"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[Tok]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

So much ridiculous hostility over a format, and once again entirely missing yet again the point that I'm making, even if it's quoted in your response. I'll not go as far as to bold out the important bits for easy reading, but simply say, humbly, that one doesn't need to obsess about or trash the competition, regardless of their misguided ways, in order to feel better about one's own position. Nor, as above, does making a video format purchasing decision make you a better person than another, no matter how much shouting goes along with it.

Many enthusiasts, that wanted a quality product, got upset when a computer software company tried to force their view of what a HD format should be. 'Good enough' was in reality not good enough for many that wanted the best. Myself I am old LD guy and I am not even 40, yet. I never thought that consumers would be able to purchase 1080p24 with lossless audio. Even if Blu was slightly flawed out of the gate it still had better raw specs that in the end meant it could deliver more. Some of the implementation needed to be ironed out and some like BD-Live still needs it to be.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Yeah, some of these people are realllly touchy, aren't they?

I'm honestly not sure why some of them are here, when it seems fairly evident they might be more excited to be out in a field in Virginia, in a kepi and a wool coat of blue or red, re-enacting The Format War. Glory, glory, hallelujah!

[bt12483]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

Yeah, some of these people are realllly touchy, aren't they?

"BLAHBLAHBLAH TOO MANY WORDS! WAIT, THERE'S A LIST! WHY NO COUNTER LIST! ARE YOU LYING! WE DID =NOTHING WRONG=!!!!! THESE PEOPLE ARE ALL LIARS! TERRORISTS!! SUICIDE BOMBERS!!!!! BRING THE PITCHFORKS!!!!! KILL!!! KILL!!! KILL!!!!!!!"

Awesome.

You guys -know- this is a home video format, one that you either buy, or you don't, right? And, most importantly, just because you -did- buy the format, and perhaps early, there's no reflected glory here...

I'll twist this one out from the screed above:

"...come here to explain why you love HDM in a Blu case yet HATE it in a Red case."

...not dislike, not have a preference for, HATE. Why point to the idiocy, intractability, and deceit of the other side without nary a smidgen of self reflectivity from the most aggressive here?

"Why so serious?"

So much ridiculous hostility over a format, and once again entirely missing yet again the point that I'm making, even if it's quoted in your response. I'll not go as far as to bold out the important bits for easy reading, but simply say, humbly, that one doesn't need to obsess about or trash the competition, regardless of their misguided ways, in order to feel better about one's own position. Nor, as above, does making a video format purchasing decision make you a better person than another, no matter how much shouting goes along with it.

More to the point - why the fark do you give a damn what others write, if it's only to provide ammo for your own, dogmatic point of view?

So, Kudos to Allan for taking the time to read and have a respecful discussion, Penton for patiently allowing this little bit of fun to go on, and the Doctor for keeping it light... Now, for those of you all riled up, go burn a village or something... It's clear I'm not going to change your minds regarding respectful discourse, no matter how my fog index tallies up.

All we want is an example to support your stance. That is all. Yet still, after all of this time, you have yet to deliver.

It is really simple.

Here: Amirm said that BD50s were science fiction and would cost $200 or more.

Clearly an insider would know that to not be true. So why did he say such a thing? Why would he intentionally lie/overexaggerate the reality of BD50s? Perhaps because his format lacked an answer to said BD50? Quite possibly.....

Now...I got the ball rolling with a known real world example....so, to support your stance (which is quickly being obfuscated with each and every post of yours) please show me where an insider from the bluray side posted such inaccurate information about HD DVD. Such an exaggerated lie. That is all we are asking.

Think of it like a tennis match. It's your turn to return my serve with another factoid that supports your stance.

It's quite simple...I believe X, because of Y.

You believe Q, because of ?????? That's what we are trying to get out of you.

[Grubert]

I again find it interesting that all some of you want is a series of bullet points that you can bat down with glee

Yeah, who needs facts when you have truthiness.

[Slec]

It's been brought up a couple times: here's how it would play out

shark gives an example or two
everyone comes out of the woodwork and attacks him
he gets labeled a 'red ant'
he tries to bring up the whole point of his originally posting this (so that people would see it wasn't as one sided as it was made out to be)
shark gets bashed some more until he eventually is banned.

he doesn't want that. he's tried to back out of this discourse a couple times and others want to argue with him. i suggest this discussion be taken to PM's if anyone is up for it being civil. shark has made it clear he is happy with blu-ray being the format still in use.

shark: stop responding to all of this. unfortunately you aren't getting anywhere with what you are attempting to do.

[Tok]

Originally Posted by Joe Cain

Straw men, shifting goalposts, blah blah blah. Respectful discourse? Obfuscation and evasion and your part: boring. You abhor specificity. No one's suggested buying ANY commodity makes one a better human; that's a non-issue. Enough is enough. Please.

Goalpost shifting It is darn right comical how Lee still continues to do it in other forums. I'll buy when X, Y and Z occur... they occur... now he wants A, B and C... they occur... then MNOP... infinite loop. All the while going on how BD is terrible and poorly implemented YET HE DOES NOT EVEN OWN A PLAYER. I still wonder if he is a real person or just a user persona developed to tweak BD supporters to get hit counts up. I quit responding to him and his followers. He has already been proven wrong that Blu was going to fail after HD DVD. I have seen more people buying Blu hardware in the last few months at my local BBs and I have not seen anyone seriously buy a VuDu or AppleTV box.

[sharkshark]

Originally Posted by Slec

shark: stop responding to all of this. unfortunately you aren't getting anywhere with what you are attempting to do.

ok....

ps. Is your sig a quote of yours? It's pretty apt.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Slec

It's been brought up a couple times: here's how it would play out

shark gives an example or two
everyone comes out of the woodwork and attacks him
he gets labeled a 'red ant'
he tries to bring up the whole point of his originally posting this (so that people would see it wasn't as one sided as it was made out to be)

Other than the "shark" bit, I'm feelin' some deja vu!

Originally Posted by Slec

shark: stop responding to all of this. unfortunately you aren't getting anywhere with what you are attempting to do.

I think I'm going to have to agree with this, at this point. A noble effort, but (as you've alluded to, yourself,) you aren't going to change any minds and no one seems any more ready to open one and step up to the plate of enlightenment.

[Grubert]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

I think I'm going to have to agree with this, at this point. A noble effort, but (as you've alluded to, yourself,) you aren't going to change any minds and no one seems any more ready to open one and step up to the plate of enlightenment.

Bringing back format smackdown, half-truths and innuendo at this stage is far, far from a noble effort. At best, it is a waste of time. At worst, it is utter trolling/baiting in disguise. And believe me, I've seen my share of that.

[Slec]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

ok....

ps. Is your sig a quote of yours? It's pretty apt.

It's something I posted in a thread a while back... made it my sig to remind me that 'the most important thing in the world to one, isn't even a mosquito bite to another'... and both sides can't comprehend that the other feels that way. so the result is the quote...

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Grubert

Bringing back format smackdown, half-truths and innuendo at this stage is far, far from a noble effort. At best, it is a waste of time. At worst, it is utter trolling/baiting in disguise. And believe me, I've seen my share of that.

As I guy who was attacked pretty mercilessly for trying to dispassionately relate some of the details sharkshark is being plied for, I'm left little option but to disagree with you about the merits of his self-defense.

However, now that I've replied to your critique of my comment, I feel, again, compelled to evoke the spirits I called upon yesterday. To wit:

What theatrical releases are folks looking forward to in the remainder of 2009?

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

I can't hear you! I can't hear you! Too many big words! Fog! Fog!

AWOOOOOOGAH!

Don't you understand, sharkshark? We're not here to read. This forum is for witty rejoinders and virtual high-fives only! So get in line or run off to one of your "thinking" places.

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Yes, this poor thread is disintegrating under the weight of a guy defending himself against dismissive posturing.

How can we possibly talk about movies NOW?!

[Slec]

Originally Posted by Slec

I'll bite (no pun intended).

Penton,
How does Hollywood view Francis Ford Coppola's latest effort Tetro? He's financing personal projects and distributing them himself. Clearly a much higher risk, but are studio's watching this to see what happens? With the economy as it is, any chance new directors and writers will be getting shots due to lower costs (albeit with some higher risk)?

Thanks,
Chris

Penton man's been busy, so i'll bump this to try and separate it from the above discourse

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

If it's an honest and open debate you're looking for, why not open up the conversation fully and actively seek out this alternate point of view?

..)

Something you are quite clearly not willing to participate in.

Provide supporting evidence to back your claims, because without it, you have typed many words, but said nothing.

[Doctorossi]

All this going in circles... I feel like I'm watching NASCAR.

Can we please change the channel? I think M.A.S.H. is on.

[Tok]

Funniest 'market research' (quotes for a reason) I have seen in a long time

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/While-....html?x=0&.v=1

Originally Posted by PR

ROCHESTER, N.Y.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--While Blu-ray was declared the big “winner” in the high definition format war last year, consumers may be slow to be part of the winning team. In fact, Americans are not jumping on board with any of the high definition DVD players. Just one in ten Americans (11%) own a HD DVD player while 7% own a Blu-ray player. Looking at the other devices for playing HD DVDs, 9% own a Sony PLAYSTATION®3 (which plays Blu-ray ) and 3% have the external HD DVD drive for the Xbox® 360 (which plays HD DVDs).

These are some of the results of The Harris Poll® of 2,401 U.S. adults surveyed online between April 13 and 21, 2009 by Harris Interactive®.

While slow to catch on, ownership of all these high definition disc players is up from May 2008. Interestingly, while Blu-ray was the clear “format war” winner over HD DVD, sales of HD DVD players (11% in 2009 vs. 6% in 2008) are up over 2008 by about the same margin as Blu-ray players (7% in 2009 vs. 4% in 2008). Both were rivaled by the Sony PLAYSTATION®3 (9% vs. 5%). However, only 3% purchased the external HD DVD drive for the Xbox® 360, up from 1% in 2008. There is no expected surge of interest pending -- only 7% of non-Blu-ray player owners report a likely purchase of a Blu-ray disc player within the next year, down from 9% in May 2008

Ownership of HDTVs

Looking at high definition television sets, almost half of consumers now report owning a high definition television (47%), up decidedly from May of 2008 (35%). HDTV ownership rises dramatically with household income (27% for those with less than $35K vs. 62% among those with more than $75K).

Are Blu-ray Player Owners Switching from Standard DVDs to Blu-ray Discs?

On average, consumers purchased approximately 6 Standard Format DVD’s in the last six months compared with 1 in HD format (HD DVD .7 vs. Blu-ray .5). However, plans to purchase Standard Format DVD’s is down by half compared to past six month purchases, while interest in HD DVD’s (.6) and Blu-ray (.7) are holding their own. Notably, HD DVD format purchases reflect the continued sales of the HD DVD players within the past year.

When Blu-ray player or PS3™ owners are asked specifically about standard versus Blu-ray format purchases, the results suggest a mixed bag of behaviors with some price sensitivity indicated:


Only one quarter plan to switch to Blu-ray completely (25%), while one third of Blu-ray or PS3 owners claim that most of their movie purchases are now on Blu-ray format (32%);
Two in five are waiting for Blu-ray format prices to come down before they buy more (43%) – and a quarter buy Blu-ray regardless of price (25%); and,
Only 1 in 5 appear to be replacing or duplicating their existing standard format DVD library with Blu-ray format (21%), and over a third say they only buy movies on Blu-ray format that they currently do not own on standard definition (37%).

So What?

In addition to financial issues that may be slowing consumer adoption, Milton Ellis, Vice President and Senior Consultant, Harris Interactive Technology, Media, and Telecom Practice added, “Blu-ray also faces competition from alternative technologies such as cable, satellite, and the Internet. Consumers today can easily watch high definition TV channels or use the Internet or video-on-demand to access high definition movies. In the near future, access to high definition movies may be a download or streaming delivery of one’s favorite movies to a home media server that eliminates the need for a Blu-ray player and Blu-ray disc. One thing is for sure, the market will be highly competitive and consumers will have a wide variety of choices for their entertainment experience.”

The Harris Poll® #63, June 18, 2009
By Joan Barten Kline, VP, Research, Business and Industry Sector, Harris Interactive

Methodology

This Harris Poll® was conducted online within the United States between April 13 and 21, 2009, among 2,401 adults (aged 18 and over). Figures for age, sex, race, education, region and household income were weighted where necessary to bring them into line with their actual proportions in the population. Propensity score weighting was also used to adjust for respondents’ propensity to be online. Full data tables and methodology are available at www.harrisinteractive.com.

These statements conform to the principles of disclosure of the National Council on Public Polls.

J35928
Q855, 860, 866, 871, 876

About Harris Interactive

Harris Interactive is a global leader in custom market research. With a long and rich history in multimodal research, powered by our science and technology, we assist clients in achieving business results. Harris Interactive serves clients globally through our North American, European and Asian offices and a network of independent market research firms. For more information, please visit www.harrisinteractive.com.

Harris Interactive Inc. 6/09


Contact:
Press:Harris InteractiveCarol Fricke, 585

Did you hear that HD DVD is installed in more homes than Blu-ray and more HD DVD discs have been sold. Obiviously the questions that were used to poll were too confusing to end with results like this. It shows the dual HD format marketplace was too confusing for the average consumer. I wonder if some polled thought that HD DVD and Blu were the same thing. They look like DVDs but they are HD, hence HD DVD. Or HD DVD and upscaled DVD were interchanged at some point in the poll.

Red-ants dust off those players you are back in the game

I wonder if the poll was given by monkeys or given to monkeys.

[ps3andlovinit]

Originally Posted by sharkshark

who has the time to read reflective posts unless they can be used as amunition to butress your own point of view?

Same can be said for those writing them... why are they *really* writing them that is.

[Doctorossi]

BOB: You know, Carl, I haven't seen Dale Jr. looking this fired up since the Winston Cup Series! He's really showing that steering wheel how to remain approximately 30* counter-clockwise from center.


CARL: Now, hold on, Bob. 'At looks like AJ Foyt slippin' up behind 'im now. And we know ol' AJ can hang a louie like nobody's bidness!

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

Hey Penton, I know you've been jonesing for a cheesesteak, and in the process of finding out from a friend where he gets his tastykakes in LA, I found this

http://www.eatphillysbest.com/locations/

Apparently they fly in real Amoroso rolls as well as their meats from Philly, and they advertise Franks's soda (the Black cherry is superb) and real philly birch beer

So go get your fix, my ex-pat friend whose tastebuds I trust has declared it to be good, not as good as getting it local, but an acceptible source of philly related food

I can't recommend their hoagies till I know who does the meats tho

Very, very, interesting.
I have indeed heard of the outfit but, kind of ignored it because I thought that it was just the typical eatery marketing hype, i.e. “Philly’s Best”.

But your recommendation has me seriously intrigued. I take it that your friend is either from Philadelphia (i.e. "ex-pat") or lived there for a significant time to make a qualified assessment?

My other question is, aren't these places independent franchises and if so would their quality vary from location to location.....or not?

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Brain Sturgeon

Hey Penton--
.....Movies in the theater place subtitles within the video frame, so I don't see why doing that on a home video presentation would be problematic. If you could pass that on to the powers that be, I'd greatly appreciate it.

BrainSurgeon (using NOTES in the sella yet?), I understand and respect your dilemma and I actually passed this topic onto “the powers that decide/control subs” several months ago when this issue was first brought to my attention by another concerned member.

I can float the sub placement issue again to try to energize it but, sadly I don’t know how much traction it will get, as there are apparently other factors and priorities involved (Jeff probably knows and can elaborate) rather than appeasing the tiny minority that possess “CIH systems” like you have, unfortunately.

I’ll see what I can do, nevertheless.