The Criterion Collection

[jayembee]

Originally Posted by jw007

A funny thing has happened to me... I stopped enjoying Steven Spielberg movies. Yes, crazy that I just stated this but its true. It's either ponderous/difficult watching his "serious" films (Amistad, Lincoln, Schindlers List, Saving Private Ryan, The Color Purple) or just too adolescent/ditzy with his "fun" films (Temple of Doom, Hook, E.T., 1941). Then there are his sci-fi films (with the exception of E.T. which I just cannot watch - don't ask me why) such as Close Encounters, Jurassic Park, A.I., Minority Report and War of the Worlds which I find the most watchable of all his films. Well, actually, even Close Encounters of the Third Kind is starting to become too ponderous for me to watch again now. Yes, its a classic film, yes its his update of B-horror, yes it features Truffaut, but I just don't enjoy watching that movie anymore! Okay, I don't want to open a can of Spielberg worms here (oh, I think I just did), but I just stopped enjoying his movies because mostly the lack of depth and substance in many of his movies.

Welcome to the club! With two exceptions (Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull and Lincoln) I haven't watched a Spielberg film since Schindler's List.

I think his biggest flaw is being overly manipulative. All art is inherently manipulative, but a talented artist does it covertly. When I see a film by someone like Kubrick or Kurosawa or Lean or Huston, I see Oz the Great the Powerful. When I see a film by Spielberg, I see a man behind the curtain pulling levers and barking into a microphone.

A perfect example is E.T.: I realized what the problem was when I first saw the movie Airplane II: The Sequel later the same year (1982). There's a scene where passengers are arriving at the gate to board the moon shuttle. One group of passengers is a couple with their young son and his dog Scraps. The security guard says, "You're going to the moon?" and the boy answers, "Yes, and I'm taking my dog Scraps!" The guard replies, "Oh, I'm sorry, they don't allow dogs on the moon. We'll have to shoot him here," and he takes out his gun and shoots the dog. The dog collapses on the floor. The family is stunned. Tears start streaming down the boy's face. Then the guard says, "Ha ha, only kidding, just blanks!" Scraps gets back up and everyone laughs.

When Spielberg kills off E.T., wringing all kinds of emotion out of his audience, and then miraculously brings him back to life, I felt like he was saying to us, "Ha ha, only kidding, just blanks!" The way I see it, it's being contemptuous of his audience.

There are still some of his films that I think fondly of, like Empire of the Sun and Always, but I haven't seen them in a long time, and I'm almost afraid to revisit them.

At the moment, there are only a small handful of his films in my collection. I have the Blu-rays of Jaws and Lincoln (and as I mentioned some replies ago, I'm probably going to sell off the latter), and the Criterion LD of Close Encounters of the Third Kind. And courtesy of my wife, we have the Jurassic Park Trilogy and A.I. on DVD. Oh, and we have a Blu-ray of War Horse, which we got for Christmas.

[CHEЯNOБLY!]

Originally Posted by jw007

Yes, its always an event or something very special when a new Spielberg movie comes out...but of course this is in my opinion as well...the films don't hold up so well over time (I won't say this for every one of his films though... some I find very intriguing still... such as Munich or Empire of the Sun). Certain directors for me I'll probably never lose interest in (such as Kubrick or Scorcese) but I feel like Spielberg, at times, could have been one of the greatest directors for adolescents and teenagers (as opposed to adults)...or maybe its just Spielberg's fantastic imagination that makes us adults feel like kids again.
Will Spielberg ever make it to the Criterion Collection on DVD or Blu-ray? I doubt it!

I think this is a main theme in many of his early films. I can still watch Jaws any day of the week. The Indiana films also hold a special place as experiences from my childhood. Will he ever be in the CC? No, his films make too much money.

[SilentDawn]

The Spielberg hate in here is strong.

[Scottie]

Originally Posted by SilentDawn

The Spielberg hate in here is strong.

His best film is, without a doubt, A.I. Artificial Intelligence.

[SilentDawn]

Originally Posted by iScottie

His best film, without a doubt, is A.I. Artificial Intelligence.

I just recently saw that for the first time and it instantly became my 3rd favorite Spielberg film. (Just behind Jurassic Park and Raiders Of The Lost Ark respectively)

It's sorely underrated, with wonderful visuals and a beautiful ending.

In Criterion news, I just saw Rififi, and I found it very enjoyable.

[Fellini912]

Originally Posted by bwdowiak

I've never liked Spielberg. I remember liking the first few seasons of the TV show Dawson's Creek and thinking "Why the hell does Dawson aspire to be Steven Spielberg? Why can't he admire a filmmaker better than him?" Being that that show goes back 15 years, I guess you can say that I've been no fun just about all my life. (cue Iggy and The Stooges)

Iggy Pop is the true king of Rock and roll.

Spielberg is for me a nostalgia director. The majority of his movies are about the suspense and action, remove those technical aspects you have a devoid film. Most Spielberg films fall in the same depth of the story level as Disney films.

Munich, The Terminal and his biopics are probably his only films with more substantial story.

[The Great Owl]

What's up with all of the Spielberg naysayers?

I'm the proud owner of a few choice Steven Spielberg movies, and I cannot imagine falling out of love with these movies...

Duel
This one is suspenseful and epic without wasting a single second. This is movie minimalism done right, and I've loved it since childhood. Duel really needs a Blu-ray upgrade.

Jaws
Jaws deserves every ounce of its acclaim over the decades. It's a masterwork example of how to pace a story for maximum effect and how to generate suspense. Yes, this movie borrows heavily from Alfred Hitchcock's The Birds, but it does so with tremendous glee. I love the lived-in feel of the movie and the easy-going character interactions. The shark effects are awesome...just awesome.
I also love how the people on the beach in Jaws actually look like real people. Pudgy little kids, weathered elderly people, people with goofy clothes, etc. If Jaws were made today by another director, everyone on the beach would have a perfect body with six-pack abs.
(Also, the fact that the Mayor was played by Murray Hamilton, who also starred in Anatomy of a Murder and Seconds, makes this a Criterion-related post. Faintly, yes, but surely.)

Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Another Spielberg film that looks so much more epic and expensive than it probably was. It's heartwarming in a way that doesn't overstay its welcome.

Raiders of the Lost Ark
One of the most perfect adventure films, and a beautiful throwback to matinee movies of the old days.
Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom
A near-perfect adventure film that cracks me up to this day. Gotta love the dinner scene. "I had bugs for lunch." "Snake surprise!" "Chilled monkey brains!"
Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade
The concept manages to avoid wearing thin here, thanks to some outstanding chase scenes.
Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull
I dock this one several points for the use of digital effects, but it's a decent and unfairly-maligned adventure film. Cate Blanchett with black hair and a Russian uniform works for me. I can't readily explain why, but it just works for me.

E.T.: The Extra-Terrestrial
Great use of John Ford's The Quiet Man in this movie! On its own terms, E.T. works in a way that seems so effortless, but was quite well played. The camera is close to the ground for much of the movie, as if to portray things from a child's eyes or a short alien's eyes. On a more superficial level, this movie makes me want to tear through some Reese's Pieces.

Poltergeist
Yeah, Tobe Hooper was the director, but Spielberg's involvement is crucial, and every scene exudes Spielberg's childlike wonder. This really is one of the most killer horror films out there. I'm 42 years old, and the clown doll still freaks me out.

Jurassic Park
There's some unnecessary fluff in this one, and I would have preferred a more faithful adaptation of the Michael Crichton novel. A faithful adaptation would not have put record audiences in the seat, though, and this movie is so resplendent with its merchandising genius that I cannot help but appreciate the whole affair.
In truth, it's like the Tyrannosaurus Rex attack scene on the Jeep vehicles is the steak, and the rest of the movie is simply the side dishes. That Tyrannosaurus Rex scene is awesome and riveting enough to earn my respect. Even if Spielberg had never created anything other than this one sequence, he would still be my hero.

Schindler's List
I "enjoy" this movie in the sense that I love watching how Spielberg guides the viewer to the emotional gut-punch at the end. It's heavy-handed, but in a necessary way. Spielberg also makes keen use of some noir-esque shadowplay. I love the scene where the shadows obscure the Nazi official's eyes when he takes the diamond bribe from Schindler.

War of the Worlds
I consider this to be one of Spielberg's most underrated movies. I have always been a huge fan of the H.G. Wells source novel, and this movie captures the spirt of that story so well. The scene of the tripods emerging over a distant hill in the countryside by a river is exactly what I envisioned when I used to read the novel during childhood. Spielberg nails this H.G. Wells novel spot-on.

In all fairness, there's a good reason why I do not own several of Spielberg's other movies, but there are a few gaps that I'd like to fill. Saving Private Ryan is nowhere near as effective as Malick's The Thin Red Line, but it's a strong movie nonetheless.

It's strange, but the women in most of Spielberg's movies do not exude any real sex appeal at all. I do not know if this is simply because of Spielberg's intent to show movies from a boy's treehouse club perspective, where girls were not yet sexualized in our eyes, or if it's an intention to portray strong females that are not objectified. Karen Allen in Raiders of the Lost Ark is attractive to me simply because of her spunky nature, but she's not overtly sexualized. The sexiest female in a Spielberg movie is Cate Blanchett in Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Actually, the sexiest is Ashley Scott's purple-haired love android in A.I. Artificial Intelligence, but she's only shown for two seconds in the film.

[octagon]

Anybody who directed a Columbo is okay in my book.

[brandon_260]

For the most part, Spielberg doesn't interest me. I watched one Indiana Jones film and that was more than enough. Jaws and Minority Report are both stellar, and I had a fair amount of fun with Catch Me If You Can. Lincoln is a snore, Tintin was largely forgettable, and War of the Worlds and Munich are pretty heavy handed, if I remember correctly.

[bwdowiak]

Originally Posted by Coen

Any strong feelings, either for or against, the following:

Medium Cool
3 Women
A Man Escaped
Sweetie
Double Life of Veronique
Fish Tank

Medium Cool.. don't do it, man. just don't do it!
3 Women.. kind of a mind-f**k of a movie akin to Mulholland Drive. I really liked it.
A Man Escaped.. minimalist film.. focuses on the details of the escape. I loved it!
Double Life of Veronique.. it might be that I haven't dipped far enough into the collection, but to me that was one of the more art-y films in the collection. I did enjoy it, but wouldn't say that I'm in love with it. iScottie's avatar is from that movie.

haven't see the other 2

[Clare2904]

Originally Posted by ShellOilJunior

Mine is coming today from Family Video ($27 shipped).

I'm interested in reading the reviews from those watching it for the first time. My guess is some will love it and others will want to return it.

I am wondering how many will spot

[Show spoiler]the erect p***s at the start

[Ctzalman]

Originally Posted by Coen

Any strong feelings, either for or against, the following:

Medium Cool
3 Women
A Man Escaped
Sweetie
Double Life of Veronique
Fish Tank

i would say all are exceptional, although i have yet to see sweetie. i don't understand the nay-sayers on medium cool. if you like political cinema (or even meta-cinema), i'd say go for it. it starts off a little slow, but then all divergent plot lines come together.

if you're looking for what i like to call 'transcendental' cinema, pick up a man escaped or double life of veronique. those two (at least in my mind) tower over the others in their artistic merit and historical significance.

[jw007]

Originally Posted by jayembee

Welcome to the club! With two exceptions (Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull and Lincoln) I haven't watched a Spielberg film since Schindler's List.

I think his biggest flaw is being overly manipulative. All art is inherently manipulative, but a talented artist does it covertly. When I see a film by someone like Kubrick or Kurosawa or Lean or Huston, I see Oz the Great the Powerful. When I see a film by Spielberg, I see a man behind the curtain pulling levers and barking into a microphone.

A perfect example is E.T.: I realized what the problem was when I first saw the movie Airplane II: The Sequel later the same year (1982). There's a scene where passengers are arriving at the gate to board the moon shuttle. One group of passengers is a couple with their young son and his dog Scraps. The security guard says, "You're going to the moon?" and the boy answers, "Yes, and I'm taking my dog Scraps!" The guard replies, "Oh, I'm sorry, they don't allow dogs on the moon. We'll have to shoot him here," and he takes out his gun and shoots the dog. The dog collapses on the floor. The family is stunned. Tears start streaming down the boy's face. Then the guard says, "Ha ha, only kidding, just blanks!" Scraps gets back up and everyone laughs.

When Spielberg kills off E.T., wringing all kinds of emotion out of his audience, and then miraculously brings him back to life, I felt like he was saying to us, "Ha ha, only kidding, just blanks!" The way I see it, it's being contemptuous of his audience.

There are still some of his films that I think fondly of, like Empire of the Sun and Always, but I haven't seen them in a long time, and I'm almost afraid to revisit them.

At the moment, there are only a small handful of his films in my collection. I have the Blu-rays of Jaws and Lincoln (and as I mentioned some replies ago, I'm probably going to sell off the latter), and the Criterion LD of Close Encounters of the Third Kind. And courtesy of my wife, we have the Jurassic Park Trilogy and A.I. on DVD. Oh, and we have a Blu-ray of War Horse, which we got for Christmas.

You hit the ball out of the ballpark, no, galaxy, with this post!

I roared with laughter after reading that paragraph about Sparks the dog. You're totally f#cking right about that sir! Total Spielberg manipulation! And then, as another member wrote, when you remove the gags and stunts (or suspense and action), you don't have much left as a film (especially if its action-driven). To me, Spielberg is the capitulation of an amusement park ride. It's really exciting waiting, standing in line for this amazing thrill ride, and then you get on, it lasts 80 seconds and then its over, with nothing left to savor or remember. It's like a teenager's wet dream...no maybe for the first sexual experience for a young person. It's all action, stunts and thrills and nothing else.

Spielberg is the ultimate cinematic magician. He pulls rabbits out of hats (or sharks out of oceans) and then manipulates his audience with emotions and deception. He makes sure every movie of his ends well, or with a positive and meaningful note. We don't have Cassavetes' style abruptness or open endings in Spielberg films, oh no. Everything Spielberg does has a beginning, a middle and an ending.

As he continues barking into the microphone and making the magic work, my sanity can only deteriorate more and more after every take. Spare me, Spielberg. Spare me!

[I KEEL YOU]

Spielberg is waaay too lowest common denominator for my taste. There's no denying his skills as a movie maker, but his films aren't intellectually challenging. Kind of the opposite of David Cronenberg. I wish he had Spielberg's skills as a director, but still made movies about his bizarre subject matter.

Also, the fact that Spielberg is responsible for influencing Michael Bay and M. Night Shayamanalan who have forever contaminated the movie industry with their work is reason enough for me to dislike him.

[Ctzalman]

Originally Posted by Clare2904

I am wondering how many will spot

[Show spoiler]the erect p***s at the start

many years ago i picked up the UK tartan release (i'm talking back in the DVD days), found myself pretty intoxicated and popped in the disc. i immediately kind of fell asleep/passed out, but was awoken mid-opening sequence and was completely perplexed. at first i thought i'd gotten burned and bought some bootleg copy of the completely wrong film. the imagery kind of freaked me out, i couldn't comprehend exactly what the hell i was watching. but then the 'real' movie started and i was dumbstruck. can't give enough praise to persona

edit: speaking of which, my copy just arrived via amazon/ups. shipped in a bubble mailer, arrived in perfect shape. no dinged corners or anything!

[jrsl76]

Originally Posted by Coen

Any strong feelings, either for or against, the following:

Medium Cool
3 Women
A Man Escaped
Sweetie
Double Life of Veronique
Fish Tank

I still need to watch Sweetie and Veronique, but thoughts on the others are below:

Medium Cool: Penetrating look into a flashpoint in the 60s. Excellent film. Again, not one of my favorite Criterions, but still recommended.

3 Women: Strange, Psychedelic, almost Lynchian film of identity. Not one of my favorite Altman's but worthwhile.

A Man Escaped: Meticulous, tense prison escape movie. Superb and most highly recommended.

Fish Tank: A newer part of the great British tradition of social realism. Excellent performances and vibrant. Recommended.

[jw007]

Originally Posted by The Great Owl

It's strange, but the women in most of Spielberg's movies do not exude any real sex appeal at all. I do not know if this is simply because of Spielberg's intent to show movies from a boy's treehouse club perspective, where girls were not yet sexualized in our eyes, or if it's an intention to portray strong females that are not objectified. Karen Allen in Raiders of the Lost Ark is attractive to me simply because of her spunky nature, but she's not overtly sexualized. The sexiest female in a Spielberg movie is Cate Blanchett in Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Actually, the sexiest is Ashley Scott's purple-haired love android in A.I. Artificial Intelligence, but she's only shown for two seconds in the film.

YES! Great point. Great great point here. Has anyone else realized just how under-sexualized the women are in Spielberg's films? I truly think this 67 year old man is still almost as innocent as a 12 year old boy. Oh, how I fantasized seeing Cate Blanchett's character in Kingdom of the Crystal Skull to take off her pants. I dig those kind of sexy women in films as opposed to Kate Capshaw in The Temple of Doom. But what is up with Steven Allan Spielberg? Why does this director avoid mature and adult romance in his films? It seems like he never got out of the 1950s in terms of ethics and morality (which I admire). I suppose I highly respect him for avoiding the objectification of women. I'm sure plenty of feminists love Spielberg for his portrayal of women in his films. Maybe he made a secret pact with many of these feminists back in the 1970s so he wouldn't offend them ever. Okay, I'm not allowed to get political here. Must stay on cinema topics (I don't want to get banned or anything). Anyway, good post.

[smoss469]

Originally Posted by Coen

Any strong feelings, either for or against, the following:

Medium Cool
3 Women
A Man Escaped
Sweetie
Double Life of Veronique
Fish Tank

The only one I've seen is A Man Escaped. I can HIGHLY recommend it. It's very well made, rooted in history and based on actual escape techniques. Also, something that is very odd for a movie of that nature is that

[Show spoiler]there really isn't an antagonist. In every prison movie I've ever seen there's a sadistic warden, a nut job guard or a homicidal inmate. This movie doesn't have any of those and is still an attention grabber!

[Scottie]

I just watched Persona and I don't know what to say!

I think it's the most mesmerizing psychological thriller that I've ever seen and while I have no idea how to interpret it, I absolutely loved it!

Originally Posted by Coen

Any strong feelings, either for or against, the following:

Medium Cool
3 Women
A Man Escaped
Sweetie
Double Life of Veronique
Fish Tank

I've seen all of those except for Sweetie and I recommend them all.

The Double Life of Veronique is my favorite film of all time and 3 Women and Fish Tank are up there as some of the best I've seen, too.

A Man Escaped and Medium Cool are also both good films, but I would go with the other 3 first.

[SilentDawn]

Originally Posted by Roninblues

No love for Empire of the Sun ?

Great film, but sadly underrated and under-appreciated.