Early Blu-rays that may have playback issues (Criterion, Well Go USA, etc.)

[Brent L.]

Originally Posted by pedromvu

Well from what i heard on here and Criterionforum it appears that when people send emails about Eraserhead they do get answered fast, so while it is probable that they haven't read them, it is not because they haven't got to them, it is because they probably read the subject and skip it to give other issues priority.

That's exactly what it is, and it's exactly what she told me.

They haven't gotten to them yet because they are dealing with Eraserhead.

[pedromvu]

Originally Posted by Brent L.

That's exactly what it is, and it's exactly what she told me.

They haven't gotten to them yet because they are dealing with Eraserhead.

So they are probably mostly aware of Summer Hours because that was the first title we started emailing them about , before this thread started and we flooded their email.

[Eny-]

I too sent them an email that is still unanswered for two weeks.

I'm still not worried because if there is a company that does right for their customers is Criterion.

I have contacted them several times over the years concerning damage items - being digipaks, booklets, discs or cases and they always replaced them without a fuss, several times for FREE (I'm in Europe).

I wish Anchor Bay were the same

[JMDiaz718]

This was an issue with laserdiscs as well. I had several laserdiscs, from different companies, that rotted. Dante's Peak, A Night to Remember, were two of my lasers that rotted. The weird thing is, you didn't see anything odd on the physical discs. You just saw a lot of snow and jumping and freezing, when you played the disc.

I haven't watched a laser in many years, so I'd hate to dig them out of the basement now!! I do own more Criterion lasers, then blu-rays. Hope my The Blob laser's ok!!

Haven't had any issues with the blu-rays. Of the Criterion Collection, I only own a few. The Blob, Scanners, A Night to Remember & Godzilla are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by Brent L.

Alrighty. I called and talked with a very nice lady who was more than helpful. If I knew it would be such a helpful, informative call, I'd have considered recording it to share with you all. I had no clue they would reveal this much information though. I think I remember all of the important bits. I'll jot things down in a list form below so as to not miss anything...

[Show spoiler]-They are aware of the issue, but they only have confirmations on two titles - Summer Hours and Walkabout.

-I informed them of my situation (listed in OP), and read off to them the five titles with bronzing that no longer work, the one that freezes (Gomorrah), and the one with bronzing but still works as of right now (Days of Heaven).

-She was very appreciative of the information. I also read her off all other titles that have been reported as having issues.

-She jotted everything down to make note of it all to bring it to the attention of the guys in charge.

-She told me that they have over 1,000 emails in their inbox that they haven't even had time to look at or respond to yet. They are being hammered, and with only around 25 people working for the company and fewer than that which are able to deal with emails and things, it's just taking longer than it normally would.

-They are aware of the threads on various forums concerning these issues.

-Right now they are dealing with the Eraserhead situation. They are getting a lot of those discs in every single day, emails as well on that one, and they are trying to take care of that problem before tackling this bronzing issue.

-They are however already actively doing research into this problem and will then come up with a way for them to deal with it.

-She assured me that everyone with defective discs will receive replacements. It may take time, but they will take care of every single customer.

-The only exception to this is, unfortunately, for people with OOP discs. They have absolutely no stock of any of the OOP titles anymore, and they have no options to print additional copies for replacements. They will offer some sort of solution for those people though, which may be another Criterion title of your choice to replace it.

-She told me to remove all of my damaged discs and to put a sticky note on each and every one of them giving exact details of the problems that they are having. I am then to take the discs, and only the discs, and mail them to the address that she gave me.

-They do NOT want people to just randomly start mailing discs to them.

-They are going to deal with this on a case by case basis. Once you hear from them, have it be on the phone or in email, they will then instruct you exactly what to do as they did for me just now.

-They are aware that they have had issues with some of these titles in the past such as M and Walkabout. However, if you have bronzing and that sort of thing, this is a completely different and separate problem and they recognize it as such.

-I'm going to add one more thing to my list, which explains why they have yet to make a public statement on this issue...

-She told me that they are hesitant to publicly say anything yet, other than on a case by case basis, because they have yet to complete their research into the problem. They do not know the exact case of the issues as of this time, but they are currently looking into it. Unless, or until, they can narrow things down to where they can say exactly what the issue is, they will be dealing with this on a case by case basis as they have almost always done in the past. Long story short - if you have a defective disc, it will get replaced, and if they do discover the exact problem, they will release a public explanation at that time.

-They will be responding to each and every email soon. They have simply been slammed and that, mixed with Eraserhead, they are behind way more than ever before. Be patient, and they will take care of all of us.

Thank you! I will link to your post in the OP.

[Joe Dalek]

Interesting thread. I will need to look at my discs when I get home. However, my copy of Paris, Texas did mysteriously start freezing on the home movies scene over the summer and I wonder if this explains why. Tried it on multiple players with the same result. I bought another copy, as I looked at the disc for spots (no noticeable marks) but didn't look for or notice any discoloration. I'll have to check both (and Pierrot le fou) now, and I'll probably hold off on buying Days of Heaven now.

[stlcards]

The only problem I have had with a Criterion disc is "The Seventh Seal" skipped on me towards the end of the movie. It always skipped in the same place and I could never get it to play correctly. Criterion replaced it free of charge (probably a couple years ago).

[LPMA]

I'm quite disappointed at the response they gave concerning the OOP titles. I understand that stance, and it would make sense if it was only affecting a person here and there. However, if it really is a widespread issue affecting many, I hope they reevaluate their options and consider negotiating a deal for replacement purposes. While I'm no legal expert, I would think that's feasible.

[rdandura]

Originally Posted by Joe Dalek

Interesting thread. I will need to look at my discs when I get home. However, my copy of Paris, Texas did mysteriously start freezing on the home movies scene over the summer and I wonder if this explains why. Tried it on multiple players with the same result. I bought another copy, as I looked at the disc for spots (no noticeable marks) but didn't look for or notice any discoloration. I'll have to check both (and Pierrot le fou) now, and I'll probably hold off on buying Days of Heaven now.

This should have never have happened. At least they gave some answer this time, and to be fair, an understandable reason for their delay in response.

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by LPMA

I'm quite disappointed at the response they gave concerning the OOP titles. I understand that stance, and it would make sense if it was only affecting a person here and there. However, if it really is a widespread issue affecting many, I hope they reevaluate their options and consider negotiating a deal for replacement purposes. While I'm no legal expert, I would think that's feasible.

They're already taking a financial hit by exchanging the movies. It'd be too expensive to (re-)negotiate licensing, especially since they can't profit off of the OOP discs anymore.

[nickersonw]

Scanning three of my titles that show signs of bronzing for any problems

listed from most bronzed to least:

• Bigger Than Life
• Monsoon Wedding
• Howard's End

I probably went a little overboard, but I checked all of my Criterions (104 SKUs) and those three were the only ones that showed bronzing. After I finish scanning those three, I am going to scan other titles I own that have been mentioned.

[tenia]

Originally Posted by rdandura

This is Browngate. They all deserve to be bothered until they fix this issue, because ignoring it for so long is just bad customer service.

Originally Posted by Thebunk

- The fact that they are aware of "Summer Hours" and noted outside of a select few, well that is very troubling. That means either they are burying their heads in the sand and not investigating further or they do not care. Many people here (plus see Criterion Cast, Criterion Forum, their Facebook page, etc) have sent them numerous other examples of other issues. It is very troubling to say the least.

Though a simple "we know, we're looking into it but don't want to publish any PR before having all the figures tied together" wouldn't hurt, I've quickly learnt that it's much better to gather everything and publish later a full and constructed report than to publish an half-assed thing just to publish something.

Honestly, it'd simply be a bone thrown to everyone, making the things worse because opening doors to contradictory statements due to new intel arriving live, over panic etc etc.

Moreover, if Criterion would publish a statement saying "well, we've looked and still don't know what, how, where or when", I'm sure plenty of people would say "they don't know what they're doing, what a bunch of jerks".

Part of my job implies working around audits, stability and performances tests, but also traceability exercises. Believe me : you don't want to publish anything before ensuring 100% of your traceability exercise is double checked.

The only thing people can do now is listing.
Listing the discs they have, how they look, the SID numbers and if they pass integrity tests such as VSO Inspector, Nero CD-DVD Speed test or, to a lesser extent, a full scan disc with BD-Info or an equivalent soft.

Anything more is just jumping to conclusions without any clue.

What you see is all there is, as they say.

Originally Posted by jscoggins

They're already taking a financial hit by exchanging the movies. It'd be too expensive to (re-)negotiate licensing, especially since they can't profit off of the OOP discs anymore.

Absolutely. It's safe to say that if they lost the rights in the first place, it's not without reason, and that printing only the replacement discs would further make this more expensive.

I genuinely don't understand how people can keep any hope for OOP titles to have replacement discs created soon somehow.
It's sad, but if it's gone, it's gone and there's no way Studio Canal will say to Criterion "eh, I feel for you, here, I'm letting you print 500 replacement discs for only a very small fee".

[punking]

Originally Posted by Arkadin

uh oh.
first report I have seen of another company's disc being affected.
So it appears this could very well be a problem not just isolated to Criterion, but could involve many different releases from multiple companies; probably all traced back to the same replication plant potentially.

Not a Criterion release, but my copy of The Getaway (1972) has browning around the edge and no longer works in my Panasonic player. It does play in my oppo.

[Show spoiler]IMG_0336.jpg

[jscoggins]

Originally Posted by nickersonw

listed from most bronzed to least:

• Bigger Than Life
• Monsoon Wedding
• Howard's End

Wow, first mention of Bigger Than Life. Does it play?

[nickersonw]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

Wow, first mention of Bigger Than Life. Does it play?

I fast forwarded through it and didn't notice any problems. I am scanning it now and so far it is all good at 87.5%

It isn't as bad as some of the pictures I've seen posted. I've tried getting a picture of it but it isn't showing up to well.

[wormraper]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

Wow, first mention of Bigger Than Life. Does it play?

mentioned it last nigh.. mine is starting to bronze... it still plays, but hiccups a few times

[AgentOrange]

Originally Posted by LPMA

I'm quite disappointed at the response they gave concerning the OOP titles. I understand that stance, and it would make sense if it was only affecting a person here and there. However, if it really is a widespread issue affecting many, I hope they reevaluate their options and consider negotiating a deal for replacement purposes. While I'm no legal expert, I would think that's feasible.

Actually, that doesn't sound feasible at all. It's rough for someone to lose an OOP title (either because they treasured it personally, or paid way too much for it), but there's no way Criterion (or any label) are going to negotiate a license deal JUST to be able to send out hundreds/thousands of free replacement copies. Offering a different replacement disc of equal MSRP seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Of course in the main Criterion thread I've seen some talk of possible movement with getting some of the StudioCanal titles back - so maybe in time some will go back *IN* print (or have new editions). But that would have nothing to do with the issue at hand, unless you held onto the OOP title for years and waited for them to possibly do a replacement if and when a new edition comes out, but that's a big IF.

[richard_t]

My copy of Kubrick's Paths of Glory appears to have the brown staining around the inside of the disk. Not had chance to try playing it yet.

https://twitter.com/uk_cinephile/sta...69450711232512

[Thebunk]

Originally Posted by jscoggins

They're already taking a financial hit by exchanging the movies. It'd be too expensive to (re-)negotiate licensing, especially since they can't profit off of the OOP discs anymore.

I agree with this. Criterion should not be held responsible for second hand market values for OOP titles, though not sure 1 title from existing catalog titles is fair either. Perhaps 2 or something or a $50 GC for their online store. Negotiating with each customer is not really reasonable in my opinion.

[Joe Dalek]

Originally Posted by AgentOrange

Actually, that doesn't sound feasible at all.

I agree. There is no way that will happen. At best, it might give Lionsgate some impetus to take advantage of Criterion's "misfortune" (well, our misfortune) and release these on Blu-ray in Region A themselves.