HDR Discussion Thread

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by bytor

Thanks, he is on this forum?....

Regularly reading, highly doubtful. But if you can post more timestamps of these unintentional anomalies which can also be corroborated by other viewers, the info could eventually get to the content creator(s) by a non-linear pathway. Anyone who digs down to the pixel level to get rid of some magenta - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85lVPc0eAM0#t=23m34s

is driven to perfection and would be bugged at what you’re describing with Roma, if verified.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

the info could eventually get to the content creator(s) by a non-linear pathway.....

As an aside, this is how Netflix’s SDR version of Annihilation got fixed.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Asia....are far ahead of the USA

We could be more progressive (less “rural”) with regards to other things too…..http://www.latimes.com/business/hilt...109-story.html

leading to the development of 5G which could easily handle native 8K HDR HFR - https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...k#post15537077

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

Contrary to what some might have thought, the shoulder patch on Tom’s high altitude suit -> https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...s#post15798829
is not that of the Space Force….

But don’t be surprised though to see this logo on caps worn by some on the TG: M movie set (and/or their family and friends)…..

[Robert Zohn]

Originally Posted by PaulGo

In order to broadcast 4K won't the broadcasters need to use ATSC 3.0 and the sets be capable of receiving OTA ATSC 3.0. Another to receive the broadcast of course would be cable and I assume the 4K would be in the HLG format for live content.

Yes, we'll use ATSC 3.0 for the cable carriers to transmit 4K HDR via OTT and IP. The O&O and independent stations will also use ATSC 3.0 to deliver 4K HDR if they choose to do so.

Originally Posted by avs commenter

Broadcasters won't be in any hurry to upgrade to ATSC 3.0 until there is a proven way to make money from it.

Correct and that's one of my points of disappointment with how this is going. Seems like the broadcasters and cable carriers have already decided and that to use ATSC 3.0 for the following items with no consideration for the main value and benefit of ATSC 3.0 and that's 4K HDR.

Here's how cable and broadcasters plan on using ATSC 3.0 along with the new 5G delivery system:

- Pushing content to a second screen with ads or other information in your home of mobile device.

- Use 5G to deliver cable programming to your cell phone

- Slice up the bandwidth to deliver more subcarriers

- Enable 2-way feedback for buying products over the cable channel and other apps that could use the feedback.

4K HLG HDR with Technicolor's "single layer" 4K HLG will become available from select ATSC 3.0 capable OTA transmitters. I'll be advocating the O&Os and Independence stations to take advantage of this technology to begin delivery of full 10bit, 4K, HLG HDR broadcast OTA and hopefully even over IP. Of course, I want PQ, like HDR10, not the analog HLG and the old analog gamma, but at this time I'll be happy with baby steps to get us better image quality from our beloved broadcasters.

Footnote, "Single layer" is how Technicolor developed a version of HLG HDR that coexists with the FHD/SDR broadcast so no new equipment or HDR shader is needed to deliver the HDR signal.

[avs commenter]

Getting broadcast channels for free over 5G on your phone would be a game changer

edit: but probably not since they will likely lock you out of anything actually worth watching unless you have a paid subscription

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Robert Zohn

Food and drinks were great as was the nice time I had reminiscing with old friends from my TV Broadcast days. But again I'm very sad to say TV Broadcasters do not seem to have much interest in delivering 4K HDR.

Very sad to see the broadcasters that control so much content staying with the last generation of 720p/1080i SDR domain. Someone need to wake them up so they stop the bleeding of the consumers to the 4K HDR streaming services. Broadcasters need to look ahead and ascend with the times.

Except for the nourishment and reminiscing, sounds like a technological waste of time. Sorry to hear that. Alternatively, I should have given you a heads-up to this freebie earlier in the week - https://www.eventbrite.com/e/exclusi...ts-53923964028

When these ^ monitors become rentable, could be a good reference for use with your future consumer TV shootouts in years to come.

[Penton-Man]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Hah! Medicine is clearly not my forte.

^ Finally , for us here in SoCal

[2themax]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

“Previous discussions I’ve had with industry experts have suggested that while fitting HDR10+ and Dolby Vision versions of films on single discs might be possible, doing so could potentially cause image quality issues due to disc space limitations.”

^ ? John’s another journo who reads Blu-ray.com for cutting edge information (past discussion between 2themax, Geoff and myself as documented several months ago on this thread)

Cool

Might as well update the documentation. It'll be 1 encode so no space problems

[gkolb]

Originally Posted by 2themax

Might as well update the documentation. It'll be 1 encode so no space problems

So, you’re saying one base layer (incl the HDR10+ dynamic metadata), plus a second layer with DoVi dynamic metadata and any 12-bit combo data. Yes?

2 base layers not required.

[MisterXDTV]

Originally Posted by gkolb

So, you’re saying one base layer (incl the HDR10+ dynamic metadata), plus a second layer with DoVi dynamic metadata and any 12-bit combo data. Yes?

2 base layers not required.

Based on BDInfo reports it seems that way:

You have the HDR10 base layer including HDR10+ metadata (just a few kb/s)

Then the Dolby Vision optional layer (1080p resolution) to be combined

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by DanBa

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Penton-Man

As an aside, this is how Netflix’s SDR version of Annihilation got fixed.

Thank goodness for that, as the initial SDR stream was hilariously blown out. I fondly recall taking flak from several forums members when I derided it for looking as it did, them conflating my complaints with not liking Rob Hardy's photography.

[LordoftheRings]

Is he the brother of the guy who plays Venom ...

[Geoff D]

In as much as Jerry Bruckheimer is related to Chuck Norris.

[Staying Salty]

Originally Posted by 2themax

Might as well update the documentation. It'll be 1 encode so no space problems

I was going to Thank this post but I can’t in good conscience. I am all in for the best consumer quality/value and I believe that dynamic metadata will deliver that (eventually ). But I believe that we, the consumer, are best served by having our AV products support all HDR formats rather than the software. That way we can choose the delivery system that we feel best suites our needs. Plus, the easier we make it to produce on the disc side, the longer the studios will support it. over.

[Geoff D]

Yeah, but it's good that one piece of software can do both, right? Now that that potential hurdle has been cleared then there's less reason for the wider industry to hold off from providing both. And we're still barely three years into the whole kit 'n' kaboodle, so give it time...and throw 2themax some love. He's doing what he can from his side of things, no need to penalise him for something he's got no control over.

[Staying Salty]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Yeah, but it's good that one piece of software can do both, right?

In my opinion NO. That just enables the Hardware manufacturers to continue to do their own thing. I want an universal TV. How about if Technicolor enters the disc market???

Originally Posted by Geoff D

Now that that potential hurdle has been cleared then there's less reason for the wider industry to hold off from providing both.

How so? Seems to me the opposite as I stated above. I believe there would be more reason to provide both if the discs were either Dolby Vision or HDR10+. Every HDR10+ only streaming or disc movie is a reason for Samsung not to support DoVi and for LG and Sony to support HDR10+.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

And we're still barely three years into the whole kit 'n' kaboodle, so give it time...

Well for me time is running out. My purchase has to last 5 to 10 years and I want it to support as many options as possible. Right now Panasonic has the best options for me, but it is not available in the US. I am interested in IMAX Enhanced discs. No way that they will contain Dolby Vision. So if I stick to my dynamic meta data brings world peace, then Sony or LG must support HDR10+ to display it. That is a possibility for Sony and I would be happy, but I am fighting so every consumer can also. Same with Alita: Battle Angle, my most anticipated movie of 2019. That will be in HDR10+ and probably will never be in Dolby Vision on disc.

Originally Posted by Geoff D

..and throw 2themax some love. He's doing what he can from his side of things, no need to penalise him for something he's got no control over.

I realize that. I am not shooting the messenger, just the message.

you 2themax

Edit: There is NO WAY that every disc going forward will contain both Dolby Vision and HDR0+, so why not strive for universal hardware . That is achievable.

steps off

[Penton-Man]

And as Glenn Fry, right before the Eagles sang one of their famous songs at a concert, once said - “This is how it all began”…. https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread...t#post15538730

[LordoftheRings]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

In as much as Jerry Bruckheimer is related to Chuck Norris.

Ok, that's his sosie then.