Early Blu-rays that may have playback issues (Criterion, Well Go USA, etc.)

[GentleGiant]

I hate to say this but how do we know that in a couple of years or so more Criterion discs won't be facing the same sad fate? What if this turns out not as isolated an issue as it appears at this point? How long exactly have Bluray discs been around? What if those older BDs released ten years ago collectively start rotting or otherwise deteriorating 5, 7, 9 years from now?
But hey, that's just me fantasizing, so never mind..

[Brent L.]

I just got off the phone with them. I have great news, explanations, and more. Give me a minute while I type it all up. I just wanted to let you all know that I had a lot of success with my phone call. I'll update this post or post again in just a few minutes when I get done...

[onetet]

Originally Posted by rdandura

Look I'm not trying to troll post on this forum; I'm generally concerned about Criterion's mishandling of the bronzing issue.

If that's the case, please use language appropriate to a still-unfolding situation concerning merchandise that went defective after several years of use, and not language that should be reserved for serious personal tragedies ("This is completely awful and I will NEVER EVER heal from this") and major crimes ("everyone at Criterion deserves the worst possible punishment").

That kind of hyperbole detracts from this thread, which is otherwise doing a great job of collecting information about this problem and its source(s)--information that may well help Criterion resolve this issue to everyone's satisfaction.

[Doctor Jack]

Originally Posted by rdandura

Look I'm not trying to troll post on this forum; I'm generally concerned about Criterion's mishandling of the bronzing issue.

Every single one of your posts beg to differ.

[Freeza]

Originally Posted by Brent L.

I just got off the phone with them. I have great news, explanations, and more. Give me a minute while I type it all up. I just wanted to let you all know that I had a lot of success with my phone call. I'll update this post or post again in just a few minutes when I get done...

My call to them earlier was very reassuring as well.

[Helikaon]

I've heard it mentioned that the people answering e-mails and phonecalls (including the Mulvaney address) are just interns. It would make sense for them not to respond until they've heard from higher up what the message is. Still, not an excuse for why it's taken so long for any news.

[GentleGiant]

Originally Posted by Brent L.

I just got off the phone with them. I have great news, explanations, and more. Give me a minute while I type it all up. I just wanted to let you all know that I had a lot of success with my phone call. I'll update this post or post again in just a few minutes when I get done...

I feel much better now, thanks.

[Brent L.]

Alrighty. I called and talked with a very nice lady who was more than helpful. If I knew it would be such a helpful, informative call, I'd have considered recording it to share with you all. I had no clue they would reveal this much information though. I think I remember all of the important bits. I'll jot things down in a list form below so as to not miss anything...

-They are aware of the issue, but they only have confirmations on two titles - Summer Hours and Walkabout.

-I informed them of my situation (listed in OP), and read off to them the five titles with bronzing that no longer work, the one that freezes (Gomorrah), and the one with bronzing but still works as of right now (Days of Heaven).

-She was very appreciative of the information. I also read her off all other titles that have been reported as having issues.

-She jotted everything down to make note of it all to bring it to the attention of the guys in charge.

-She told me that they have over 1,000 emails in their inbox that they haven't even had time to look at or respond to yet. They are being hammered, and with only around 25 people working for the company and fewer than that which are able to deal with emails and things, it's just taking longer than it normally would.

-They are aware of the threads on various forums concerning these issues.

-Right now they are dealing with the Eraserhead situation. They are getting a lot of those discs in every single day, emails as well on that one, and they are trying to take care of that problem before tackling this bronzing issue.

-They are however already actively doing research into this problem and will then come up with a way for them to deal with it.

-She assured me that everyone with defective discs will receive replacements. It may take time, but they will take care of every single customer.

-The only exception to this is, unfortunately, for people with OOP discs. They have absolutely no stock of any of the OOP titles anymore, and they have no options to print additional copies for replacements. They will offer some sort of solution for those people though, which may be another Criterion title of your choice to replace it.

-She told me to remove all of my damaged discs and to put a sticky note on each and every one of them giving exact details of the problems that they are having. I am then to take the discs, and only the discs, and mail them to the address that she gave me.

-They do NOT want people to just randomly start mailing discs to them.

-They are going to deal with this on a case by case basis. Once you hear from them, have it be on the phone or in email, they will then instruct you exactly what to do as they did for me just now.

-They are aware that they have had issues with some of these titles in the past such as M and Walkabout. However, if you have bronzing and that sort of thing, this is a completely different and separate problem and they recognize it as such.

-I'm going to add one more thing to my list, which explains why they have yet to make a public statement on this issue...

-She told me that they are hesitant to publicly say anything yet, other than on a case by case basis, because they have yet to complete their research into the problem. They do not know the exact case of the issues as of this time, but they are currently looking into it. Unless, or until, they can narrow things down to where they can say exactly what the issue is, they will be dealing with this on a case by case basis as they have almost always done in the past. Long story short - if you have a defective disc, it will get replaced, and if they do discover the exact problem, they will release a public explanation at that time.

-They will be responding to each and every email soon. They have simply been slammed and that, mixed with Eraserhead, they are behind way more than ever before. Be patient, and they will take care of all of us.

[ShellOilJunior]

Originally Posted by Helikaon

I've heard it mentioned that the people answering e-mails and phonecalls (including the Mulvaney address) are just interns. It would make sense for them not to respond until they've heard from higher up what the message is. Still, not an excuse for why it's taken so long for any news.

I'm not sure "Jon Mulvaney" actually exists. I think interns monitor that account. It's like a catch-all for misc. requests.

[L'armée des ombres]

Well my Pierrot le fou froze up at the one hour mark
Guess i can use that as a drink coaster now

[cakefactory]

Thanks Brent, that was an incredibly constructive way to deal with the problem and thanks for the detailed explanation of what you heard from them. Too bad about the OOP stuff, but that's not exactly surprising. I'll have to make sure my Last Year At Marienbad is OK, though I don't think anyone's had problems with that one yet anyway.

[Helikaon]

Thanks for the info Brent! I figured the big C was on the case, but it's good to know for sure.

[AgentOrange]

Originally Posted by GentleGiant

I hate to say this but how do we know that in a couple of years or so more Criterion discs won't be facing the same sad fate? What if this turns out not as isolated an issue as it appears at this point? How long exactly have Bluray discs been around? What if those older BDs released ten years ago collectively start rotting or otherwise deteriorating 5, 7, 9 years from now?
But hey, that's just me fantasizing, so never mind..

There have already been "dead-disk" issues from different studios, but it's usually related to a "bad batch" manufactured from a certain time and place - not the entire format. I think if Criterion has continual issues, it must mean the entire format has issues, it wouldn't make sense for it to just be Criterion as they (presumably) use the same array of facilities to manufacture discs as many other distributors do. All we can do is hope that it's nothing like that.

It remains to be seen if these issues will be more, or less, prevalent on blu-ray than in prior formats. Particularly as the format ages 10 years or more - we'll see if there is a real failure problem compared to past optical formats. As of now the jury is still out. There could be something with the chemical composition if it differed from past formats - maybe to reach the 50GB capacity they used some materials or process that simply does not have the same lifespan or long-term reliability once chemicals start degrading/breaking down.

I can say from my personal experience, I think I've actually had MORE issues with unplayable/dead blu-ray discs than prior formats. But it's still a very low % of discs for me overall. Perhaps 8 or 10 out of 1000 (including 3 in one shot in the Ten Commandments Gift Set that all went bad). If it shot up in any meaningful way, I'd definitely think twice about collecting blu-rays for the long term.

[Thebunk]

Originally Posted by Freeza

Actually, what we need is for you to settle down. You're helping no one with your chicken little impressions, and in my opinion are trolling.

I found a secondary number and called that. What I was told was that they are aware of the 'bronzing' issue and that new Summer Hours discs are in manufacture. As to any other titles that may be affected, they aren't aware of any outside of a select few, but if there were more those would be addressed on a case by case basis. What more could you want? Seems good to me. Do you really think they're in the business of scoffing a bit of $$$ from you just to sacrifice your patronage throughout the rest of time? Calm down, please.

Look, I agree the class action thing is a little (a lot) over the top. But in terms of what more do we (or I want):

- A public notification that there is an issue and they are looking into this. Just like all of the other times there has been a messup (see Eraserhead). It is great they told you over the phone they are aware of it (or at least for Summer Hours) but unless you are their spokesperson, then I will wait for something official.
- The fact that they are aware of "Summer Hours" and noted outside of a select few, well that is very troubling. That means either they are burying their heads in the sand and not investigating further or they do not care. Many people here (plus see Criterion Cast, Criterion Forum, their Facebook page, etc) have sent them numerous other examples of other issues. It is very troubling to say the least.

[Helikaon]

Originally Posted by Thebunk

Look, I agree the class action thing is a little (a lot) over the top. But in terms of what more do we (or I want):

- A public notification that there is an issue and they are looking into this. Just like all of the other times there has been a messup (see Eraserhead). It is great they told you over the phone they are aware of it (or at least for Summer Hours) but unless you are their spokesperson, then I will wait for something official.
- The fact that they are aware of "Summer Hours" and noted outside of a select few, well that is very troubling. That means either they are burying their heads in the sand and not investigating further or they do not care. Many people here (plus see Criterion Cast, Criterion Forum, their Facebook page, etc) have sent them numerous other examples of other issues. It is very troubling to say the least.

Well, as was mentioned in Brent's post above, they haven't had chance to read all the e-mails they have been receiving so are not aware of all the problems everyone is having. I agree though, they should give some indiciation that they are working on the matter, and now they have, sort of.

[Freeza]

Originally Posted by Brent L.

Alrighty. I called and talked with a very nice lady who was more than helpful. If I knew it would be such a helpful, informative call, I'd have considered recording it to share with you all. I had no clue they would reveal this much information though. I think I remember all of the important bits. I'll jot things down in a list form below so as to not miss anything...

The things you list, aside from having me send in any problem discs, are pretty much word for word what they told me this morning.

[Thebunk]

Originally Posted by Helikaon

Well, as was mentioned in Brent's post above, they haven't had chance to read all the e-mails they have been receiving so are not aware of all the problems everyone is having. I agree though, they should give some indiciation that they are working on the matter, and now they have, sort of.

Yup and I agree with that.

Just think an announcement is due is all, just like past issues. Even if they just say they are investigating it and that everyone will be taken care of (like Brent mentioned) I think that would put a lot of minds at ease.

[Brent L.]

I'm going to add one more thing to my list, which explains why they have yet to make a public statement on this issue. I thought this went without saying, but I guess I need to list it anyway...

-She told me that they are hesitant to publicly say anything yet, other than on a case by case basis, because they have yet to complete their research into the problem. They do not know the exact case of the issues as of this time, but they are currently looking into it. Unless, or until, they can narrow things down to where they can say exactly what the issue is, they will be dealing with this on a case by case basis as they have almost always done in the past. Long story short - if you have a defective disc, it will get replaced, and if they do discover the exact problem, they will release a public explanation at that time.

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Helikaon

Well, as was mentioned in Brent's post above, they haven't had chance to read all the e-mails they have been receiving so are not aware of all the problems everyone is having. I agree though, they should give some indiciation that they are working on the matter, and now they have, sort of.

Well from what i heard on here and Criterionforum it appears that when people send emails about Eraserhead they do get answered fast, so while it is probable that they haven't read them, it is not because they haven't got to them, it is because they probably read the subject and skip it to give other issues priority.

[HD Goofnut]

I need to make sure and check my discs for The Seventh Seal and Stagecoach tonight. I just watched my Stagecoach disc a couple months ago and it was fine though.