4K Blu-ray Confirmed, Coming in

[RedIsNotBlue]

Did you even take the TV out of the box and have you actually viewed any 4K material with your own eyes? That would probably help you on your decision on what to purchase in the future. The difference might be negligible to you it all depends on the individual. The difference won't be as huge as 480p to 1080p was.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

I corrected my post and while that did make sense back when DVD was launched I think the situation is different for 4K Blu-ray.

True, but HH has a constant height 2.35 screen which is why he's so keen on anamorphic 2.35 material. And, as with regular DVD, shirley it'd provide a resolution boost even when viewed 'squashed' into the correct proportions on a 16:9 display?

[hajiketobu]

i'd love to see 1,4:1 4K imax tv's....that would be awesome! (why hasnt this been done yet?)

[Geoff D]

There have been 4:3 TV's around for decades. Why don't you hunt down an old 4:3 rear-pro?

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

When Blu-ray 3D came out though the additional cost for adding the decoding hardware was fairly small and the cost difference was about $100. The cost difference for a 4K at 60 fps HEVC decoder is likely going to be a few hundred dollars. 4k resolution moves the base price of a 4K Blu-ray player high enough that the CE companies might be tempted to remove other features. A video format is a compromise between capability and cost so I did wonder how many of the features they listed in September would really get into the standard.

not sure what your point is since it has nothing to do with the discussion. I agree that any format is a compromise. But the discussion was if 2160p60 is the new 4k spec (to use the same thing you mentioned) could they allow for 1080p60. If 2160p60 would be too expensive a feature and so abandoned and it will be 2160p24/p25/p30/i50/i60 just like it is now in 1080p there is no added feature in 2160 related to higher frame rate.

my point was that if 2160p60 is added with the 4k profile every 4k player will be able to play that film (it is in the spec), but if they add 1080p60 to that profile none of the existing SOC players will be able to play it so you can't use that for the feature film for a normal BD unless there is also a 1080p24/p30 version included that can play in every player. And anyone that wants to play that new BD would need a new player that plays that new profile. So the costs would be relatively the same as just using your 4k player

What happens though if the BDA starts adding extensions for 3D, high dynamic range, and all the other features they cut going forward? Will the BDA add all the extensions at once or are we going to get 4K Blu-ray discs/players with combinations of extensions? It is possible that 4K Blu-ray might be more complex than a 1080p+ video format that had everything.

1080p formats did not have everything, my original BD player cannot access live, it cannot access bonus view, it cannot access 3D, it cannot access d-box and it cannot take advantage of Atmos. My guess is HFR or HDR or anything like that is dropped from 4k it will be dropped from 4K. I doubt it will ever be added unless there is a lot of demand and material and it makes sense (with other stuff to add it or there is a work around). Some stuff like bonus view and live can easily be added because they don't affect playback of the feature film so if someone is interested they can get a new player to use them and if not they could continue with the old player, other stuff like Atmos it is backwards compatible so it did not even need a new profile.

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by kg1

Didn't know 4K TVs automatically upconvert to 4K.

They have to. Every Digital TV can only show their native resolution if you have a 720p panel display everything it shows will be in 720p if it is 1080p it will be 1080p and if it is 4k it will be 4k. The only other two option (which would just annoy people) would be to add black (or some other colour) around a 1080p picture or not to accept that resolution from the player.

The number and position of pixels in the display can't magically change based on the source

[Anthony P]

Originally Posted by JWFORD

Should I still continue to purchase Blu-rays knowing that they will eventually be outdated, much like DVDs, by the release of 4K Blu-ray? Of course, several titles may not get the 4K treatment, but those titles will also likely be the current cost of DVDs in the near future saving me 100s, if not 1000s of dollars.

it is up to you, personally I find the question a bit foolish from my perspective. You can always wait around and never enjoy anything to save a few dollars. Right, why buy them when 4k comes out and not wait for 8k?....

[Member-275053]

Originally Posted by Anthony P

it is up to you, personally I find the question a bit foolish from my perspective. You can always wait around and never enjoy anything to save a few dollars. Right, why buy them when 4k comes out and not wait for 8k?....

I don't think it's foolish to wait for a new technology to mature. But, I do think it is foolish to continue spending money on an outdated one. And, I wouldn't be saving a few dollars, but 100s.

I have well over 600 movies, so I think I have plenty to enjoy.

Obviously, it was foolish of me to pose the question to members on a thread devoted to the subject, however.

[Richard Paul]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

True, but HH has a constant height 2.35 screen which is why he's so keen on anamorphic 2.35 material. And, as with regular DVD, shirley it'd provide a resolution boost even when viewed 'squashed' into the correct proportions on a 16:9 display?

If anamorphic 4K video was shown on a 16:9 4K display than it would have to be scaled down by the player which would reduce video quality. If movies were made at 8K resolution and 8K displays were common than the situation would be different but I don't see that happening for a very long time.

Originally Posted by Anthony P

1080p formats did not have everything, my original BD player cannot access live, it cannot access bonus view, it cannot access 3D, it cannot access d-box and it cannot take advantage of Atmos. My guess is HFR or HDR or anything like that is dropped from 4k it will be dropped from 4K.

At a recent MPEG meeting Netflix gave a presentation in which they said that the three things they were interested in was high frame rate, wide color gamut, and high dynamic range.

Originally Posted by Anthony P

I doubt it will ever be added unless there is a lot of demand and material and it makes sense (with other stuff to add it or there is a work around). Some stuff like bonus view and live can easily be added because they don't affect playback of the feature film so if someone is interested they can get a new player to use them and if not they could continue with the old player, other stuff like Atmos it is backwards compatible so it did not even need a new profile.

I want 4K Blu-ray to do well and in my opinion if the BDA cuts out features in the next few months and than adds 3 or 4 extensions down the road that will cause it problems in the long term.

[bailey1987]

I was reading a Wikipedia article and I had a thought, when Blu-ray's were first released players were released to the Japanese market in 2004. It wasn't until January 2006 that players were released to the US market, it made me wonder if it could be Christmas 2016 for the US market and 2015 for the Japanese market.

I hope it's a global launch in all existing Blu-ray markets.

[PeterTHX]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

True, but HH has a constant height 2.35 screen which is why he's so keen on anamorphic 2.35 material. And, as with regular DVD, shirley it'd provide a resolution boost even when viewed 'squashed' into the correct proportions on a 16:9 display?

With 16x9 being the display spec for 4K I don't see them adding 21x9 anamorphic for small market segment that technically is out of spec.

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

If anamorphic 4K video was shown on a 16:9 4K display than it would have to be scaled down by the player which would reduce video quality. If movies were made at 8K resolution and 8K displays were common than the situation would be different but I don't see that happening for a very long time.

If ever...because from what I've seen & read, 16x9 is still the OAR for 8K.

[bailey1987]

Originally Posted by PeterTHX

With 16x9 being the display spec for 4K I don't see them adding 21x9 anamorphic for small market segment that technically is out of spec.





If ever...because from what I've seen & read, 16x9 is still the OAR for 8K.

I have read that at some point they want 2.10:1 (21:10) as an aspect ratio for home and theatrical use.

[GenPion]

Originally Posted by JWFORD

I don't think it's foolish to wait for a new technology to mature. But, I do think it is foolish to continue spending money on an outdated one. And, I wouldn't be saving a few dollars, but 100s.

I have well over 600 movies, so I think I have plenty to enjoy.

Obviously, it was foolish of me to pose the question to members on a thread devoted to the subject, however.

Personally, I don't think you can count on all Blu-ray's becoming super inexpensive once 4K Blu-ray is around. I also think a lot of films won't be upgraded to 4K Blu-ray. Some of them inevitably will, though. My personal suggestion would be to just pick up titles you know you want to have on Blu-ray and would be happy with having.

Sure, you might own a few titles which will eventually become upgraded, but then you can enjoy your movies as you like. If you'd rather just wait though, upgrades might be several years away... and there are many titles which will never be upgraded.

[Member-275053]

Originally Posted by GenPion

Personally, I don't think you can count on all Blu-ray's becoming super inexpensive once 4K Blu-ray is around. I also think a lot of films won't be upgraded to 4K Blu-ray. Some of them inevitably will, though. My personal suggestion would be to just pick up titles you know you want to have on Blu-ray and would be happy with having.

Sure, you might own a few titles which will eventually become upgraded, but then you can enjoy your movies as you like. If you'd rather just wait though, upgrades might be several years away... and there are many titles which will never be upgraded.

Thank you for your response. I agree, I will probably just purchase the titles that are my favorites for now. Although, that's what I started out doing and then it kind of got out of hand, hence the 600+ TV and movie titles.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Richard Paul

If anamorphic 4K video was shown on a 16:9 4K display than it would have to be scaled down by the player which would reduce video quality.

I don't remember people complaining that anamorphic DVD looked lower quality on a 4:3 TV than a non-anamorphic DVD. Admittedly, companies like Criterion initially shied away from anamorphic 16:9 because they thought that the 'squeezing' process could result in artefacts on 4:3 TVs, but their concerns were unfounded and even on a 4:3 TV the resolution difference between non-anamorphic and anamorphic DVD was clearly obvious.

I'll always wonder about anamorphic 21:9 material (having owned a 21:9 TV myself a few years ago) and the CEA tried to put some standards in place in 2011, but it all seems to have fallen by the wayside - yet it's still fun to speculate.

[saprano]

Originally Posted by JWFORD

I purchased a Samsung 50" 3D 4K UHD TV (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/samsung-...&skuId=4496004) from Best Buy during Black Friday Week. But, after doing more research I have learned that this technology is still in it's infancy and continually developing. So, I returned the TV. That's fine. My current TV will suffice for now and I saved $1500.00. But, my questions is where does this leave me in regards to Blu-ray purchases over the next few years? Should I still continue to purchase Blu-rays knowing that they will eventually be outdated, much like DVDs, by the release of 4K Blu-ray? Of course, several titles may not get the 4K treatment, but those titles will also likely be the current cost of DVDs in the near future saving me 100s, if not 1000s of dollars.

You're already concidering bluray being obsolete and outdated? There's nothing to worry about. Continue buying the latest BD's you want. You can't compare BD to *4KBD the same way as DVD to BD. Bluray is still a HQ format and i think it will coexist with *4KBDs. There will be no mass 4K adoption next year.

[Mansinthe]

people said very similar stuff while DVD is the way to buy movies.
no offense , but lets wait till prices for hardware drop a bit more (till you get these consumer best buy , amazon christmas deals) and lets see how many people are gonna rebuy star wars , star trek , indiana jones, alien, transformers, twilight , blade runner, rambo , rocky , batman and all that stuff...

if that not does the trick wait for avatar 1-4 in 4k..

its just a matter of time/price till people with way to small TVs to enjoy 4k will upgrade as well. maybe a year.. maybe 2 or 3 but it will happen.


people will again say stuff like "im gonna upgrade my favorite movies only"... yeah sure ^_^


i will really try to resist this time around ! its just so much a waste of money to be honest....

[mrpink134]

Originally Posted by saprano

You're already concidering bluray being obsolete and outdated? There's nothing to worry about. Continue buying the latest BD's you want. You can't compare BD to *4KBD the same way as DVD to BD. Bluray is still a HQ format and i think it will coexist with *4KBDs. There will be no mass 4K adoption next year.

You are 100% correct, I have seen the 4K TV and yes I will buy one but I don't think it will be that much of a difference between the 2 to the naked eye unless you have a huge screen

[saprano]

Originally Posted by Mansinthe

people said very similar stuff while DVD is the way to buy movies.
no offense , but lets wait till prices for hardware drop a bit more (till you get these consumer best buy , amazon christmas deals) and lets see how many people are gonna rebuy star wars , star trek , indiana jones, alien, transformers, twilight , blade runner, rambo , rocky , batman and all that stuff...

if that not does the trick wait for avatar 1-4 in 4k..

its just a matter of time/price till people with way to small TVs to enjoy 4k will upgrade as well. maybe a year.. maybe 2 or 3 but it will happen.


people will again say stuff like "im gonna upgrade my favorite movies only"... yeah sure ^_^


i will really try to resist this time around ! its just so much a waste of money to be honest....

Again, DVD to BD is not the same as BD to 4K. When bluray was coming out DVD felt like old tech. Not so with bluray.

Originally Posted by mrpink134

You are 100% correct, I have seen the 4K TV and yes I will buy one but I don't think it will be that much of a difference between the 2 to the naked eye unless you have a huge screen

The change to flat screens alone was a huge improvement over the 4X3 tube design. We're not changing anything this time so the "OMG this is different" novelty is not there.

[mrpink134]

Originally Posted by saprano

Again, DVD to BD is not the same as BD to 4K. When bluray was coming out DVD felt like old tech. Not so with bluray.



The change to flat screens alone was a huge improvement over the 4X3 tube design. We're not changing anything this time so the "OMG this is different" novelty is not there.

I agree