9D's BMD (Slim Backlight Drive) and can get quite bright too.

Originally Posted by Auditor55

Why do you believe that?

I don't expect a Sony Mini or MicroLED anytime soon, so no need to upgrade from my Z9Ds.

Originally Posted by Auditor55

Z9D was a good TV. However when I had mine, the 3D was a no go. The 3D was much better on my Panasonic VT60 Plasma. Also, the viewing angles were very narrow.

3D on the Z9D is indeed a bit shaky, although it depends on the title being watched. Also, the 3D on the 75" model suffers less from issues seen on the 65" model.

The Z9D has the most narrow viewing angles I have ever seen on an LCD, but it never was a problem for me (especially considering for what you get in return ).

[JimShaw]

Originally Posted by DJR662

The Z9D has the most narrow viewing angles I have ever seen on an LCD, but it never was a problem for me (especially considering for what you get in return ).

Same with me


.

[LettuceJUMP]

Originally Posted by DJR662

With all due respect to the XF900 (which is a fine TV by itself), but no other Sony set (including the Z9G) has topped the Z9D, so that basically means the peak has halted in 2016.

Out of curiosity, what is it you don't like about the XF900?

Coming from a LG OLED B6" 65", I wanted to increase in size and went for the 75" x900F. But I feel when I increased the picture, I lost some of the wow factor that the LG had with regards to watching UHD's with HDR. Many claim the Z9D (and Z9G), their top line LED is a bit more impressive with regards to watching UHD's for their crispness, colors, motion and HDR.

[Robert Zohn]

@LettuceJUMP, I now feel your best upgrade choice is Sony's 77" A9G or LG's 77" CX or GX series OLED TV.

[LettuceJUMP]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

@LettuceJUMP, I now feel your best upgrade choice is Sony's 77" A9G or LG's 77" CX or GX series OLED TV.

I think you're right, but don't want to rule anything out just yet!

[Robert Zohn]

If you can wait for things to get back to normal I'd love for you to stop by our showroom to see all of these beautiful TVs on display.

[Nothing371]

Originally Posted by DJR662

The Sony X930E, which basically uses an edge LED version of the Z9D's BMD (Slim Backlight Drive) and can get quite bright too.



I don't expect a Sony Mini or MicroLED anytime soon, so no need to upgrade from my Z9Ds.



3D on the Z9D is indeed a bit shaky, although it depends on the title being watched. Also, the 3D on the 75" model suffers less from issues seen on the 65" model.

The Z9D has the most narrow viewing angles I have ever seen on an LCD, but it never was a problem for me (especially considering for what you get in return ).

I've never understood the viewing angle gripe. It makes no sense to me in the least. Why would someone ever be watching TV at a > 45 deegee offset. As if they hang their TVs on the long wall of a hallway or something.

[DJR662]

Originally Posted by Nothing371

I've never understood the viewing angle gripe. It makes no sense to me in the least. Why would someone ever be watching TV at a > 45 deegee offset. As if they hang their TVs on the long wall of a hallway or something.

It's not an issue for me personally, I have always sit dead center anyway long before I got a Z9D.

But in all honesty though, I could see a problem with having a large crowd gathering in front of one (that is, if those people at the sides would care or even notice at all ). The colors and contrast do shift in a noticable way if you start sitting at an angle, more so I think than on any previous Sony FALD sets I have owned. I think it has something to do with the way light is being spread through the narrow viewing cones of the Z9D's LEDs themselves?

But like I said, it's a small price to pay (to the point of being a total non issue for me) for what you get in return. Besides, there's no way in hell I would want to sacrifice an ounce of contrast/black level in favor of being able to sit at a wider angle. I'll take those narrow viewing angles anyday of the week then, just gimme my BMD.

[Robert Zohn]

Just a few comments on the off axis viewing issue with LCD VA panels. First, we're discussing VA panels without the new X-Wide features some of the TV brands have added.

For VA displays the % of off axis image degradation is a physics formula that is based on the screen size and the viewing distance. The larger the screen and the further back you sit will give you a more off axis benefit before you see any changes in the image performance. Using Sony's excellent Z9D for this example, if you have the 75" Z9D and sit 10' from the screen you can be up to 25 degrees off the center of the screen before the picture gets effected enough to be bothered by the image degrading.

The effects of viewing of axis are a dimming of the luminance and colors shift.

Hope this helps to further explain this discussion.

[Geoff D]

I do not want or need a TV with XWA though

[edit]
But I do think the manufacturers are missing a trick when it comes to all this wide angle stuff though, as combining an IPS panel with a proper individually dimmed FALD backlight seems like the most obvious solution. I mean all LCD panels are inherently shit for blacks, it's just that VA is a little bit less shit than IPS which is why VA is so common in the higher end sets, but when combined with the kind of backlight coverage AND per-zone control that the ZD9 has then even IPS would render the sort of stunning black and contrast that I see on the ZD9 along with a wider (if still not perfect) viewing angle.

Trouble is, no-one wants to do this kind of intense development on regular LCD backlights any more, that Sony have not improved on the ZD9 in that respect after five full years of further development is such a shame because the bones are already there, it just needs a bit more tweaking. Instead Sony go back to a much more limited number of zones with no per-zone control, and then tells anyone who wants better blacks to go and buy an OLED. Arseh0les.

[Robert Zohn]

We agree as does all video enthusiasts!

Somehow with the wisdom of the TV manufacturers they feel that the general public needs outweighs the actual buyers preferences that make up the bulk of the consumers that shop for these premium TVs matters.

[chip75]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

I do not want or need a TV with XWA though .

I'm not sure the gains of XWA are worth the loses if you're selling Light Cannons.

Although my last SONY TV's viewing angle was so bad you be sitting in front of the screen and literally move your head a few inches and watch the colour and luminance drain from the screen.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

We agree as does all video enthusiasts!

Somehow with the wisdom of the TV manufacturers they feel that the general public needs outweighs the actual buyers preferences that make up the bulk of the consumers that shop for these premium TVs matters.

Exactly. If you're selling a TV for several thousand dollarpounds then by definition it's not aimed at mom and pop who need to keep their brood entertained with the Tellybellies playing on a loop.

[pbz06]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

We agree as does all video enthusiasts!

Somehow with the wisdom of the TV manufacturers they feel that the general public needs outweighs the actual buyers preferences that make up the bulk of the consumers that shop for these premium TVs matters.

Me to my friend: I just got a premium 77" TV for $5k.

Friend to me: What? You're an idiot, Costco is having a sale for 85" TV's for $599.

=X

[Scottishguy]

Originally Posted by pbz06

Me to my friend: I just got a premium 77" TV for $5k.

Friend to me: What? You're an idiot, Costco is having a sale for 85" TV's for $599.

=X

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRKz...ature=youtu.be

[chip75]

Originally Posted by pbz06

Friend to me: What? You're an idiot, Costco is having a sale for 85" TV's for $599.

Are those the Costco specials that have better in-the-box picture than out-of?