"Club Penton" - Ask questions to Hollywood insider "Penton-Man"

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by neo_reloaded

I don't like OS X as a development platform or a user experience.

Out of curiousity (and a sideline interest in perhaps moving things in another direction, as I know Penton can't stand to have anyone defending Apple in his thread), what OS(es) do you prefer as a user experience in the personal computer space?

[Jeff Kleist]

Well, lots of people are buying iPods and there are many, many alternatives on the market, so... yes- apparently competitive pricing.

No, there aren't alternatives for full access to material. That's the part you're not getting. Historically "seperate but equal" never is.

Quick! Name me another company that can make graphing calculators using the Texas Instruments graphing calculator operating system!

But they can make a graphic calculator that will graph the same equations just as efficiently with no loss of functionality.

You're again using false comparisons. Give me the product that will play FairPlay encoded video files not made by Apple please, and find for me how their market share has suddenly lost 41% to even put them below 50% on videos.

iTunes is a free software download that acts as an interface to the iPod. Saying that needing that software to use an iPod constitutes a monopoly is like saying needing nVidia drivers to use a nVidia video card is a monopoly.

On the contrary. Nvidia allows and encourages hobbyists to release their own drivers, or to hack the existing ones for their video cards, and never takes steps to lock them out from doing so. Their only requirement is that they make it clear they are not produced or endorsed by Nvidia

Every other MP3 player I've ever seen interfaces as a standard flash drive, allowing free copying of files back and forth. Apple won't even let you copy stuff off the iPod without employing third party software, and makes repeated efforts to lock those out.

I don't say this to defend Apple. I don't like OS X as a development platform or a user experience. I hate Apple's smarmy image and marketing. And I dislike the iTunes Music Store as I feel it and other services like it are killing the concept of the album and making everything focused around single tracks. But I don't think they have a monopoly.

mo⋅nop⋅o⋅ly
 
–noun, plural -lies.
1. exclusive control of a commodity or service in a particular market, or a control that makes possible the manipulation of prices. Compare duopoly, oligopoly.
4. something that is the subject of such control, as a commodity or service.
5. a company or group that has such control.
6. the market condition that exists when there is only one seller[/B].

So ask yourself

Are there any retailers of FairPlay encoded movies besides iTunes?
Does Apple not control 91% of online video sales?
Are there other manufacturers of devices that can play these files?
Will any other DRMs function on iPods, opening them up to competition?

Looks like 4 out of 7 definitions apply (7 being the board game)

[neo_reloaded]

Apple does not sell a commodity, something being Fairplay-encoded does not make it a commodity. Apple sells one variation of a subset of a commodity. You can get the exact same movies and the exact same songs from countless other sources. People don't put up with disagreeable pricing and unwanted Apple hardware to get "Fairplay-encoded files. They get Fairplay-encoded files over functionally-identical versions of the same movies and songs from other services because they LIKE the Apple pricing and they LIKE the Apple hardware (or at least don't dislike it enough to consider the other viable competitors).

When you pay for a download on the XBox Live Video Marketplace, you can only play that video on your XBox 360. Same for the PSN movie store - you can only play it on your PS3 or PSP. You can't pop those over to an iPod or a laptop or anything else. Are those monopolies?

[Jeff Kleist]

When you pay for a download on the XBox Live Video Marketplace, you can only play that video on your XBox 360. Same for the PSN movie store - you can only play it on your PS3 or PSP. You can't pop those over to an iPod or a laptop or anything else. Are those monopolies?

Neither one of those sources control 91% of the market. You'll also find MS and Sony very much behind the universal DRM locker scheme. Monopoly is very much defined by market share, and the ability to steer that market. For example, if Sony holds back its films from other consoles, that's not monopoly, because they don't own the entire movie market. We're talking about there being an artificial gatekeeper that specifically keeps everyone out of its playground because they have nothing to offer but the keys to that gate. Apple owns no content, and so collecting fees is all they have.

I'd check out the EU anti-trust cases against Microsoft over web browsers, I think they're very applicable here.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

Neither one of those sources control 91% of the market.

... but they operate using the same DRM/exclusivity mechanisms, which is your indicator that Apple has 91% of the market not because of unfair monopolistic practices, but because people like their products and services for other reasons.

If everyone else is able to operate in the same way as Apple, how is Apple operating a monopoly? If Apple had a monopoly, they would be using practices that their competitors can't use. They don't have a monopoly; they have very popular products and services- there's a difference.

[Jeff Kleist]

If everyone else is able to operate in the same way as Apple, how is Apple operating a monopoly? If Apple had a monopoly, they would be using practices that their competitors can't use. They don't have a monopoly; they have very popular products and services- there's a difference.

Which again, no one can compete with because Apple is the gatekeeper to entry. Again, see the EU antitrust rulings against Microsoft. Essentially you just continue to dodge the issues.

Gatekeeper lockdown+overwhelming marketshare=monopoly. If you still can't see it, even with the dictionary's help, then there's nothing I can do to help you. I think I've provided more than enough examples of how those with far less share of the market have exerted control over all of it (Wal-Mart). Bottom line, if you're going to sell a DRM'd video work for a portable device, you're selling it on iTunes for play on an iPod, and you have to bow to Apple's whims whether you like it or not

I maintain- Apple licensing its DRM to the world will enable managed copy to flourish, and opening up the iPod to multiple DRMs and codecs (why do I have to jailbreak it to play DIVX, and needlessly re-encode video to put it on there), it's good for the health of the entire industry. When you can put in your Blu-ray and rip to the format of your choice, that's an end to digital copy DVDs being thrown out after use, and when your purchase is held in a universal locker, you can re-rip any time, and you can fit it to the HTPC, portable device, or whatever use you have it for. In the meantime, every time any device is made or software licensed, or a rip using their DRM is done Apple still gets paid.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

Which again, no one can compete with because Apple is the gatekeeper to entry.

What video content can you buy on iTunes that you can't also buy on DVD?

I've been using iPods and iTunes for years, I have multiple iPods full of legally-acquired music and I've never purchased a single track of it from iTunes!

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

What video content can you buy on iTunes that you can't also buy on DVD?

TV episodes?

I've been using iPods and iTunes for years, I have multiple iPods full of legally-acquired music and I've never purchased a single track of it from iTunes!

But you still had to transfer it to the iPod via iTunes.

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

TV episodes?

Have you been to a store that sells DVDs lately?

There's another place you can get TV episodes, too. It's called TV.

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

But you still had to transfer it to the iPod via iTunes.

Uh... so?

When I get in a Ford Focus and close the door, I don't really have the option for that door to be a Ferrari door, either, do I? Again, what's your point? iTunes, Apple's music library software, was designed to work with iPod, Apple's music player hardware.

Is there no other music library software on the market?

Is there no other music player hardware on the market?


I'm intrigued that it bothers you both that the poor owners of other computers can't use Apple's OS with them and that the poor owners of Apple's music player can't use other makers' music software with them. So, you don't want any company to be able to produce proprietary software or hardware?

Are you more upset that you can't buy Pepsi in a Coke can or that you can't buy Coke in a Pepsi can?

[Jeff Kleist]

Look, I'm not going to argue this any further, because it's obviously pointless. If you want to continue, you're welcome to PM me.

[Eternal_Sunshine]

But who wants/needs the DRM on digital movies? The film industry! To break what you call the Apple "monopoly" they would just have to allow Apple and other digital download shops to sell movies without DRM. That's what the music industry (finally) did, and there is no lock-in with drm-free music files, is there? Problem solved. And DRM doesn't work anyway, which is a fact that the music industry slowly had to acknowledge.

[DenonCI]

Penton,

Did you see this at the "other" convention in Vegas?

http://www.tgdaily.com/business-and-...ot-in-sin-city

[Stacey Spears]

what OS(es) do you prefer as a user experience in the personal computer space?

This is a dangerous topic for me to touch, for obvious reasons, but I can give a couple examples.

1. I like that OSX displays an external drive on the desktop when connected. And I like that you simply drag to the trash to remove. On Windows, it’s a poor experience. It takes many clicks to remove an external drive.

2. I dislike the common file menu across the top of OSX. When you click on an applications window, the file menu changes. I much prefer each window having its own file menu, like Windows.

I own a MacBook Pro and I dual boot with Win7 and OSX. The only time I really use OSX is when editing in FCP. It’s a great editor. Hopefully CS5 is good enough that I no longer need to use FCP.

Penton, any info on 3D capable AVC encoders for Blu-ray? e.g. When will Sony have one?

[Doctorossi]

Hey Penton,

To the extent that you have any pull with the packaging folks (I know, I know), it sure would look classy if a future Lawrence of Arabia Digibook could be lined up with my imminent Doctor Zhivago Digibook...

[Mr. Cinema]

Originally Posted by Doctorossi

Hey Penton,

To the extent that you have any pull with the packaging folks (I know, I know), it sure would look classy if a future Lawrence of Arabia Digibook could be lined up with my imminent Doctor Zhivago Digibook...

Taxi Driver would complete that trifecta for me.

[cjamescook]

Originally Posted by Jeff Kleist

... In a nutshell to the original question- No, Apple doesn't care about Blu-ray until they're given a financial reason to do so that also massages Steve Jobs' ego, or until such time that market forces require its inclusion (a bare mimimum of 2-3 years). ...

To anyone: Apple was strongly rumored to have included blu-ray support in the last Machintosh hardware release, but pulled it at the last minute.

Skip the speculation: does anyone really know why it was dropped at the last minute?

[Doctorossi]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cinema

Taxi Driver would complete that trifecta for me.

I'm very curious why that would be.

[Jeff Kleist]

I'm not speculating it's a carrot and stick thing so they can move ahead when they get what they want, so they can dangle a big product unveil press conference Where,despite sony and hp and others having drives for years, blu is the incredible new innovation from apple and the press will report it as such because god forbid they research a story or fact check a press release

[Penton-Man]

I see you boys have been busy since I last stopped in.
I think even Mitch Singer and the DECE would be envious of some of you.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by blu2

There are lots of articles on the net that trace this back to a Sony/Panasonic presentation at the International Symposium on Optical Memory 2009 (ISOM '09), held in October 2009

http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/article...091222/178809/

I understand how reporting outlets work.
I hope nobody is going to ask that I read yet a 3rd example of journalistic cell division.