4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by slimdude

This is unsubstantial because, how can anybody compare 4K streaming content, to a native 4K blu-ray, when native 4K blu-rays are not even released yet?

There are two types of 4K content right now: streaming and downloads. Downloads have much better quality and is about 4 times the bitrate as streaming. In other words, Sony 4k Unlimited (downloads) >>> Netflix 4K. However Netflix 4k is significanly better than Netflix 1080p, and is about equal to Blu-ray. But Sony 4K is noticeably better than Blu-ray, particularly in scenes with lots of small detail. You just have to sit close enough to appreciate it, because the only improvement in PQ is the resolution.

[slimdude]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

There are two types of 4K content right now: streaming and downloads. Downloads have much better quality and is about 4 times the bitrate as streaming. In other words, Sony 4k Unlimited (downloads) >>> Netflix 4K. However Netflix 4k is significanly better than Netflix 1080p, and is about equal to Blu-ray. But Sony 4K is noticeably better than Blu-ray, particularly in scenes with lots of small detail. You just have to sit close enough to appreciate it, because the only improvement in PQ is the resolution.

Everybody is jumping the gun here....Regardless, no one still haven't seen a native 4K blu-ray, to compare it to anything. That's like comparing a 2015 vehicle, to a future 2017 vehicle when they're not even manufactured yet! So therefore, no one really know how the native 4K blu-rays will look, until they are released on the market, and be compared to other 4K content. UHDTV owners, are so hungry and desperate for any 4K content, that they'll accept any 4K content to watch on their UHDTVs.

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by slimdude

Everybody is jumping the gun here....Regardless, no one still haven't seen a native 4K blu-ray, to compare it to anything. That's like comparing a 2015 vehicle, to a future 2017 vehicle when they're not even manufactured yet! So therefore, no one really know how the native 4K blu-rays will look, until they are released on the market, and be compared to other 4K content.

Who is comparing available 4K content now to future 4K Blu-ray?

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by slimdude

This is unsubstantial because, how could anybody compare 4K streaming content, to a native 4K blu-ray, when native 4K blu-rays are not even released yet? I'm not referring to the handful of 4K mastered blu-rays, that's currently on the market!

I was talking about current 4K streaming vs 1080p Blu.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by bruceames.

But Sony 4K is noticeably better than Blu-ray, particularly in scenes with lots of small detail. You just have to sit close enough to appreciate it, because the only improvement in PQ is the resolution.

Bruce, have you been able to actually see an A/B comparison? I'm hearing the differences are rather small at best.

[HeavyHitter]

All current 4K streaming and downloading is still using rec 709 and 8 bit, correct?

IMO, 4K Blu's biggest payoffs will be wider color gamut (whether its P3/DCI or rec 2020), presumably going from current 8 bit to 10 bit to improve dynamic range, and improved compression. Greater resolution will be a nice thick icing on the cake.

[bruceames]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

Bruce, have you been able to actually see an A/B comparison? I'm hearing the differences are rather small at best.

Yes, I can do an A-B (quickly too, just switch inputs on my remote). Did it on Amazing Spider-Man 2, Bridge on the River Kwai, and Lawrence of Arabia, of which I have both Sony 4K and Blu-ray versions. Resolution-wise, the difference isn't much, and it's very scene-specific. The most noticeable differences are on city skyline shots, beach shots with crowds of people (or anywhere with lots of heads), or any shot that has lots of small objects. Sports would be another ideal backdrop. Those look very impressive and you can really see where 4K makes a difference. Even so, you have be close enough to see the difference (less than 1.5x from the display unless your vision is greater than 20/20). Most scenes though have average detail and close ups you really won't notice any difference at all.

So really Sony 4K downloads has been somewhat of a letdown, because in most scenes the difference is negligible. Netflix 4K on the other hand has been a pleasant surprise, bring streaming quality up to 1080p BLu-ray standards. I never thought I'd see that this soon. Unfortunately though their content selection is pathetically small, even smaller than Sony's, so it's not of much consequence at this point in time.

[ronjones]

I hear we can expect some more official information to be released at CES 2015 (6-9 Jan.) as to the schedule for Blu-ray UHD roll-out and perhaps even some demos with prototype Blu-ray UHD players and demo discs.

[Geoff D]

Firm news on specs would be great, tech demos would be even better (not that people who aren't at CES will get the benefit from seeing a youtube video or whatever, but at least it's proof that it exists, dammit! ).

[Esox50]

Originally Posted by ronjones

I hear we can expect some more official information to be released at CES 2015 (6-9 Jan.) as to the schedule for Blu-ray UHD roll-out and perhaps even some demos with prototype Blu-ray UHD players and demo discs.

And lets hope the studios support it and announce maybe their first wave of titles "for 4Q15, with specifics to be detailed later". Would be great if each studio named a handful of titles, or if Disney came out and said "We expect Avengers 2 to be our first 4K title". Something like that.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Esox50

And lets hope the studios support it and announce maybe their first wave of titles "for 4Q15, with specifics to be detailed later". Would be great if each studio named a handful of titles, or if Disney came out and said "We expect Avengers 2 to be our first 4K title". Something like that.

And lets hope Avengers 2 will be finished in 4K as well as other movies going forward. A lot of great movies missed the '4K finished' boat and are highly unlikely to ever be converted as it would almost be tantamount to remaking the damned movie again.

[BozQ]

Don't expect any of the MCU movies to be in 4K anytime soon. Kevin Feige wants all future productions shot with the ARRI Alexa system, to streamline the work flow and to create a consistent visual across the movies. Marvel ramping up to three movies a year means upgrading to 4K is very unlikely.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by BozQ

Don't expect any of the MCU movies to be in 4K anytime soon. Kevin Feige wants all future productions shot with the ARRI Alexa system, to streamline the work flow and to create a consistent visual across the movies. Marvel ramping up to three movies a year means upgrading to 4K is very unlikely.

Kind of old news since they started doing this with The Avengers.

[Brightstar]

Do i really need a 65inch 4k tv to benefit from 4k or can i get away with a 55inch ? whats the best size? Thank you

[Trigen]

Originally Posted by Brightstar

Do i really need a 65inch 4k tv to benefit from 4k or can i get away with a 55inch ? whats the best size? Thank you

Depends on your viewing angle / how far you sit:
http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...alculator.html

Both the 55" and 65" will have higher pixel density than your current TV, I presume.

Edit: For a 65" screen the benefits of 4k start to be apparent between 7.5' and 4' and for a 55" screen at between 7' and 3.5'. Above those values, you won't notice much difference between 2k and 4k.

[singhcr]

Originally Posted by Brightstar

Do i really need a 65inch 4k tv to benefit from 4k or can i get away with a 55inch ? whats the best size? Thank you

I would advise getting the largest TV you can afford and/or have room for, but even a 55" TV would have a benefit with 4K. Keep in mind that you can also sit a lot closer to a 4K TV than you can with a 1080p one.

The only demonstration 4K TVs that I've ever seen were in the 55" range and they looked great even when I was standing very close to it.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

And lets hope Avengers 2 will be finished in 4K as well as other movies going forward. A lot of great movies missed the '4K finished' boat and are highly unlikely to ever be converted as it would almost be tantamount to remaking the damned movie again.

I think we'll see 4K conversions if us consumers prove to have a thirst for 4K content although broadcast providers might have more of a bearing on that, as when 4K off-air starts up they can't keep broadcasting Adam Sandler movies and House of Cards all the time.

Bear in mind that even 4K finishes rarely have VFX done at that level of quality, even now, so uprezzing existing 2K VFX from the data files is fine, and as long as the camera acquisition was on film or 2.8K digital upwards then there'll be a tangible benefit to the non-CG footage too. (EDLs and colour correction data and whatnot will surely have been retained so editing the raw footage should be fairly easy once it's been uploaded.) Once one studio starts doing it and a dollar value is ascribed to the process, then others will be able to judge if it's worth doing for them.

But one thing at a time, let's get some genuine 4K content on disc first of all!

[Trent AKA DoubleDown]

I think they have hit a wall. The vast majority of people who even buy blu-rays, use streaming services, and have cable or dish are content. They are happy with the 1080P picture from blu-rays and their 720 HD broadcast appeal. The customers who bought a 4K T.V. are going to be very angry when they realize that when 4K is available, they will then realize that they only have HDMI 1.4 and can't play discs at even 18Gbps.
3D was a complete failure. Also when people find you need to sit approx. 7 feet or closer to a 65 inch set to even notice a difference in PQ there is not going to be some large demand and I predict an epic figure, at least until they stop producing 1080P sets. How many people are goung to purchase a 65 inch or larger set? Even then I see at least 5 years before a significant movement towards 4K and that is being generous.

[Dylan34]

I know studios are going to have to make and use new masters for 4K blu-ray. Most people that buy into it are going to be us, the people here on this very site and others like High Def Digest. Its not going to be Joe 6-pack at first if ever really so, quality has to be there up front right out of the gate if they expect people to spend their hard earned cash. I'm not going to spend extra money for a more expensive player and discs to have it not be native 4k, just a bunch of upconversions. Hopefully, we get quality media when launched next year.

[Trigen]

Considering the few number of people who have upgraded from Sony BR to its "Mastered in 4k" BR's, how likely are people to upgrade their collection; with the exception of a few favorite titles.

4k BR will be most beneficial for new releases; however, for older titles, I do not see the sales being strong.