The Criterion Collection

[WailingJennings]

I had considered getting Mulholland Drive, Princess Bride, and Silence of the Lambs from the Criterion sale. I only really need one version, and the bonus features/packaging aren't super critical enough to make me keep multiple copies.

I'm very likely to hold off for the Kino 4K on SOTL. Should I wait for the other 2? It seems like US releases of them on 4K are coming sooner than later? Or am I way off base? If there are still 2+ years away I don't mind getting the Criterions but it seems like international releases are already out there so the states may be close behind?

[lidocaineus]

Originally Posted by rooprect

Why Criterion will never go to 4k


My expertise is audio engineering, and I've been working since the days of cassette tapes. A similar progress/evolution happened in the audio world and maxed out in the 1990s with CD quality (16 bit, 44.1kHz). CD quality is laughably horrible compared to what technology currently offers (32 bit, 384kHz). But CD remains the consumer standard 30 years later, and most audiophiles have accepted that consumer audio (digital) aint getting another upgrade in our lifetimes. Around the 2000s, record labels flirted with DVDa (24 bit, 96kHz) releases for the consumer market. Didn't go well. Sure, audiophiles lapped it up, but planet earth at large was happy with CD.

More disturbingly, planet earth at large has subsequently lowered its standards to mp3 quality, marking the clear intersection of size/portability vs quality where demand rests. This left the DVDa crowd hanging, eternally. To a lesser degree, I think this is what will happen with 4k. It won't go obsolete like DVDa, but I think it will remain limited to new films which are already shot in digital so 4k is a no brainer. Older films which require transfers and extensive restoration just aren't worth the trouble.

This is a weird statement, especially from someone who's supposedly an audio engineer. DVD-a wasn't really popular, but the competitor, SACD, is still a thing to this day, and DSD (the 1-bit format SACD uses) is arguably even more popular than SACD ever was. It's also weird to state that people have "accepted" mp3 as the standard format, when pretty much no service uses MP3 anymore due to its inferior performance in terms of bitrate vs sound quality and size. This isn't to say lossy formats aren't "standard", but for someone in the industry to state it's MP3 is… odd. Unless you're referring to lossy formats in general as "mp3 quality", I guess.

Add to the all this the fact that lossless formats are a small but heavily watched niche (all the big players now have lossless offerings, with Spotify being the only holdout and has been ever so slowly inching towards it) and your comparison to the Criterion 4k situation is fairly clumsy.

[wobelix]

Originally Posted by lidocaineus

This is a weird statement, especially from someone who's supposedly an audio engineer. DVD-a wasn't really popular, but the competitor, SACD, is still a thing to this day, and DSD (the 1-bit format SACD uses) is arguably even more popular than SACD ever was. It's also weird to state that people have "accepted" mp3 as the standard format, when pretty much no service uses MP3 anymore due to its inferior performance in terms of bitrate vs sound quality and size. This isn't to say lossy formats aren't "standard", but for someone in the industry to state it's MP3 is… odd. Unless you're referring to lossy formats in general as "mp3 quality", I guess.

Add to the all this the fact that lossless formats are a small but heavily watched niche (all the big players now have lossless offerings, with Spotify being the only holdout and has been ever so slowly inching towards it) and your comparison to the Criterion 4k situation is fairly clumsy.

Tentalizing discussion!
Thanks to the both of you!

[bonehica]

Anyone who owns this set care to let me know what the packaging is like. Similar to the Cassavetes/Sternberg sets? Digipaks for each release? Seems to be the case, but want to be 100%. Thanks!

[zackisthewalrus]

Originally Posted by bonehica

Anyone who owns this set care to let me know what the packaging is like. Similar to the Cassavetes/Sternberg sets? Digipaks for each release? Seems to be the case, but want to be 100%. Thanks!

https://www.criterionforum.org/Packa...ection-blu-ray

this should answer your question

[bipbop13]

Originally Posted by Rayjg

They ain't giving us anything. Booklets are bought and paid for along with the rest of the package

If they took away the booklets that people whine about if they have a 1/16" crinkle in, you'd still buy the precious criterions at the same price or even more. As I stated before, stop whining.

[HipsterTrash]

Man...I hope Aronofsky is still harassing Criterion in getting The Fountain onto the label. Would love if he could get Pi on there too, if Lionsgate ain't going to release it themselves. If Jarmusch can get Ghost Dog onto the label, then why can't Aronosky do the same?

[dvining]

Originally Posted by HipsterTrash

Man...I hope Aronofsky is still harassing Criterion in getting The Fountain onto the label. Would love if he could get Pi on there too, if Lionsgate ain't going to release it themselves. If Jarmusch can get Ghost Dog onto the label, then why can't Aronosky do the same?

Maybe they aren't fans.

[Member-222782]

I was massively underwhelmed by The Fountain after hearing about it for quite a while prior to my theatrical viewing. It was one of those films you walk out of wondering what the heck you just watched. I never did revisit the film on video after that experience even though I was so intrigued by the storyline (still am). Maybe Criterion can reassemble some semblance of Aronofsky's original edit - that is, if Criterion wants to.

[HipsterTrash]

Originally Posted by dvining

Maybe they aren't fans.

Possibly haha.
Aronosky tanked since Black Swan, but I really enjoy his first four films. I can't believe they never nabbed The Fountain and let him do his new cut he wanted to do.

Originally Posted by Cinema84

I was massively underwhelmed by The Fountain after hearing about it for quite a while prior to my theatrical viewing. It was one of those films you walk out of wondering what the heck you just watched. I never did revisit the film on video after that experience even though I was so intrigued by the storyline (still am). Maybe Criterion can reassemble some semblance of Aronofsky's original edit - that is, if Criterion wants to.

I can understand that. It's a film that gets a lot of praise but also has a thin presentation to it. I'm sure Aronofsky has a cut that he wanted to release that he would go for.

[yoloswegmaster420]

Originally Posted by HipsterTrash

Man...I hope Aronofsky is still harassing Criterion in getting The Fountain onto the label. Would love if he could get Pi on there too, if Lionsgate ain't going to release it themselves. If Jarmusch can get Ghost Dog onto the label, then why can't Aronosky do the same?

Because Jim Jarmusch owns the rights to Ghost Dog now, and so he decided to license the rights to Criterion.

[bonehica]

Originally Posted by zackisthewalrus

https://www.criterionforum.org/Packa...ection-blu-ray

this should answer your question

Thanks! Surprised nobody posted photos of the packaging on this site.

[dvining]

Originally Posted by bonehica

Thanks! Surprised nobody posted photos of the packaging on this site.

The guy who posts those is, I think, a retailer who gets advanced copies of every release that he posts pictures of. Good idea to bookmark him for future reference.

[DimitriL]

Originally Posted by yoloswegmaster420

Because Jim Jarmusch owns the rights to Ghost Dog now, and so he decided to license the rights to Criterion.

Yup. He owns the negatives to every one of his films, which is remarkable.

[HipsterTrash]

Originally Posted by yoloswegmaster420

Because Jim Jarmusch owns the rights to Ghost Dog now, and so he decided to license the rights to Criterion.

Originally Posted by DimitriL

Yup. He owns the negatives to every one of his films, which is remarkable.

Damn. Lucky Dog Jim.

[BaronVH]

Originally Posted by lidocaineus

This is a weird statement, especially from someone who's supposedly an audio engineer. DVD-a wasn't really popular, but the competitor, SACD, is still a thing to this day, and DSD (the 1-bit format SACD uses) is arguably even more popular than SACD ever was. It's also weird to state that people have "accepted" mp3 as the standard format, when pretty much no service uses MP3 anymore due to its inferior performance in terms of bitrate vs sound quality and size. This isn't to say lossy formats aren't "standard", but for someone in the industry to state it's MP3 is… odd. Unless you're referring to lossy formats in general as "mp3 quality", I guess.

Add to the all this the fact that lossless formats are a small but heavily watched niche (all the big players now have lossless offerings, with Spotify being the only holdout and has been ever so slowly inching towards it) and your comparison to the Criterion 4k situation is fairly clumsy.

His point is people unfortunately prefer inferior quality. I wish they didn’t. And please tell me where I can go buy new SACDs. 99.999% of the population have no idea what lossless audio is, and his comparison to Criterion 4K is spot on. I really, really wish it wasn’t. Nevertheless, I do think there will be a niche market for the best quality for physical releases of films. People are just going to have to understand that they are not going to be available at $19.99. If they are then we are in trouble.

[DukeTogo84]

Not sure why the debate is going on if Criterion will be going 4K. Evidence was presented to a moderator that was said to be legit. I think that should be enough. It looks like it should be happening in the next few months if not for the November releases.

[Professor Echo]

All of this "will they or won't they" talk gets really silly after awhile. I understand that Criterion does things their own way and sometimes conducts their business differently than other organizations in the home entertainment industry. But they are not from another planet. They are still a BUSINESS and they are certainly not going to ignore a trend in their particular trade. Especially due to some bizarre notion that they are going to preserve only what has proved successful for them in the past.

These guys are not nor have they ever been churning out shoelaces. As the market has evolved, so have they. The same droning of "will they or won't they" was around when Laserdiscs were fading and DVDs first appeared and it returned when Blu-rays began to increase in popularity. The same old discussions we are mired in now, so my question is: Why would Criterion suddenly stop and say, "ok, that's it, this is where we draw the line and we will never change again?" Come on, that's ridiculous.

In a business that is rumored to be endangered and actively looking for new ideas to stimulate the market and perhaps expand their customer base, they are going to dig their feet in and say, "Nope. Let others jump on the fad, but here at Criterion, we will never change again." They didn't do that with DVD, they didn't do it with Blu-rays and they won't do it with 4K. Elevate Criterion to the most exalted standard there is, but don't forget about common sense. In the end they are still a BUSINESS, not guardians of a sacred tomb that cannot be disturbed. They will do it in their own way and their own time, but make no mistake about it, they WILL do it.

[bergman864]

I finally crossed it off my list.



Been wanting it for the longest and passing on it to pick up other titles. Told myself I was gonna finally do it and I did.

[BluLobsta]

Originally Posted by mmarczi

While I have zero regrets about purchasing this, the Late Ozu Eclipse set is BY FAR the thing in Criterion's catalogue most in need of an upgrade for me personally. Honestly, I would be more excited about an Ozu box set than a Kurosawa box set, I think, if push came to shove. But on the Late Ozu set, every single one of those films merits an individual release. All five of them are at least as good as The Flavor of Green Tea Over Rice, for example.

You can get most Ozu releases with 4K scans on Amazon Japan, but they will be MUCH more expensive obviously, than say picking up the Eclipse set. I did this with Late Spring. What a beautiful release (and the film ain’t bad either ) The booklet is beautiful but you have to read it back to front and be fluent in Japanese. I know hiragana, katakana and some common Kanji but I’m lost trying to read it I love Criterion and try to be loyal when I can. An Ozu set would be awesome! They may even have an Ozu set on Amazon Japan but I can’t remember.