"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Grubert

I'm used to it. Back in the DVD days I read and posted actively on avsforum for technical stuff, and hometheaterforum and dvdtalk for general DVD/movie discussion. Plus a French forum, and a Spanish one.

HTF has always had very good studio connections. But their fake-neutrality position during the format war and later sheer lack of enthusiasm towards the best-quality delivery vehicle for hidef movies (trumpeting doom and gloom and going as far as pushing the emperor-with-no-clothes Toshiba XDE player) made me lose a lot of respect for them.

Well, I just hope that they show some interest in the chat with Schawn and George, et. al. because I’m telling you people, the ‘classics’ just aint selling that well, no matter what the quality of the Blu-ray product is or what studio it comes out of.

Which is a real shame and some would say almost hypocritical given the fact that so much time on all the forums is spent talking about picture quality, restorations, remastering, etc. For example, if one is a true cinephile or connoisseur of superb looking titles, there is no reason why such titles as Gandhi or The Professionals shouldn’t be selling better if people have the discretionary income to purchase other more current titles to add to their home collections.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

I don’t recall ever seeing your name “doctorossi” on the *science* forum?

That's funny- I don't recall seeing "Penton-Man" there, either.

I'm "spectator" over there, for better or worse.

[Clark Kent]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, I just hope that they show some interest in the chat with Schawn and George, et. al. because I’m telling you people, the ‘classics’ just aint selling that well, no matter what the quality of the Blu-ray product is or what studio it comes out of.

I will say that outside of Warner Bros., classic titles on Blu-ray seem to get very little advertising and promotional support. Consumers will not buy them if they are not aware of them. The marketing departments need to be a little more creative with them. I think at this stage word-of-mouth is crucial for older catalog titles like A Passage To India and others.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, I just hope that they show some interest in the chat with Schawn and George, et. al. because I’m telling you people, the ‘classics’ just aint selling that well, no matter what the quality of the Blu-ray product is or what studio it comes out of.

Hey- I can't buy 'em faster than they release 'em!

I can tell you that I, for one, am very anxiously awaiting the Warner chat and a chance to find out what's on George's mind in particular.

[HeavyHitter]

Originally Posted by Grubert

HTF has always had very good studio connections. But their fake-neutrality position during the format war and later sheer lack of enthusiasm towards the best-quality delivery vehicle for hidef movies (trumpeting doom and gloom and going as far as pushing the emperor-with-no-clothes Toshiba XDE player) made me lose a lot of respect for them.

I agree. After Warner dumped HD DVD last year, one of their moderators publicly urged members to sign up for the Warner petition to urge them to continue HD DVD support. I also got tired of moderators claiming "DVD can look awesome."

[BluDomain]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

....For example, if one is a true cinephile or connoisseur of superb looking titles, there is no reason why such titles as Gandhi or The Professionals shouldn’t be selling better if people have the discretionary income to purchase other more current titles to add to their home collections.

I always buy them, but stores don't display them well, if they
even order them. BestBuy has a rack of new releases as you
walk in the door with cover showing. The week Gandhi was
released it wasn't on the new release rack, but buried in the
older racks with only the spine showing. Only a handful of
copies at that and no fanfare. Target and WalMart are worse.

Unless you peruse places like blu-ray.com you don't know
to look. I'll bet the classics do much better on Amazon as
it caters to people who are more likely to be in the know.

[Jeff Kleist]

I always buy them, but stores don't display them well, if they
even order them. BestBuy has a rack of new releases as you
walk in the door with cover showing. The week Gandhi was
released it wasn't on the new release rack, but buried in the
older racks with only the spine showing.

It's a vicious cycle. The numbers are low so the retailers don't order them. But then they keep being low BECAUSE they don't order them

Lose-lose

[Slec]

In New England (RI and MA) I've had problems finding catalog releases at Best Buy, Target, Wal-mart, Movie Stop, Newbury comics etc... There are a few spots where I can hit all of these and none had anything.

A short list of movies that I could not find until a week after release recently
Office Space
The Rundown
Boondock Saints
Amadeus (found a few days later, not a week...My better half reminded me that I bought this in Pittsburgh when traveling for work, because I couldn't find it in my area)


I realize P-man that you are referencing all purchases not release week purchases, but it makes me wonder if something else is going on here that might be a contributing factor over the medium term.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Slec

There are a few spots where I can hit all of these and none had anything.

I used to have this problem all the time in the days when I was buying on DVD. Often, no one at any retailer would even be familiar with the catalog titles I would look for on their release dates. This wasn't an issue in the LD era, as the few shops that even stocked them catered to the hardcore and always carried the most obscure releases.

The retail channel is so poorly merchandised, I sometimes find myself marveling that anything ever sells.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

That's funny- I don't recall seeing "Penton-Man" there, either.

I'm "spectator" over there, for better or worse.

Dude, I think I have something like 4 – 5,000 posts on that forum…………scroll down to Penton-Man
“BD Hollywood Studio Insider”
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=899842

but, I departed for the most part, during the format war around the time Paramount flipped and all the red ants (including the HD DVD messiah himself, Amir) went crazy on the Insider’s Thread over there with their gloating, which was allowed to occur under supervision of the moderator(s) in charge of that thread.

Paidgeek, likewise left shortly thereafter.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Hey- I can't buy 'em faster than they release 'em!

I can tell you that I, for one, am very anxiously awaiting the Warner chat and a chance to find out what's on George's mind in particular.

Well, I can tell you that whether the issue comes up or not during the chat with George, or whether he chooses to publicly downplay the topic, specifically, he’s one executive that has personally complained to me within the past month of the poor sales of classic Warner Blu-ray titles……….and this is similar to what I have heard from all of the other majors.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by HeavyHitter

I agree. After Warner dumped HD DVD last year, one of their moderators publicly urged members to sign up for the Warner petition to urge them to continue HD DVD support.

I did not know that.
Tis not good if he remains in active moderator status, unless he has made a good act of contrition with a public apology.

Tell him if he ever loses his day job,- to apply for a job here, so he can be with his buddies...........
http://www.videobusiness.com/article....html?nid=2705

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

their gloating, which was allowed to occur under supervision of the moderator(s) in charge of that thread.

That's frustrating- a lot of stupidity on both sides back then. I'm so glad that crap's behind us... so to speak.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by BluDomain

I always buy them, but stores don't display them well, if they
even order them. BestBuy has a rack of new releases as you
walk in the door with cover showing. The week Gandhi was
released it wasn't on the new release rack, but buried in the
older racks with only the spine showing. Only a handful of
copies at that and no fanfare. Target and WalMart are worse.

Unless you peruse places like blu-ray.com you don't know
to look. I'll bet the classics do much better on Amazon as
it caters to people who are more likely to be in the know.

It is my feeling that every hardcore collector that frequents forums such as Blu-ray.com, HTF, AVS should own Blu-rays like Gandhi, The Professionals, etc. –esp. those that constantly debate theories regarding how excellent scans and/or transfers are done.

If the buyers for BestBuy, Target and WalMart are ‘classically’ challenged then just turn 100% of your purchasing attention to Amazon………and better yet, order through this forum as Blu-ray.com gets no advertising dollars like some other forums that blitz you with mini or major billboard advertisements while you’re patiently waiting for the dang page to load on your computer!

[SquidPuppet]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

He’s got a pic of himself with the throttle wide open at Laguna Seca Raceway (Doug Chandler's Motorcycle Racing School, I think?).
I’ll see if the file is small enough for me to post a pic on this thread to compensate doctorossi for the above.

Still waiting. Growing evermore impatient.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, I can tell you that whether the issue comes up or not during the chat with George, or whether he chooses to publicly downplay the topic, specifically, he’s one executive that has personally complained to me within the past month of the poor sales of classic Warner Blu-ray titles…

Did you remember to ask him nicely to try sticking Casablanca in a regular box with a regular price tag?

This is utter speculation, but I can't help but wonder if a lot of the folks like me (those early adopters driven primarily by catalog content) are still a little gun-shy after the format war- especially when it comes to Warner titles. In the early days of HDMs, Warner was pretty much the only studio pushing hard on catalog/classic titles and they did it on HD DVD. The yummy stack of early classic Warner releases was one of the main reasons I bought an HD DVD player. Even after HD DVD's inside-job murder, it was still a long time before the roster of classics available on Blu began to compete and the sting was made extra sharp by the knowledge that it had been Warner themselves who had pulled the trigger. I jumped into Blu as soon as the content began to catch up (it's still not quite there), but I did so with a little remaining resentment toward Warner. I wouldn't be surprised if some others felt the burn a little more strongly than I did and haven't decided to "come back" yet. I feel for George (and I know it wasn't his decision) and I bear Warner no ill will, but I hope they understand that they're not in too much of a position to complain; I think they pissed off a lot of their most devoted audience- the kind of early adopters so valuable in growing sales the way they want to.

/blather

[Slec]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

<snip>
If the buyers for BestBuy, Target and WalMart are ‘classically’ challenged then just turn 100% of your purchasing attention to Amazon………and better yet, order through this forum as Blu-ray.com gets no advertising dollars like some other forums that blitz you with mini or major billboard advertisements while you’re patiently waiting for the dang page to load on your computer!

I usually do, but DVD trade-in $'s and giftcards don't spend themselves I try to support this site however I can..amazon is an easy way to do it

[horseflesh]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Well, I can tell you that whether the issue comes up or not during the chat with George, or whether he chooses to publicly downplay the topic, specifically, he’s one executive that has personally complained to me within the past month of the poor sales of classic Warner Blu-ray titles……….and this is similar to what I have heard from all of the other majors.

I don't like the sound of that
Penton, is it getting to the stage that the studios are going to start considering putting less effort into catalogue/classic releases?
Should we worry, for example, about Lawrence of Arabia??

[Jeff Kleist]

I'd say it's more that it will simply take that much longer for classics to come out. If you're on the fence about a classic, tip to the "buy" side. Buy week one if possilble. Tell your friends to do the same, give them as gifts!

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Even after HD DVD's inside-job murder,

/blather

It wasn't murder, it was a mercy killing.

Think Million Dollar Baby with Warner being Eastwood