Panasonic UB820/UB9000 4K UHD Blu-ray player

[gizmo83]

Not identical i think, the ub9000 it mounts a different disc drive with higher quality and a DAC (the ub820 doesn't)

[gizmo83]

about glitches, someone on the web suggest tu turn the VIERA link OFF. give it a try ;-)

[pbz06]

Originally Posted by johnny-torrance

With how erratic my UB820 is I'm not sure I'm gonna go for another Panasonic product anytime soon. I may just stick it out with my LG for another year or two and wait for something better to come onto the market. I really don't know, I've only had the Panasonic since November/December 2023 and it was great at first but it's quickly becoming a major disappointment and waste of money.

I get that, but I promise you that every product/manufacturer has a couple of owners who have ran into issues with their player and swear to never own one again. Although it might seem otherwise to you based on your experience, your chances of having better luck with another 820/9000 are just as good as with any other player.

[George.P]

Originally Posted by Hedrox

It doesn't, but people who have issues are more likely to post than those that have a perfectly working machine.

The UB9000 is substantially more expensive than the 820, so way less people own in, resulting in fewer complaints. While the build quality on the 9000 is better, the "guts" are more or less identical to the 820, so playback issues are just as likely to happen on that model as well. Given how these machines are mostly made to be replaced, not repaired, it can be a lot more frustrating if you eventually do run into problems on a UB9000.

Agreed on frequency of complaint and numbers, but the ub9000 and ub820 do have completely different disc drives which could account for some of the issues. Powers supplies are very different as well, but one wouldn't expect issues to be related to power supply design for something this simple. Sounds like the other fellow should make a warranty claim.

[George.P]

Originally Posted by johnny-torrance

With how erratic my UB820 is I'm not sure I'm gonna go for another Panasonic product anytime soon. I may just stick it out with my LG for another year or two and wait for something better to come onto the market. I really don't know, I've only had the Panasonic since November/December 2023 and it was great at first but it's quickly becoming a major disappointment and waste of money.

warranty?

[johnny-torrance]

Originally Posted by gizmo83

about glitches, someone on the web suggest tu turn the VIERA link OFF. give it a try ;-)

Yeah I did this. Still having issues.

[gizmo83]

It happened to me similar with the Wonka 4K disc on Ub420, I think is a total random error Refound or replacement requested .

And the Player mount last firmware available

I think UB420 and UB820 use very similar Optical Drive (not sure)

[lgans316]

1 in 5 4K discs glitches on my both my UB-820s but the mkv rip of them plays perfectly on my Zidoo. Sometimes the glitch goes away by doing a rewind or a fast forward by few seconds. Cleaning works sometimes although the disc itself might look spotless. Also I got like 15 4K/BD discs going bad just like that which is why I back-up immediately (don't preach me on piracy. I spend my hard earned money).

If you guys think your physical collection is safe, try pulling out some random 4K films that you haven't watched in ages and check if they play flawlessly.

[Ant1010]

Originally Posted by Hedrox

It doesn't, but people who have issues are more likely to post than those that have a perfectly working machine.

The UB9000 is substantially more expensive than the 820, so way less people own in, resulting in fewer complaints. While the build quality on the 9000 is better, the "guts" are more or less identical to the 820, so playback issues are just as likely to happen on that model as well. Given how these machines are mostly made to be replaced, not repaired, it can be a lot more frustrating if you eventually do run into problems on a UB9000.

You really think the extra 500 bucks is because of metal frame oppose to plastic lol. The guts for the 820 and 9000 are not identical. There is a reason why the 9000 is more expensive. I actually do own both and besides the 9000 looking nicer it plays much better than the 820 does.

[Geoff D]

Originally Posted by Ant1010

You really think the extra 500 bucks is because of metal frame oppose to plastic lol. The guts for the 820 and 9000 are not identical. There is a reason why the 9000 is more expensive. I actually do own both and besides the 9000 looking nicer it plays much better than the 820 does.

The 'brain' of the player is literally the same chip.

[sojrner]

Originally Posted by emgesp

Yeah, I assume the G4's improved brightness over my C1 will mean I can dial back the HDR Dynamic range setting.

Might be that I'm misunderstanding what you're saying, but increased peak brightness on a TV doesn't equate to "dim" HDR presentations suddenly getting less dim. (Which I read to be raising the black level, not just having piercing highlights) There are so many layers on that, but whether the disk is intentionally "dim" or not, it gets mapped by the display and/or player, and I think that function, not the overall brightness, sets "good" from "bad' here. (and is how I interpret Geoffy's comment)

As a fellow C1 owner running in a light controlled room (All auto stuff off, Dolby Cinema dark, no increase on HDR levels in player like you mentioned) with zero reflections, the only issue I've ever experienced as "too dim" is the aggressive ABL kicking in during dim scenes. Recent LG updates have made that less aggressive, but getting a service remote and turning that off is the better option if you're noticing it kick in. For me, any future upgrade will not be LG, as the processing has oddities I don't like compared to Sony, but a "dim" image isn't one of them.

If you are in a bright room with reflections, an OLED may not be the best, even the G4 or a high-end Sony. The black level and detail within those "dim" images is kinda the point, and that nuance gets lost on an OLED in lots of ambient light... IMHO.

[PUsokrJosh305]

Originally Posted by sojrner

Might be that I'm misunderstanding what you're saying, but increased peak brightness on a TV doesn't equate to "dim" HDR presentations suddenly getting less dim. (Which I read to be raising the black level, not just having piercing highlights) There are so many layers on that, but whether the disk is intentionally "dim" or not, it gets mapped by the display and/or player, and I think that function, not the overall brightness, sets "good" from "bad' here. (and is how I interpret Geoffy's comment)

As a fellow C1 owner running in a light controlled room (All auto stuff off, Dolby Cinema dark, no increase on HDR levels in player like you mentioned) with zero reflections, the only issue I've ever experienced as "too dim" is the aggressive ABL kicking in during dim scenes. Recent LG updates have made that less aggressive, but getting a service remote and turning that off is the better option if you're noticing it kick in. For me, any future upgrade will not be LG, as the processing has oddities I don't like compared to Sony, but a "dim" image isn't one of them.

If you are in a bright room with reflections, an OLED may not be the best, even the G4 or a high-end Sony. The black level and detail within those "dim" images is kinda the point, and that nuance gets lost on an OLED in lots of ambient light... IMHO.

It's actually been proven that HDR10 discs on older LG OLED TVs do look dimmer than other brands like Sony. This is partially, at least from my gathering of info, due to Sony having it's Dynamic Tone Mapping always "On" and it's processing is better. Where as LG's is not "On" by default and that most people seem to say stay away from LG's DTM. With the G4 though, LG's processing has gotten a lot better and seems to be almost on par with Sony's. Even LG's DTM has been improved.

Now personally for my LG C9, I use LG's DTM and the Panny's Optimizer at the same time. I used to have my Panny set to Super High Luminance but realized earlier this year that it takes some saturation out of the HDR compared to having it on OLED. LG's DTM has been known for blowing the highlights out, so I lower the Dynamic Range adjustment slider to -5. From what I can tell, that compensates for LG's DTM issues. This is just my setup though.

[lgans316]

Sony have the flakiest implementation of Dolby Vision. Sometimes Dark will look fine and sometimes it will look dimmer than reference as if is is under tracking Eotf.

Apparently this is still not fixed which is a shame.

When I watch something I first check which one looks pleasing to my eyes and then switch between Dark and Bright. When I see clipping I immediately switch modes.
.

With HDR everything is already maxed out. So watching super dark scenes in a bright room is going to look bad on almost any display.

[pjl69]

This whole HDR/Dolby Vision technology with different players and televisions is getting too complicated and technical for my taste. I'm starting to regret that I started collecting 4K UHD discs at all.

[emgesp]

Originally Posted by sojrner

Might be that I'm misunderstanding what you're saying, but increased peak brightness on a TV doesn't equate to "dim" HDR presentations suddenly getting less dim. (Which I read to be raising the black level, not just having piercing highlights) There are so many layers on that, but whether the disk is intentionally "dim" or not, it gets mapped by the display and/or player, and I think that function, not the overall brightness, sets "good" from "bad' here. (and is how I interpret Geoffy's comment)

As a fellow C1 owner running in a light controlled room (All auto stuff off, Dolby Cinema dark, no increase on HDR levels in player like you mentioned) with zero reflections, the only issue I've ever experienced as "too dim" is the aggressive ABL kicking in during dim scenes. Recent LG updates have made that less aggressive, but getting a service remote and turning that off is the better option if you're noticing it kick in. For me, any future upgrade will not be LG, as the processing has oddities I don't like compared to Sony, but a "dim" image isn't one of them.

If you are in a bright room with reflections, an OLED may not be the best, even the G4 or a high-end Sony. The black level and detail within those "dim" images is kinda the point, and that nuance gets lost on an OLED in lots of ambient light... IMHO.

I have the service remote and disabled the TPC setting, so its not the TPC kicking in. For HDR10 I use cinema preset with all the AI stuff turned off. There simply are some HDR10 4K discs like Beetlejuice and Dial of Destiny where the average picture brightness is simply too dim for my liking even in a completely dark room. I want the average picture level brightness to be more like a standard Blu-ray. Never had issues like this with Blu-ray, but for some reason some 4K discs are mastered with super dim average picture level and I have no idea why. This is why I'm so happy I upgraded to the Panny UB820 so I can brighten the image up on those titles without having to rely on my C1's inferior DTM feature.

I understand the concept of dynamic range, but that shouldn't mean you should have to sacrifice average picture brightness for a true HDR experience.

Thankfully, most 4K discs I own don't have this issue and have reasonable average picture brightness, so it obviously comes down to how the studios are mastering some 4K titles.

[Geoff D]

And do you run SDR at the intended ~100 nits, or....?

[emgesp]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

And do you run SDR at the intended ~100 nits, or....?

I doubt it.

Cinema mode

OLED Pixel Brightness: 60

Contrast: 85

Brightness: 50

ADC: Off

Peak Brightness: High

Gamma: 2.2

[Geoff D]

Fair enough. I ain't no expert on LG settings but I doubt that's anywhere near 100 nits peak for SDR. And that's kinda the problem - not with you, you do you - but with the wider perception of HDR: there are some discs that truly are abnormally dim (Heat, tho I still likes it, precious) but most of them don't run massively below the SDR equivalent for average picture brightness when SDR is viewed at 100 nits peak. So when viewed in that capacity most HDR discs are on or about SDR levels, with a bit more juice reserved for the brightest highlights and shots. But when SDR viewing levels are higher to begin with then that comparative level - bearing in mind that PQ-derived HDR is an absolute luminance format, so what it's mastered to is what it should be viewed at - can make some HDR look awfully dim when it's really not.

This is why ambient-light-sensing modes were all the rage a few years back (Dolby IQ), as they were designed to boost the average levels of HDR images so that they'd be more punchy for 'regular' viewing conditions. Trouble is, when you start raising the average brightness relative to your peaks - which unlike the average can't get any higher than what the TV is already capable of - then you're drastically compacting the intended dynamic range...but then if someone's watching in the daytime with the curtains wide open then dynamic range don't mean shit. And of coursh the other problem with such IQ modes is that the most popular HDR screen type by far - OLED, natch - has built-in issues with full-field brightness, in that the higher the brightness across the whole screen the more aggressively it gets limited and that's not something that can be turned off AFAIK.

It's just...yeah. I think HDR is absolutely amazing as a format in itself but a complete and total cluster**** of an implementation.

[Ant1010]

Originally Posted by Geoff D

The 'brain' of the player is literally the same chip.

I always respect your opinions around here Geoff but the selling points were the Projector HDR Optimiser. The 9000 HDR Optimizer has an additional mode for projectors which the 820 doesn’t which makes a difference for me, and also the Noise. its literally dead silent, especially compared to the 820. It being THX certified is nice as well, I believe the 820 isn't.

[sojrner]

Originally Posted by Ant1010

I always respect your opinions around here Geoff but the selling points were the Projector HDR Optimiser. The 9000 HDR Optimizer has an additional mode for projectors which the 820 doesn’t which makes a difference for me, and also the Noise. its literally dead silent, especially compared to the 820. It being THX certified is nice as well, I believe the 820 isn't.

I believe the HDR optimizer modes were normalized in the previous update... But you're right about the nose, which has more to do with the internal disc player itself and the build quality. It's still the same processor.